This is a discussion on Plan B? within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Here is something to think about. Although we live in THE greatest nation in the world, this country has its problems. One of those problems ...
April 9th, 2008 03:35 PM
Here is something to think about. Although we live in THE greatest nation in the world, this country has its problems. One of those problems is that not everyone believes that we should have the right to bear arms. It comes as no surprise that with thousands of guns laws on the books across the nation, not one has made even the slightest mentionable dent in the rise of criminal activities. In fact, the presence of guns is the only reason crime hasn’t risen higher than it has.
So many people are gun centric in their personal defense skills, that without the gun they are pretty much hopeless. My question to those of you who have limited your self-defense options to the use of a firearm, what are you going to do once firearms are no longer present in this country? Let’s face it, a gun ban is inevitable, but that is a whole different thread.
For those of you who don’t believe that a gun ban which disarms the entire country is possible “because this is America and nothing like that can happen here”, I will play your little game. But here is a twist… what are you going to do if your state does not allow CCW/CHL permits anymore? Is that a possibility? You bet it is.
Whatever age you are right now, 10 years from now where are you going to be in regards to your abilities to defend yourself? Are you going to still be relying on a gun that may or may not be present? Or, are you investing your time in a good unarmed self defense program? All the firearms training in the world is not going to help you if you don’t carry on a daily basis, or if guns are banned!!!
Too many people place their salvation on the use of a gun. This is not a good thing to do! You should NEVER place all of your eggs in one basket!
ALWAYS have a plan B!!! How many of you TRULY have a plan B? You have to be honest with YOURSELF!
A warrior does not limit their options but rather increases their options for use in combat. If you do not have well rounded skills in unarmed combatives, then quite honestly you do not really have a plan to succeed in a fight. Remember, a gun is only a tool, not the solution!
It is unfortunate that those who carry handguns have a false sense of security when it comes to personal safety. All of the firearms training in the world does not mean that you are prepared for any or most confrontations. If what you are basing your survival on is the presence of your gun and your “abilities” with that gun, you are limiting your chances of survival because in the real world, things never go as planned, and you might not ever have a chance to attempt to use your gun. Even if you do use your gun and actually hit what you are aiming at, what are you going to do if and when the threat(s) is still coming?
With all of the things mentioned in mind, WHAT is YOUR plan B? Plan B may very quickly become plan A.
April 9th, 2008 03:49 PM
I would never advocate intentionally breaking any law. However, as long as the Second Amendment still stands, and reads "...being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed" I WILL NOT surrender my weapons to any authority, period. I have great places to hide them if need be.
Originally Posted by Brian@ITC
In all honesty? I'd move. Out of the country if necessary; the direction we're going these days scares the heck out of me anyway. I've heard good things about Costa Rica....
Originally Posted by Brian@ITC
In all honesty, I have some minimal hand to hand combat training (karati as a child [pretty useless] and more recently a few Aikido classes, and some regular practice with a buddy).
Originally Posted by Brian@ITC
I don't think it's enough to save me if my assailant was well trained. I carry two knives to try to compensate for this disadvantage.
I would love to study martial arts more (it's great exercise, too) but my schedule lately does not allow. It's always on the back of my mind, though.
I think you make an excellent point - many of us do take the large amount of freedom we're alloted for granted. If it were to disappear, we'd be pretty screwed, pretty quickly.
Especially because the "bad guys" (read, gangbangers and felons) won't be handing in their guns.
From 50 feet, all the martial arts training in the world won't help you much if the other guy has an AK47.
Just my inflation-adjusted two cents.
Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has.
- Margaret Mead
"Booger Hook Off the Bang Switch" - unknown
April 9th, 2008 03:57 PM
No, it's not... With a decent ruling from the SCOTUS, a total ban may very well be taken off the table in the near future.
Let’s face it, a gun ban is inevitable
States with shall issue CCW laws have progressed from virtually none to practically all over the last 10 years... I don't see a big push to undo this progress.
what are you going to do if your state does not allow CCW/CHL permits anymore? Is that a possibility? You bet it is.
Even though I disagree with your premise, you still pose a valid question: What do you fall back on when a gun in not appropriate, or not available, with which to defend yourself.
As a gray bearded fatman, running is out of the question...
In my case, the gun is Plan B. Plan A is avoidance and awareness. If Plan A fails, and Plan B is unavailable (suppose I'm at the airport...), then a full out attack, using whatever might be at hand, would be my next option. I usually carry a good knife, but just about any place where I wouldn't have access to my pistol, the knife is unwelcome as well.
It almost sounds as if you are encouraging people to learn martial arts of some sort... I'm afraid health puts that option out of reach for many of us.
Remember, if you find yourself in a fair fight, your tactics suck.
Liberty is an inherently offensive lifestyle. Living in a free society guarantees that each one of us will see our most cherished principles and beliefs questioned and in some cases mocked. It's worth it.
April 9th, 2008 04:14 PM
I doubt there will be a gun ban in the next ten years.
The gun is not first line of defense for me. It is not the second line of defense, it is the last ditch effort.
