From Bad to Worse: The Unthinkable

This is a discussion on From Bad to Worse: The Unthinkable within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I'd do my best to keep a hand on the weapon, at least pointing the muzzle away from me or vital areas. that while doing ...

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Thread: From Bad to Worse: The Unthinkable

  1. #31
    Senior Member Array rhinokrk's Avatar
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    I'd do my best to keep a hand on the weapon, at least pointing the muzzle away from me or vital areas. that while doing my best to touch the back of his skull through the eye socket with the thumb that isn't trying to control the weapon.
    Get the U.N. out of the U.S.
    Get the U.S. out of the U.N.

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  3. #32
    VIP Member Array semperfi.45's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sergeant Mac View Post
    Real fights are free-for-alls. They are fast, close, and sloppy. Precision goes out the window as soon as the adrenaline valves go full-bore, free-flow open.
    +1 real fights are ugly. I say in training that everyone has a plan until they get punched in the nose. Food for thought though, I think a lot of people think they can fight or "take" a guy and are not true to themselves about their fighting skill in a situation like Lima posted.

    Lima, a great video is Southnarcs Fighting Handgun.

    I've ranted before about how I believe if you carry a gun you should have an unarmed skillset. It could be detrimental to introduce a handgun in a close quarters confrontation.

    I've been training in CDT (Compliance. Direction, Takedown) for 10 years now. It focuses on non deadly force and last resort disarms using pain compliance. It is the most effective system I have ever seen. You really don't need to break wood and do flying kicks to fight. Think about wrist locks, joint locks,arm bars, and pressure points.

    For some the best bet might be to run away very fast.
    Training means learning the rules. Experience means learning the exceptions.

  4. #33
    Ron
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    Obviously, we would all try to not let that happen, but the hypo states that it did, we lost our gun to the BG. Now what? I think that the only thing to do is to immediately attack with all of your force and skill. Depending upon where you are yelling at the same time might help. I think running is a bad option, unless cover is very close.

    All in all, a very bad situation to be in.

    Ron
    "It does not do to leave a dragon out of your calculations, if you live near him."

    J. R. R. Tolkien

  5. #34
    VIP Member Array HKinNY's Avatar
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    I have taken a Krav Maga class and got one of the greatest workouts of my life.I suggest that everybody take a least 1 class. Check out International Krav Maga Federation. Offiical Site. They are several branches of the KM tree. The attackers should never get that close but if they do KM is the way to go. KM was designed to help the Isreali Army. One of the great armies in the planet. For a small area on the map they take a beating everyday and keep coming back for more.

  6. #35
    Distinguished Member Array bandit383's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by StevePVB View Post
    Respectfully, have you? Some folks on this forum have. Also, I think the answer was practical. Better to do something than nothing.
    Yes. I think Sgt explained it far far more clearly than I. Speed and leverage is the key as well...wrestlers understand this...I didn't say do nothing...you can not let the BG get the weapon...period.

    Rick

  7. #36
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    Attempt to keep a hand on my weapon, so the BG can't use it on me. Practice my foot stomps, knee to the groin and try to get my knife into play!

  8. #37
    Member Array chuck brick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ArmedAviator View Post
    Chuck, any chance of you getting us a sample sound bite of that banshee scream?
    Sorry, it's copyrighted.
    Think of the classic aggressive Karate "Ki-Ya!," but add a hefty dose of anger laced with generous portions of raw fear. You'll figger it out.

    Stay safe,

    Chuck Brick.
    Why do I use 230 gr. for my .45acp?
    Because I can't find a source of 250 gr!
    http://chucksrantings.blogspot.com/

  9. #38
    Senior Member Array dunndw's Avatar
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    Toes
    knee
    groin
    gut
    neck

    those are the parts of the bg I want to introduce to my boot...in that order. all while trying to back my gun with whatever parts of him are still attached to it
    "If I was an extremist, our founding fathers would all be extremists," he said. "Without them, we wouldn't have our independence. We'd be a disarmed British system of feudal subjectivity."

  10. #39
    Senior Member Array Cthulhu's Avatar
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    My Filipino martial arts instructor is also my firearms instructor, for all intents and purposes, and we do cover weapon retention and disarms.

    -JT

  11. #40
    Member Array gotammo's Avatar
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    If their that close you should increase the distance or leave the gun wear it is.
    Once disarmed your choices are limited in that situation your better off giving them your wallet.

  12. #41
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    All I'll add is, if you dont have superior hand strength you dont have anything.

    Spend all the time and ammo you want on the range, but when it gets ugly, your grip is what will save your life.
    "Just blame Sixto"

  13. #42
    VIP Member Array KenpoTex's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gotammo View Post
    If their that close you should increase the distance or leave the gun wear it is.
    Once disarmed your choices are limited in that situation your better off giving them your wallet.
    I disagree...In the situation that we've been discussing, he's done something threatening enough for us to draw our weapon. Somehow he's gotten it from us at this point, I don't see him being satisfied with just our wallet.

    In other words, the fight is on...EITHER WIN OR DIE!
    "Being a predator isn't always comfortable but the only other option is to be prey. That is not an acceptable option." ~Phil Messina

    If you carry in Condition 3, you have two empty chambers. One in the weapon...the other between your ears.

    Matt K.

  14. #43
    Senior Member Array ridurall's Avatar
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    I'm too fat to run, so they better beat me to death with an empty gun because that is the only way they are going to get their hands on it.
    Life member NRA since 1983
    I carry a Kimber Ultra Carry II in a Crossbreed SuperTuck. My wife carries a Walther PPS .40 w/Crossbreed holster.

  15. #44
    Distinguished Member Array bandit383's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SIXTO View Post
    All I'll add is, if you dont have superior hand strength you dont have anything.

    Spend all the time and ammo you want on the range, but when it gets ugly, your grip is what will save your life.
    It does bring up an interesting point...I wonder how many here have practiced this scenario with say a rubber gun or knife...now that is where you will learn the most...and see some of the points being made.

    Rick

  16. #45
    Distinguished Member Array Reborn's Avatar
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    Those who have trained in LEO classes have done some type of weapon retention class. Get you a partner and a toy gun and a friend and see how long you CAN'T last.
    Psalms 144:1
    Blessed be the Lord my strength, which teacheth my hands to war, and my fingers to fight.
    Senior Instructor for Tactical and Defensive of Texas
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