What would you do? - Page 2

What would you do?

This is a discussion on What would you do? within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; His threat of deadly force invokes the only reply that is fitting. A matched set of 40 cal JHP's....

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  1. #16
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    His threat of deadly force invokes the only reply that is fitting. A matched set of 40 cal JHP's.


  2. #17
    Member Array Picketeer's Avatar
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    Let him have it with all you got!

  3. #18
    Distinguished Member Array sniper58's Avatar
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    No hesitation - 2-3 shots COM and a fresh magazine in the well. The BG has already started an armed robbery. I don't want to find out how fast he is or if the gun is a fake. He's gone.
    Tim
    BE PREPARED - Noah didn't build the Ark when it was raining!
    Si vis pacem, para bellum
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  4. #19
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    He has a gun, he gets shot! No doubt in my mind. Death is an occupational hazard in the mugging business.
    It is surely true that you can lead a horse to water but you can't make them drink. Nor can you make them grateful for your efforts.

  5. #20
    VIP Member Array obxned's Avatar
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    Bad guy pays the 'stupid' tax.
    "If we loose Freedom here, there's no place to escape to. This is the Last Place on Earth!" Ronald Reagan

  6. #21
    VIP Member Array KenpoTex's Avatar
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    shoot him.
    "Being a predator isn't always comfortable but the only other option is to be prey. That is not an acceptable option." ~Phil Messina

    If you carry in Condition 3, you have two empty chambers. One in the weapon...the other between your ears.

    Matt K.

  7. #22
    Member Array MadDog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by atctimmy View Post
    He has a gun, he gets shot! No doubt in my mind. Death is an occupational hazard in the mugging business.
    Nicely put
    I believe in gun control...... Thats why I use TWO hands.

  8. #23
    VIP Member Array glock27mark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MattLarson View Post
    I may not take the shot immediately, but I'd definitely draw on him and communicate as appropriate.

    His call at that point whether he gets shot or not.

    Matt
    coundn't agree with ya more. bg's intentions have already
    been made.
    (SHERIFF BUFORD T. JUSTICE) "what the hell is
    the world coming too"

    NRA LIFE MEMBER

    U.S. ARMY FT.SILL, OKLA.

  9. #24
    Senior Member Array rhinokrk's Avatar
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    He's now in a gun fight, odds are he'll lose. If you're going to start a fight Good or bad, you should put yourself in a postion to win... pull and shoot.
    Quote Originally Posted by MattLarson View Post
    I may not take the shot immediately, but I'd definitely draw on him and communicate as appropriate.

    His call at that point whether he gets shot or not.

    Matt
    That's a good way to get shot, poor tactics. IMO
    Get the U.N. out of the U.S.
    Get the U.S. out of the U.N.

  10. #25
    Member Array ld13's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by atctimmy View Post
    He has a gun, he gets shot! No doubt in my mind. Death is an occupational hazard in the mugging business.
    I agree, can't argue with that.

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by rhinokrk View Post
    He's now in a gun fight, odds are he'll lose. If you're going to start a fight Good or bad, you should put yourself in a postion to win... pull and shoot.

    That's a good way to get shot, poor tactics. IMO
    Depends on what he does when I draw on him.

    By communicate, I don't mean discussing his life story from DNA up until lunch.

    If his hand moves toward the gun, he's communicated all that needs be said. Multiple rounds to COM while moving off the X is the only response there.

    If, OTOH, he puts his hands up, there's neither a need nor a justification to shoot.

    I'm not suggesting pouring some tea and having a chat here. I'm suggesting evaluating the BG's response to my drawing and letting that evaluation decide whether this is a draw, or a draw and fire.

    In other words, just because he has a gun in his waistband does not, IMHO, justify shooting him simply because he has a gun in his waistband.

    Matt
    Battle Plan (n) - a list of things that aren't going to happen if you are attacked.
    Blame it on Sixto - now that is a viable plan.

  12. #27
    VIP Member Array Sticks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MattLarson View Post
    Depends on what he does when I draw on him.

    By communicate, I don't mean discussing his life story from DNA up until lunch.

    If his hand moves toward the gun, he's communicated all that needs be said. Multiple rounds to COM while moving off the X is the only response there.