Martial arts are highly overrated as defensive strategies in my midwestern mind.
I quit worrying about the nuclear aftermath years ago. Living for today is so much more satisfying.
April 9th, 2008 04:28 PM
All I am saying is that you should have unarmed combative skills. Take that how you want. And I mean, COMBAT skills. So, if that means taking a martial art, then so be it. I understand physical limitations, but for the most part, one can learn to compromise.
April 9th, 2008 06:36 PM
I've got a few things I've picked up from watching too much UFC.
Actually I've got H2H combat training, and know how to use a knife or other improvised weapon (like a flashlight) in my defense.
Fortes Fortuna Juvat
Former, USMC 0311, OIF/OEF vet
NRA Pistol/Rifle/Shotgun/Reloading Instructor, RSO, Ohio CHL Instructor
April 9th, 2008 06:43 PM
We all will do the same thing that we did before we had a CHL. Although we will probably be a little more alert when doing it. I don't see that scenario playing out in my lifetime.
Just remember that shot placement is much more important with what you carry than how big a bang you get with each trigger pull.
Texas CHL Instructor
Texas Hunter Education Instructor
April 10th, 2008 07:52 AM
Being disabled, I guess my Plan B is to whack them with my cane until they go away
Seriously, are you implying that the 2nd Amendment will be voided? That Congress is going to repeal the Bill of Rights? I think that is something that the voting public will not allow to happen.
"Bad spellers of the world - untie!"
DAV Life member, NRA Life member
Springfield XD 9mm Sub-Compact
Taurus PT111 Millennium Pro 9mm
April 10th, 2008 08:46 AM
I would love to take the Krav Maga class my daughter is in, but for three reasons: I'm so overweight I would probably die, I don't have the time, and I don't have the money.
Sure, I could lose the weight, but very few are wildly successful doing so, and time could be found (though at the expense of my family); money will just get tighter as daughter goes off to school, though. I kind of buggered up things for my generation (financially, and through seeking solace in food), but at least I can start her off well with respect to faith, education, and self/family defense training.
My guess is that (given my age and size), I should probably learn kubotan and cane techniques. I have the arms and shoulders of a gorilla, so cane fighting might play to those strengths. And of course I carry a metal flashlight and pepper spray.
April 10th, 2008 10:15 AM
All I am saying is that with all of the anti gunners that are special interest groups, and remembering the "assault" weapons ban under the Clinton Administration, anything IS POSSIBLE.
Remember, prayer was taken out of schools by ONE person. The reason it happened was because no one believed it could happened and did nothing to put up a fight. So, don't under estimate anyone.
So, hope for the best, PREPARE FOR THE WORST.
April 10th, 2008 02:13 PM
I don't live my life by a plan A or plan B. I have Plans A-Z all with subsections 1-10 and subs a-z of those. I spent a good half of my life learning different MA styles and I can readily make a makeshift tool out of just about anything on the fly. No worries here.
"My God David, We're a Civilized society."
"Sure, As long as the machines are workin' and you can call 911. But you take those things away, you throw people in the dark, and you scare the crap out of them; no more rules...You'll see how primitive they can get."
-The Mist (2007)
April 10th, 2008 07:46 PM
AMEN! To be a warrior is not a simple matter of wishing to be one. It is rather an endless struggle that will go on to the very last moment of our lives. Nobody is born a warrior, in exactly the same way that nobody is born an average man. We make ourselves into one or the other.
Originally Posted by Brian@ITC
My gun is my plan B. I am confident in my "unarmed" Plan A. That is the reason why I don't feel undergunned with just my 5 shot and no reload.
My creed (or at least one of them):
Do more, know more, think more, have more and want more than your opponent.
Training means learning the rules. Experience means learning the exceptions.
April 11th, 2008 08:50 AM
I revert back to where I was before I got my CC permit. Strong SA, 5 cell mag light, and bank on intimidation.
If it comes down to it, I fight to survive, not to win. I will do whatever is necessary to keep it that way.
What we have to remember is that most states have length limits on knives, and if guns go bye bye, you can be assured that other "Weapons" will be close behind (batons, nun-chucks (sp) swords, other traditional martial art weapons...) Having the skill to make an improvised weapon will be paramount.
I might have to start using a 6-7 foot staff to help with that limp.
Grasseater // Grass~eat~er noun, often attributive \ˈgras-ē-tər\
A person who is incapable of independent thought; a person who is herd animal-like in behavior; one who cannot distinguish between right and wrong; a foolish person.
See also Sheep
April 11th, 2008 12:23 PM
Awareness is the 1st thing you need to have,know whats going on around you at all times.Be willing to use all the force you can and have no pity on your foe.know in your own mind that you will be the one to walk away when its over.Improvised weapons are all around you.The long key on your key ring,even the ball point pen in your pocket through the eye or throat will often turn the tide.sj
April 11th, 2008 02:02 PM
While you are developing your "Plan B," make sure it includes a way to deal with armed thugs. Even if guns were banned, the criminals will still have them.
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