Would you draw in this situation?

This is a discussion on Would you draw in this situation? within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; If I remember correctly,the news stated the "attacker" is a dentist!I wonder how he treats his patients?...

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Thread: Would you draw in this situation?

  1. #31
    Distinguished Member Array mr.stuart's Avatar
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    If I remember correctly,the news stated the "attacker" is a dentist!I wonder how he treats his patients?

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  3. #32
    Distinguished Member Array Anubis's Avatar
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    Looks like the non-dentist may have been double-parked. If so, first mistake. Getting out of the car to physically confront a much larger pissed-off person was the obvious second mistake. Sister getting out to push the guy was really stupid.

    The dentist was way out of line, but the other participants fueled his fire. Stay in the car, call for help or drive away!

  4. #33
    Member Array Puppy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TerryD View Post
    I would have to say...no. But unlike previous posts, it would be a consideration.

    Just like the good guy in the video, he seems like he is pretty healthy, which he probably is. But I have severe lower back issues. If I hit the asphalt, I could be wheelchair bound for the rest of my life.

    What if he has such issues also?

    Just because he looks healthy, doesn't mean he is.

    Just trying to look at the situation a little differently.
    Finally. Most of the response here are obviously fairly young healthy guys. At my age and heart condition simply being shoved around could spike my blood pressure and be fatal. I will start with pepper spray,...........

  5. #34
    Member Array DrSal's Avatar
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    A simple No....

  6. #35
    Member Array steve63's Avatar
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    I agree to not draw my sidearm. Once he lays hands on you, that is assualt and you act accordingly to stop the aggression. I don't mean to draw on him, but I will not be pushed around. Talking trash is one thing, assault is another.

  7. #36
    Distinguished Member Array Pro2A's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by peacefuljeffrey View Post
    you clearly did not feel your life was in danger, hence were not justified in drawing.
    True, and I'm not saying i'd draw either... but what if I don't feel like getting my butt beat by this guy? Or want to watch others get beat, do you just let him go about hitting people? I think drawing in this situation would stop him dead in his tracks and you could hold him at bay until officers arrived.

  8. #37
    VIP Member Array simon's Avatar
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    Pro2A...you are not a LEO,just because you have a ccw permit, it does not entitle you to administer your own street justice or "hold him till officers arrive"....you best know when to walk away,and be a good witness...

  9. #38
    Distinguished Member Array Pro2A's Avatar
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    I 100% Agree, but there are also a lot of cases in which CCW holders hold BG's at bay until police arrive and are commended for it. It would be no different then drawing if someone was robbing a bank you were in or if you were in your home and someone intruded. While firing the weapon is a last resort if your life is in harm, I don't see the harm in drawing to halt an attack, robbery, intrusion or what have you. If people are being attacked and knocked down by a crazed man, who knows what he will do next. And most of CCW holders I'm sure only carry a gun and probably don't have pepper spray, tazer or other non-lethal weapons on hand too.

  10. #39
    Member Array taggart's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Janq View Post
    Oh snap that was his sister?!!!I wouldn't have shot him but I would have engaged and asked for his dance card.

    - Janq

    I LOVE that quote!
    Taggart Snyder
    Man about town...

  11. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pro2A View Post
    I 100% Agree, but there are also a lot of cases in which CCW holders hold BG's at bay until police arrive and are commended for it. It would be no different then drawing if someone was robbing a bank you were in or if you were in your home and someone intruded. While firing the weapon is a last resort if your life is in harm, I don't see the harm in drawing to halt an attack, robbery, intrusion or what have you. If people are being attacked and knocked down by a crazed man, who knows what he will do next. And most of CCW holders I'm sure only carry a gun and probably don't have pepper spray, tazer or other non-lethal weapons on hand too.
    There is a world of difference. The bank robbery and home invasion scenarios involve violent felonies, and most likely involve the threat of deadly force or great bodily harm.

    This dentist, while a first-rate idiot, has committed a couple instances of simple battery (a misdemeanor) and had not made any threat of death or great bodily harm.

    There is absolutely no justification to elevate this to a deadly force scenario.

    But carry it out a but further for the sake of argument. You decide to draw down on this bozo, and he tells you to stick it up your posterior. Will you now shoot him?

    What if he grabs for your gun and you end up shooting him? Who do you think the police will look at as the initiator of the armed conflict?

    In all seriousness, Pro2A, there is absolutely no justification here for drawing a firearm. In all probability, the person drawing the gun would face far more serious charges that the idiot dentist.

    Matt
    Battle Plan (n) - a list of things that aren't going to happen if you are attacked.
    Blame it on Sixto - now that is a viable plan.

  12. #41
    Member Array stoneypete's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pro2A View Post
    This guy is being really belligerent and unruly, but doesnt appear to be major threat to anyones life... but is definitely mad.
    No.
    'The assailant chooses the time, location and method of attack.

    Since they are unlikely to let you know ahead of time when, where and how violent they're going to be, you should always be prepared.' - matiki

  13. #42
    Distinguished Member Array Pro2A's Avatar
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    he doesn't appear... but you never know if he is packing a gun or other deadly weapon

  14. #43
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    You don't know if anyone you pass on the street is packing a gun or other deadly weapon. Does this mean you should have your gun in hand at all times?

    Again, he's not posed any deadly threat to anyone. He's a class-A idiot, but he has done nothing that would remotely justify your escalating the situation to an armed conflict.

    Matt
    Battle Plan (n) - a list of things that aren't going to happen if you are attacked.
    Blame it on Sixto - now that is a viable plan.

  15. #44
    Member Array crankshop1000's Avatar
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    Notice how at the end the jerk was put in cuffs by the cop that witnessed the incident.You pull your gun and the nice cop will take you too, or shoot you as a threat.

  16. #45
    VIP Member Array packinnova's Avatar
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    I completely agree that there's no legal recourse as to elevating to lethal force, however, I do have a few comments that need mention.

    Watching from the beginning of the video (which lacks the beginning of the encounter), you'll notice that the driver being assaulted is effectively blocked in. I've noticed a number of responses here where folks adamantly state that getting out of the vehicle was his mistake. I have to take a differing opinion based on his surroundings. Whether he was parked properly, double-parked, parked illegally, or whatever doesn't matter. He couldn't go anywhere with the attacker parked behind him in the middle of the road and the large SUV in front of him.

    That said...how many times have we seen folks have their windows smashed and dragged out through it? I'd say plenty. He had no where to go IN the vehicle. Simple fact is that if you can't drive away to escape in your vehicle it effectively can become your coffin if you stay in it. Personally I'd rather get out before the attacker got there so I could either take on my attacker if necessary or bug out if possible. Try defending yourself (WITH NON-LETHAL) means from INSIDE a car. It doesn't work so well. You definitely won't be posting about your experience afterwards, because you'll either be in ICU or 6' under.
    "My God David, We're a Civilized society."

    "Sure, As long as the machines are workin' and you can call 911. But you take those things away, you throw people in the dark, and you scare the **** out of them; no more rules...You'll see how primitive they can get."
    -The Mist (2007)

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