    If, OTOH, he puts his hands up, there's neither a need nor a justification to shoot.

    I'm not suggesting pouring some tea and having a chat here. I'm suggesting evaluating the BG's response to my drawing and letting that evaluation decide whether this is a draw, or a draw and fire.

    In other words, just because he has a gun in his waistband does not, IMHO, justify shooting him simply because he has a gun in his waistband.

    Matt
    OK, he puts his hands up, now what are you going to do?

    You have standing before you a BG with a gun in the waistband and his hands in the air, your hands and attention are occupied.

    Every second you stand there contemplating, he is switching the roles and is working on getting out of the situation and most likely going to try to get the gun and shoot you while you are getting distracted or complacent. You lost your advantage.

    #1 - You change focus to go for your cell to call 911 - can you say "Attention Deficit"?

    A. - You do succeed in making the call, you dare not let him move (toward you, walk away...), now you have to wait for the LEO to hopefully arrive sometime in the next 1/2 hour. Meanwhile, to the next passerby, you are in all appearances the BG. Hope the next CC holder is trained and not jumpy.

    B. - While you take your off hand to get your phone and try to dial 911 by brail (are you sure that was 911, or the send button? Hopefully you have 911 on speed dial), he draws and shoots you because you are not 100% focused on him.

    #2 - He starts to either back off or run away.

    A. - You let him go (a BG with a gun), call 911 to report the incident and go about your business. He waits for a little then comes back after you, this time to kill you the first opportunity he gets.

    B. - You let him go, call 911 and wait for a LEO to show up (again, hopefully within the next 1/2 hour). I hope you sought out some cover.

    C. - The list goes on and on...

    #3. - You decide to disarm him and hold him for the police.

    A. - Are you trained to do this?

    B. - Have you done this before?

    C. - This is not Hollywood.

    Again I ask;

    OK, he puts his hands up, now what are you going to do?
    Sticks

    Grasseater // Grass~eat~er noun, often attributive \ˈgras-ē-tər\
    A person who is incapable of independent thought; a person who is herd animal-like in behavior; one who cannot distinguish between right and wrong; a foolish person.
    See also Sheep

  13. #28
    VIP Member Array KenpoTex's Avatar
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    good post Sticks.

    Quote Originally Posted by MattLarson View Post
    ...In other words, just because he has a gun in his waistband does not, IMHO, justify shooting him simply because he has a gun in his waistband.
    We're not talking about just seeing some guy who had a "lapse of concealment."

    We've got a guy who has already communicated that his intent is to rob us and if that's not enough, he has displayed a weapon. He didn't show it to us so we could admire the stocks, he displayed it to put us in fear so that we would comply with his demands. We now have every reason to be in fear of serious injury and/or death. As a result, there is no reason that I can see for us not to immediately respond with deadly force to stop the threat of deadly force.
    "Being a predator isn't always comfortable but the only other option is to be prey. That is not an acceptable option." ~Phil Messina

    If you carry in Condition 3, you have two empty chambers. One in the weapon...the other between your ears.

    Matt K.

  14. #29
    Member Array GHFLRLTD's Avatar
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    Capability and Intent

    Mr. BG has established both. If you are in a state like Florida (or Mississippi) that allows you to met force with equal force and does not demand retreat, draw and stop the threat.

    Then call 911, and keep the gun pointed at Mr. BG until the police arrive. Make sure that Mr. BG does not have backup.
    George H. Foster
    Orlando, Florida

  15. #30
    VIP Member Array Sticks's Avatar
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    Thanks KenpoTex.

    I've been in this type of situation (somewhat) too many times when I was a patch wearer and would chase down other stupid riders or cars that either rode through our group, or all but ran one of my brothers or sisters off the road.

    I could out ride everyone in my group, and by the time I caught the offender(s) my backup was 3+ minutes out, and all I could think was "Great, now what?"



    JAM was satisfied in the OP scenario. Not as clean a shoot as would be preferred, but doable, and survivable in court.
    Sticks

    Grasseater // Grass~eat~er noun, often attributive \ˈgras-ē-tər\
    A person who is incapable of independent thought; a person who is herd animal-like in behavior; one who cannot distinguish between right and wrong; a foolish person.
    See also Sheep

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