Robbery going down with your kid inside - Page 3

Robbery going down with your kid inside

This is a discussion on Robbery going down with your kid inside within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; First, call 911!!!!! Now, if this CVS is like most, the main cash register is in the front and the pharmacy is in the very ...

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  1. #31
    VIP Member Array obxned's Avatar
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    First, call 911!!!!!

    Now, if this CVS is like most, the main cash register is in the front and the pharmacy is in the very back. If they are only hitting the store for the cash in the front, then they will be back out and gone by the time you've called 911.

    More likely, they are after money and drugs, so one BG will have to control the front entrance, while the other goes to the very back of the store. Not a good situation for one armed citizen, particularly with a third BG just outside. Probably the best course is to stay close to the entrance without appearing to be anything more that just another shopper in condition white.

    If the BGs come out without firing a shot, then just be a good witness. If shots are fired, then I would render their driver unable to drive or provide support to his buddies, and see what happens next. At that point, rushing in the door would probably be a bad move. It would either get you very dead or create a hostage situation with your daughter as hostage.
    "If we loose Freedom here, there's no place to escape to. This is the Last Place on Earth!" Ronald Reagan


  2. #32
    Member Array harley91's Avatar
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    My kid is in there? I call 911...give address of location, description of car, license plate--and I'm going inside...I'll leave my phone on, connected to 911....find my kid and head out a fire/emergency door, alarms be damned, checking my 6 the whole time. If BGs have a problem with me leaving, I will let them know I disagree...and then reload.

    Not realistic? Well, if it comes down to it--that's my plan. There is no way in he!! I'm leaving my kid in there to be a hostage/victim.

    +2
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  3. #33
    VIP Member Array SIGguy229's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BikerRN View Post
    This goes against the "grain" of this thread but I would not go in.

    Why would I want to escalate a "no shots fired" robbery in to a "shots fired" robbery? Chances are the robbery will go down with no shots fired. If that changes I will respond appropriately.
    Biker
    Sounds like you are putting your faith in BGs to do the "right thing"...I don't trust BGs...at all.

    "Chance are..." I would rather not gamble with my kid's life ....If you wait until shots are fired, you are already too late.

    Again...my point would be to get my kid out of the store, not play gunfight at the OK Corral....I don't care about the other customers....just my kid. If others want to follow me out of the store...fine. But I'm not there to rescue anyone else except MY kid. I would prefer if there were no shots fired, but then again....that isn't MY decision.
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  4. #34
    Ex Member Array BikerRN's Avatar
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    No, I'm not trusting the BG's to "do the right thing".

    Once my Daughter is inside the store with the BG's she no longer is my Daughter. She is a potential hostage and victim. Maybe you can't "turn it off" like that, but I can and have. My wife and I have had long talks regarding these type of scenarios due to my occupation and former occupation.

    What I do know is that statistically I'm better off, and so is my Daughter, if I do not interject myself in to the scene. Like I said, this depends on if I hear shots being fired or not. If I do go in I fully expect to be in a gunfight and to probably die. Real life isn't the movies. As much as we want to play "Bruce Willis" or some other celluloid hero, it just isn't smart.

    I will let the robbery go down and not alert the badguys to me or my family. If I hear shots fired then the gameplan has changed. For those of you advocating going in, how many of you have the "capability"?

    Here's a little test for you:

    3 Targets, 5 Yards, 7 Yards and 10 Yards, one to two yards between targets.
    From the leather draw and place one shot in the head on each target
    Total allowed time 4 seconds.

    Did you get all head shots in the A Zone? You pass.
    Did you miss, run out of time or hit the target outside the A Zone? You died, GAME OVER.

    Before you go barging in to a situation you better know your capabilities and evaluate them honestly. Your life, or someone you love may depend on it.

    Biker

  5. #35
    Member Array mattd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by grady View Post
    I may get chastised for this, but I'm drawing my gun, covering it by taking off my jacket so no one can see, and I'm going in right then. I'll look like just another customer to the BG's.

    If I have time for phone calls to warn her and notify the police, that's good. But I'm going in, period, and I'm not waiting. I'll pretend to be an unassuming customer right up until I do what needs to be done, whether that is finding her and taking her out the back, or removing the threat altogether.

