Would you aid an unarmed security guard?

Would you aid an unarmed security guard?

This is a discussion on Would you aid an unarmed security guard? within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; On my last mall outing I observed 3 different UNARMED security guards. None were walking together, but looked as if they had radio communication. They ...

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Thread: Would you aid an unarmed security guard?

  1. #1
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    Would you aid an unarmed security guard?

    On my last mall outing I observed 3 different UNARMED security guards. None were walking together, but looked as if they had radio communication. They carried a belt with a lot of equipment, but no gun.

    I will present 2 different scenarios for your reaction.

    1---Guard is trying to escort a group of 6 to 8 unruly kids out of the mall. They are in the 15 to 18 age group. As he is confronting them, they start to beat the guard. You are about 25 feet away watching this unfold. You do what???

    2---Guard is trying to remove 2 male subjects 17 to 20 age group from the front of a store. As he confronts them, words are exchange and 1 subjects pulls out a knife. You are again about 25 feet away watching this unfold. Your response is what????


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  2. #2
    VIP Member Array cdwolf's Avatar
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    I see it as these thugs could pick anyone, they obviously have no respect for authority! I would help in both scenarios. I'm not going to stand around and let someone get stomped or stabbed without aiding!
    That's what's wrong these days,so many will!
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  3. #3
    Member Array josh's Avatar
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    Not sure exactly what I would do, but I'll be damend if I'm just going to stand by, or walk away, while someone gets beat. You pull out a knife and make an attempt to stab someone in front of me and it's not going to go as well as you'd planned. If they're 25 feet away they're only 4 feet away from the general 21ft rule. In my book that's 4 feet from getting shot if they even so much as make an attempt to walk in my direction with the knife out in a threatening manner.

    The guard should call another guard to assist if he's trying to remove more than 1 person - especially 6-8.

  4. #4
    Senior Member Array briansmech's Avatar
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    a) assess and internally articulate the situation. survey surroundings/environment.
    b) re-assess and internally articulate the situation. formulate possibilities based on previous survey. assess aggressors and positioning.
    c) assuming both a) and b) concur that the guard can easily and reasonable be considered in fear for his life or the possibility of severe injury, act.

    in case of younger boys, i'd be more apt to announce myself and ask the guard if everything is ok.

    if a ~18yr old male with accomplice openly with the words, i presume threatening, and acting, as soon as he moves toward the guard, upon the threat to carve guard? bang bang. maybe bang bang again. friend in sights, i imagine running (fine with me, i'm sure i'll be seeing you later, anyway) ordered down if he freezes (im not sure i'd rather he just run, really...let the police collect him later)

    i'd not be so sure those security guards are ALL unarmed. just cause you can't see it...

  5. #5
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    I'm going to move swiftly and decisively and come to the aid of the guard immediately. There is much at stake. If the guard is overpowered and the kids get away with it, the word will get out and there will be a breakdown of respect for others among the teens that frequent the mall, leading to a myriad of problems further down the road.
    As to the one with a knife, I will produce my weapon and get the attention of the knife wielding idiot and order him to lay the knife down and get on the floor. In many states, threat of force is the same as use of force so at that point, it has become a police matter. Should the situation escalate, say "Sir, don't make me shoot you." If the situation continues to escalate, then it is "Two to the head, two to the chest, and you are down for, an eternal rest!" Then, immediately call for an ambulance and give first aid to any and all injured parties.
    When the situation is under control, remain with the guard and keep the witnesses in the area and control of the "downed" parties.
    Be prepared to identify yourself to officers and document everything that took place.
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  6. #6
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    Yes. Call 911 and try verbal warning first. I work in a similar job, I would want help if I was being assaulted too.
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    VIP Member Array farronwolf's Avatar
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    If time permited, call 911 in both situations.

    With the younger group of kids, it would entail throwing them off the guard, or putting them on the ground to helping him out of the situation. Along with some very loud verbal warnings and commands. It would take some serious actions on the kids part in order for me to draw a weapon in this situation.

    With the two older guys with one presenting a knife, depending on the layout and the number of people around, this one would require serious consideration of drawing my weapon. My hand would be on it with the safety off for certain. Hopefully they would see what was coming and choose a wise exit strategy. If things progressed I would be ready to defend myself or the guard with force if necessary.

    Hopefully the guard would already have called for his fellow security gaurds and there would be a couple of others there to help very shortly.
    Just remember that shot placement is much more important with what you carry than how big a bang you get with each trigger pull.
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    Distinguished Member Array SonofASniper's Avatar
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    Yes I would help.

