Intervention v. Non-Intervention

This is a discussion on Intervention v. Non-Intervention within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; The Scenario: You come out of your front door and you see a group of 4 males severely beating and kicking a 5th one on ...

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Thread: Intervention v. Non-Intervention

  1. #1
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    Lightbulb Intervention v. Non-Intervention

    The Scenario: You come out of your front door and you see a group of 4 males severely beating and kicking a 5th one on the street right in front of your house. You do not know any of them. What would you do?

    The Rules for this thread: Write what you would do and explain it. It can be explained tactically, politically, legally and even morally. Take in consideration your local laws (mention the state) and possible consequences of what you do and do not do. It is accepted that all situations are unique and so cannot be always treated as generalizations

    DO NOT: Engage in a flame war. Do not attack other Memberís post. Corrections like clarifying or reminding a local law, a mistake on a name or event/date/location or similar can be done but politely. Think of this thread as a very detailed poll and not subject to criticism..
    You have to make the shot when fire is smoking, people are screaming, dogs are barking, kids are crying and sirens are coming.
    Randy Cain.

    Ego will kill you. Leave it at home.
    Signed: Me!

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  3. #2
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    Ahah - much food for thought Miggy.

    It is too darned late to comment on this and need to give it some thought so - on the morrow I will do my best to provide some thoughts.

    I think for this excercize we all need to not only note the potential for inevitable generalizations, whereas all happenings are really unique in the end - but maybe we could add personal assumptions in order to let those support our reasoning.

    In other words - ''let us assume'', for purposes of discussion. Or - "I am imagining'' - x, y, z etc. Individually flesh out this ''generic'' scenario.
    Chris - P95
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    is like owning a piano and assuming that you are a musician!."


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    Member Array d2thomas's Avatar
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    trying to steal my THUNDER migs?

    hahahaha tough call tho, I will def post my opinion in the daylight.
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    Ok, I'll play. Even tho I find this thread at after 1AM. What the heck I'm on vacation and can stay up past my bedtime.

    Assuming that in the scenario you give, the range to the situation is very close, inside say 50' and that I have just walked out the front door. I would draw my cell phone from my belt and press 9, (speed dial is programmed for 911), I would then draw my 1911 and hold it behind my right thigh, out of sight, and yell at them to stop and go away that the police are on the way. I would then stay where I am and wait for them to run off. If they continued to beat on the man I would continue to shout commands at them while describing the men to the dispatcher. If they decided to take me on as well, too bad.
    I would not run out into the street with a drawn weapon and threaten to shoot them if they didn't leave. That would be provoking a deadly force incident.

    That's my initial reaction and my .02 worth.
    Heroes are people who do what has to be done, when it has to be done, regardless of the consequences

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    Member Array KrewsControl's Avatar
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    I would do pretty much the same as acparmed. Call 911, give description to police, let the guys doing the beating know that the police are on the way and they should stop. I would stay on my porch, stay on the phone, hand probably resting on my holstered pistol. If they entered my yard heading for me. Different story.

    KC
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    naw, pull pin , throw , close door. J/K. I would do about the same only be in the dorway, call and give all info to PD, including CCW holder decpt. before yelling to the crowd. I would also be ready to retreat inside. This way I could 1. defend myself better.2. leagally , retreated and on the defensive 3. get a carbine with more ammo than my pistol.

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    Quote Originally Posted by d2thomas
    trying to steal my THUNDER migs?

    hahahaha tough call tho, I will def post my opinion in the daylight.
    Actually trying to save your thread from kidnapping in which I plea guilty too.

    A good many thoughts were given there in respect of Intervention or not so I wanted a thread where people could say them.
    You have to make the shot when fire is smoking, people are screaming, dogs are barking, kids are crying and sirens are coming.
    Randy Cain.

    Ego will kill you. Leave it at home.
    Signed: Me!

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    Member Array joe/OH's Avatar
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    Based on the previous threads I know the 'correct' thing to do. And I could just say that. But visualizing this scenario at MY house in MY area... I would tell the wife to get the shotgun and call 911. (When I'm home the wife usually is too.) I would then do the same as above, ask them what the hell they are doing and that the police are being called. If they did not stop or at least explain themselves, I would draw and repeat my command.

    The only reason I say this is that I live in a fairly remote area and response time is a joke. If the four guys are intent on beating this person to death - he will die. I realize I don't know the circumstances - but I have to figure that if the four guys intentions are good they will explain themselves. In a more urban area - I would probably do as everyone else above.

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    Got to say it would be acparmed +1. Except instead of a 1911 it would have to be a 9mm SIG.

    Living in Maryland I would stay in my doorway, and if they came at me I'd move back into the house letting them at least enter before even thinking about a shot...... If they enter, all bets are off!
    Rick

    EOD - Initial success or total failure

  11. #10
    VIP Member Array Bud White's Avatar
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    Im with Acparmed on this ... not escalting the encounter is what i would try to stay away from police responce is pretty fast here they know me well and are only 1 mile up the street

  12. #11
    VIP Member Array Rob72's Avatar
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    Mmmmmm, depends. If I saw "colors" I knew, I'd let them work it out. If it was a total unknown, ditto above on the call to 911, but I believe I would be more inclined to present with a bolt-action and light so it could be seen. Lotsandlotsandlots of thugs/bangers have been shot, and have marginal respect for a handgun; I don't have a shotty any more, and taking the 91 outside might get me more attention from PD than the BGs, so.... (Besides, a 165 gr spitzer drops things with remarkable alacrity.) I would have a HG for transition, if needed. OK legal, with reasonable, observed, "lethal intent" by the BGs.

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    Senior Member Array SARR001's Avatar
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    OK, I think I was the one that started this debate in the other thread(Sorry D2Thomas). I'm out in the yard intervening. In TX, there are protections for me legally if I intervene. Phone will be in pocket on speaker mode connected to 911, and the guys doing the beating would be at gunpoint.

    As stated before, I will not stand idly by while someone is done dirty.
    "Life's tough......It's even tougher if you're stupid." -John Wayne

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    In my case, my worry is not the alleged perpretators but the victim. The point here is to cease an attack that could lead to death or great bodily harm. Being at home either my wife or I will call 911 and advise them of the situation plus that I about to intervene giving them a full description of myself, get my shotgun, get out, scream STOP over and over, rack a round and aim at them when I get their attention. After that I'd be yelling at them to leave the area inmediately or they will be shot. If they heed and leave, I'll make sure they are not coming back and attend to the victim till rescue and PD arrives.
    You have to make the shot when fire is smoking, people are screaming, dogs are barking, kids are crying and sirens are coming.
    Randy Cain.

    Ego will kill you. Leave it at home.
    Signed: Me!

  15. #14
    Member Array joe/OH's Avatar
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    Just have to make sure the 'victim' is really a victim. As others have pointed out - intervening can be messy as things may not be what they seem. The 'victim' could be a child rapist or a murderer. You don't want to let them go.

  16. #15
    Member Array joe/OH's Avatar
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    As an extension of this scenario - you call 911 and shout at the thugs to stop assaulting the man and that you've called the police. They seem to pay no heed but step up there actions on their victim in order to finish the job before the cops get there.

    The cops are on their way but may not arrive for another 10 minutes. The thugs seem intent on not stopping until the man is no longer breathing and they do not respond to your verbal threats.

    At THIS point - what do you do?

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