    It'll be a cold day in hell before I leave my daughter inside a store alone with armed BG's, regardless of whether it costs me my life or not. I'll have the element of surprise, and the element of determination. Protection of my family is my primary reason for being on this earth, and I'm not going to shy away from it because I might get hurt. Escalate the situation? If needed to save her life, you betcha.

    I couldn't live with myself if I stayed outside calling the police, and my child was killed. I'm going in now, without hesitation.

    Easy call.
    + 10

  6. #36
    VIP Member Array Rob72's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BikerRN View Post
    No, I'm not trusting the BG's to "do the right thing".

    Once my Daughter is inside the store with the BG's she no longer is my Daughter. She is a potential hostage and victim. Maybe you can't "turn it off" like that, but I can and have. My wife and I have had long talks regarding these type of scenarios due to my occupation and former occupation.

    What I do know is that statistically I'm better off, and so is my Daughter, if I do not interject myself in to the scene. Like I said, this depends on if I hear shots being fired or not.

    Before you go barging in to a situation you better know your capabilities and evaluate them honestly. Your life, or someone you love may depend on it.

    Biker
    Generally, I agree and do indeed understand (re, what I said: how "serious" the BGs appear to be.) Point being, if you hear shots, you're reeaally playing catch up.

  7. #37
    VIP Member Array paramedic70002's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rob72 View Post
    shoot the driver with a quick volley to the head & chest,
    That was my first thought. Of course I'd probably go to jail.
    "Each worker carried his sword strapped to his side." Nehemiah 4:18

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  8. #38
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    Just a short statement , My kid or Grandkids. I am going in and try to look like i an a sheep. with (3) combat tours in cbt arms . I a better than even odds to get my kids out. At the very least unhurt,My life be damned.
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  9. #39
    VIP Member Array SIGguy229's Avatar
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    I've been tested...and tried....so let's not go there....I've proven my capabilities....and can pull (and have pulled) the trigger when needed.

    However, my goal is to get in, get my kid, and then get out ...if while I am in there they decide to start something, I'm still headed for an emergency exit....
    Magazine <> clip - know the difference

    martyr is a fancy name for crappy fighter
    You have never lived until you have almost died. For those that have fought for it, life has a special flavor the protected will never know

  10. #40
    Senior Member Array walvord's Avatar
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    I'm guessing the driver is still in the car watching the entrance. Someone inside may still be watching the entrance also. So, first thing I do is call my daughter to inform her of what is going on and to get to the back of the store and get down. The BGs will probably just be at the front of the store where the cash registers are still being able to see the entrance. I'm thinking the first GG person in or out of that entrance is going to get toasted. I get a description of the car, the plate number, what the driver looks like, and what the assailants look like coming out of the store. If I hear the cops coming, I might, depending on the situation at hand try and place my vehicle in front of the BGs car - but it would depend on what I'm observing and whether I'm in my Honda or my F-150.
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  11. #41
    VIP Member Array BigEFan's Avatar
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    First, I don't have kids and I am not about to assume that I know what the awesome responsibility of being a parent is like. So for the purposes of this thread I am going to substitute the daughter for my condition white wife.

    Plain and simple I am going in. No John Rambo stuff but I am going in. I share with several others that I will go in like a normal customer, probably with the gun drawn but with the coat thrown over the arm so that it is not visible.

    When I get in I have one mission and one mission only, locate my wife and ensure her safety. No apologies, the rest of the people are on their own. If there is a back door, I will find it. If not I will evade and elude until it is absolutely not possible at which point I will engage the BG's in a manner that will draw them away from my wife, even if that means jeopardizing my own life.

    I really don't see how this is an argument. Maybe I am just closed minded.

    Edit: I re-read some of the responses about not going in. I understand your concerns about not going in and yes you are right by going in it becomes more likely that I will die. That is ok with me. Don't get me wrong I don't want to die but I am willing to if it is worth it. I just couldn't rationalize sitting outside praying the BG's don't harm my loved one. I can't, and won't count on someone, especially thugs, to do the right thing. I guess I would rather die on my feet that live on my knees. Just my approach to life and yours may differ.
    Lex et Libertas Semper Vigilo, Fortis, Paratus, et Fidelis!