    And just for note: 15-18 year olds can just as deadly as older people, and they are far more apt to start something.
    I will support gun control when you can guarantee all guns are removed from this planet. That includes military and law enforcement. When you can accomplish that, then I will be the last person to lay down my gun. Then I will carry the weapon that replaces the gun.

  9. #9
    VIP Member Array mcp1810's Avatar
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    In either situation I would hope the guard had a chance to get on the radio and request help. If he did I am not going to bother with a 9-1-1 call as their dispatcher should be doing that after sending the other guards his way. If he didn't I would have t assess how he is doing and if I have time to call now, or if I have to jump in.
    The guy with the knife is probably going to find himself with a little red dot glowing in the center of his chest. If he understands the significance of it and becomes instantly compliant we all end up having a relatively good day. If not I guess I will have to be calling a lawyer and then my wife to bring me another pistol because that one is going to be held as evidence.
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  10. #10
    Member Array FknRa's Avatar
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    for the group of kids: they would be introduce to my 12oz can of fogger pepper spray. Great for large groups, just spray and walk away, who cares about the eyes, just take a deep breath kiddies.

    for the knifewielding dirtbag: gun presented front sight on target "DROP THE KNIFE" "FACE AWAY HANDS ON HEAD ON YOUR KNEES FACE DOWN ARMS OUT PALMS UP CROSS YOUR LEGS" or "DROP THE KNIFE" bang bang bang... their choice.

    and hold while security calls police.
    side note: Been stabbed, NOT fun in any way shape or form.
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    As with all statements I've made and All that I will make, please check your local laws to verify accuracy. (and if i'm wrong let me know as I like to be right in the future) After all I'm just some goofball posting on an internet forum.

  11. #11
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    A Security Guard in a mall type setting where the known good guy was in obvious deep trouble AKA in a potentially life threatening situation?
    Yes, I would try to render useful assistance the same as I would for any LEO in trouble.
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  12. #12
    Member Array FknRa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mcp1810 View Post
    If he understands the significance of it and becomes instantly compliant we all end up having a relatively good day.
    people underestimate the psychological value of that little red dot. Back in the bouncing days we had a guy we tossed out come back with a shot gun, gonna get his revenge. I'm sure you are all aware of the dangers to sight that lasers have, people instantly know what it means if you shine one of those in their face. at the time carry piece was a g17 with a surefire lazor light combo, flashed him in the face to get his attention then let it sit COM. He stopped, thought for about a second without moving, turned around got in his car and drove away.

    He had superior firepower and the advantage of suprise but the thought of absolutely knowing where that bullet was going to hit was enough deterrent to make that night end up happy rather than in hand cuffs
    To those that paid for my freedom,
    I WILL NEVER FORGET.

    As with all statements I've made and All that I will make, please check your local laws to verify accuracy. (and if i'm wrong let me know as I like to be right in the future) After all I'm just some goofball posting on an internet forum.

  13. #13
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    The mall didn't want to provide armed security? I'll be real careful of providing the 'armed detail' they wouldn't think of providing.
    I'll be a good witness, call 911, and inform said 'teens' that the police have been summoned, and react only if I'm threatened...if a weapon is produced by any of the teens, that may change the scenario quickly...if someone's life appears to be in REAL trouble, then it may mean an armed response, I'm certainly not going to take on a gang of teens with anything less than 'gunfoo'...this is an issue upon which I tread quite carefully...

    I get very concerned about playing cop...I'm not a cop. If it's not me or my family, stepping up to stop a simple assault could be risky. I'm not saying I would do nothing, I just want to be VERY careful about sticking my nose right into the middle of a physical confrontation. Without more information, I will work from the sidelines...verbal warnings may be all that is needed...hopefully!
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  14. #14
    VIP Member Array SIGguy229's Avatar
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    Call 911...be a good witness....if thuggery heads my way, the scenario changes and I will respond in accordance with my training.
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  15. #15
    Senior Member Array digitalexplr's Avatar
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    Yes I would render assistance. The first thing being calling 911. I would not assume the dispatcher had, or any other bystanders had.

    In the case of the knife that is clearly a, "draw weapon" situation. You will only have seconds to convince the BG with the knife to drop it, decide to turn and run or for you to shoot.

    But you can't stand by and watch someone get kicked to death or stabbed.

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