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  12. #42
    Senior Member Array digitalexplr's Avatar
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    The problem with going is that almost everyone is assuming they will find their child/spouse with little effort. This of course just might not be possible. Also, you may well get your child/spouse out, but cause the death of others.

    The guy in the car may be on the phone with one of the BG's inside. And in today's world they probably are in constant communication. They will know you are coming. You will not know where they are. They will know where you are. You may think you are not being obvious in your intent. The BG in the car may just be better at judging body language than you think.

    And what makes you think the BG in the car may not just follow you in if he is suspicious of you?

    Interjecting yourself may sound good. It may make you feel good that you are more than willing to lay you life on the line for your family. But the results may well be far from what you had hoped for and other parents kids may be left bleeding on the floor. But then that's not your problem is it?

  13. #43
    VIP Member Array grady's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigEFan View Post
    I can't, and won't count on someone, especially thugs, to do the right thing.
    Well said. Neither will I trust my life or the life of a loved one to the mood or whim of some BG.

  14. #44
    VIP Member Array farronwolf's Avatar
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    First of all, since my child is only 4 they wouldn't be walking in the store by themselves. This is a good reason to make the teenager, wife, whomever walk from the parked car along with you. Exercise never hurt anyone that I know of.

    Now back to the scenario. I would probably go into the store to get my wife, or child in this case. First would be a brief call the police to let them know the situation and any description I could give them, type of car, license plate whatever. I don't think I would call my family member simply because it could trigger bad reactions from either the family member or the BG if they were in the vacinity of the call coming in. If the BG is near the family member, you can rest assured that the family member knows what is happening.

    I would like others have suggested make an entrance in an ordianary customer shopping way without drawing attention to myself, while assessing the situation to find the best possible solution with the least or no shots fired. Lots would depend on where the BG's were and what they were doing in relation to my family members and other store occupants. Are they hopped up on some type of narcotic and in the store looking for more, many many things that we would just have to play as we saw it, if we are ones that make the descision to go into the store.
    Just remember that shot placement is much more important with what you carry than how big a bang you get with each trigger pull.
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  15. #45
    VIP Member Array Janq's Avatar
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    I've read every response in this thread and to be completely honest, this scenario is _exactly_ the one that concerns me the most toward real life happenings as per my own specific families life and activities and community.
    The location could be CVS, Target, WalMart, or the supermarket (Whole Foods).

    I do not know what I'd do.

    My kids are 5 and 1 yrs. old and are always with my wife.
    My wife doesn't ever carry her cell and when she does most often the battery is dead anyway or the phone off. Calling her is a no go option.
    She is very much a condition white type.

    I think I'd snap choose to go in, but I'm not 100&#37; sure on that.

    From that decision point forward it's all seat of the pants observe, react, take cover/concealment, reload, observe, repeat...

    Here is my concern though.
    What if in the event of my taking action and 'going in' some other person(s) are injured who are fellow citizens. Innocents?
    My family is okay but now someone else family member(s) has been injured or killed as part and parcel of the subsequent activities that the BGs take upon my injecting myself in an active to the math.
    How do I deal with that personally, inside? How does the law (and a jury) see me and my actions? How do i look the other injured/dead person(s) in the eye and/or their family, and explain to them I went in _and_ acted for purposes of protecting my own fully acknowledging there is/was great risk overall? How would they, you, receive me to that end as you or yours is being carried away on a stretcher by an EMT or coroner as a result of my actions?

    This scenario is very real as based on real world situation results.
    The answer is not simple to my eye as to what to do, what not to do, and how to go about making a decision for or against.

    The Blockbuster scenario as referenced on page one was an excellent example toward this.
    This scenario is for me and I suspect others a very difficult situation to call, and we all love or wives and children just as much as the next citizen.

    - Janq just isn't sure
    "Killers who are not deterred by laws against murder are not going to be deterred by laws against guns. " - Robert A. Levy

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