What the "EXPERTS" say and what real life shows.... videos of armed robberies. - Page 4

What the "EXPERTS" say and what real life shows.... videos of armed robberies.

This is a discussion on What the "EXPERTS" say and what real life shows.... videos of armed robberies. within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I remember now. But let me PM you in a second here. Cannot PM you, but the prison populations, you mean the types of thugs ...

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Thread: What the "EXPERTS" say and what real life shows.... videos of armed robberies.

  1. #46
    Senior Member Array dcb188's Avatar
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    I remember now. But let me PM you in a second here.
    Cannot PM you, but the prison populations, you mean the types of thugs there as opposed to here and what they learn inside? I must be dense today....do not understand that connection yet.
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  2. #47
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    If it wasn't for the "EXPERTS" the 911 attacks would have never happened. Can you imagine three of four idiots with BOX CUTTERS trying to take over a plane with 100 able bodied Americans on board in the fifties. We would still be looking for the body parts of the hijackers today. "EXPERTS" my *#$!!
    It is surely true that you can lead a horse to water but you can't make them drink. Nor can you make them grateful for your efforts.

  3. #48
    Senior Member Array CR2008's Avatar
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    Local government after Katrina and "EXPERT" advice...

    Quote Originally Posted by atctimmy View Post
    If it wasn't for the "EXPERTS" the 911 attacks would have never happened. Can you imagine three of four idiots with BOX CUTTERS trying to take over a plane with 100 able bodied Americans on board in the fifties. We would still be looking for the body parts of the hijackers today. "EXPERTS" my *#$!!
    UNARMED, law obeying Katrina victims were the results of local government following "EXPERT" advice.... disarm the people, because "it makes them safer." (They don't trust their own citizens.)

    So the armed thugs run around, looting and even killing victims of Katrina, and what does the local government do, disarm people who they can hardly protect themselves... God help us if they try this crap after a terrorist attack or something like the La Riots.

  4. #49
    VIP Member Array cdwolf's Avatar
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    SIXTO What's the new avatar?

    On of my best friends was at the largest bar in Jackson,MS last year for a celebration. He was 27, single( 6' 180)and just bought his first car. He had a friend that was going to drive him home(DD), an hour after their there his DD leaves. He has had 3 beers and has been working 13 hour days to pay for A 2007 Loaded Mustang GT!! He has a loaded F-350 for his work truck. Anyway He decides to leave, as soon as he gets to his car, which is parked in the Back corner of the parking lot(new car)10:30 PM. A 20 something ( the guy was 6'1" 200) black guy jumps out from behind the car(as soon as he hit the keyless entry ) with a plastic gun so he calls them( poor guy) Black, Square,bighole is all he saw. He grabs his keys,open his driver door and shoves him in the car. By the time he sat up the guy had run around ( hit the keyless entry and unlocked the door) and was in his passengers seat with the gun to his head!!

    He told him to drive, he took him into downtown and made more then three turns into the part off town we all have but only a few go.
    He told him to stop, Give me your wallet and cash( WHAT he didn't care about the car) He says he thought about driving into trees and all that but the guy was shaking from the start. Not clumsy shaking,and he said he moved fast and that might get him shot!!!!

    Once he handed over his wallet and cash ($75.00 and 2 credit cards and he was not interested in the $600.00 watch)
    He said he seen him start to pull the trigger when he slapped the gun out of his face..
    The first shot hit the top of the door panel and took off the driver side mirror. The second shot missed his chest by 4" and went out above the door handle.
    He says he thinks he poked him in the eye( one hand on the gun, one on the face). He shot a third time as he was getting out which killed his stereo and lodged in his dash.
    He dumped the clutch and tore out of there. He went 5-6 turns, a couple of miles before he knew where he was at. He called 911 when he hit the interstate, they said come in when you have the time and make a report.
    The detective He got told him he won, and there is a very slim chance he will ever catch the guy. Surprise, Surprise

    They don't care about you!!

    Some of you typing wizards make me sick, This took a good 15 mins
    ETA: Ok 30mins
    GUN CONTROL= I WANT TO BE THE ONE IN CONTROL OF THE GUN

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  5. #50
    Senior Member Array CR2008's Avatar
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    Crime is becoming MORE violent, that's a fact.

    Quote Originally Posted by cdwolf View Post

    Once he handed over his wallet and cash ($75.00 and 2 credit cards and he was not interested in the $600.00 watch)
    He said he seen him start to pull the trigger when he slapped the gun out of his face..
    The first shot hit the top of the door panel and took off the driver side mirror. The second shot missed his chest by 4" and went out above the door handle.
    He says he thinks he poked him in the eye( one hand on the gun, one on the face). He shot a third time as he was getting out which killed his stereo and lodged in his dash.
    He dumped the clutch and tore out of there. He went 5-6 turns, a couple of miles before he knew where he was at. He called 911 when he hit the interstate, they said come in when you have the time and make a report.
    The detective He got told him he won, and there is a very slim chance he will ever catch the guy. Surprise, Surprise

    They don't care about you!!

    Some of you typing wizards make me sick, This took a good 15 mins
    ETA: Ok 30mins
    So basically the low life was about to shoot your friend AFTER giving up the stuff? These days, it's getting more and more common, and the fact that a victim sometimes is SHOT BEFORE DEMANDS are made should tell you how desperate these people are.

    I asked Defensive Arms why he really believes gunmen won't execute witnesses EVEN if there were security cams, and I have not gotten a reply, he replied to other people's question but I guess my statement was not important enough.... people are getting shot BEFORE, DURING a and AFTER they have complied at times, in 7/11s, Jewelry stores etc but some people still want to fool themselves thinking they know knew what criminals will do next, though they are erratic, unstable from drugs, mental illness etc... and from my experience living in a place where great violent crime exists,like Jamaica, CERTAIN DEATH awaits those who don't act against an armed attacker (Either RUN to get help, fight for your life if no root out, or do nothing and die), and most survivers had to fight for their lives or were successful in running away... many times, if you follow magazine/internet "expert" advice, you are putting yourself at a greater disadvantage... criminals are NOT SCRIPTED.

  6. #51
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    I got a few things to point out here...

    the videos posted are great for learning and making the point, but they really are the exception and far from the norm.

    9/11 and Katrina are two completly different senarios than those pointed out in the original post.

    the detective in cdwolf's story was just being honest, and the problem with solving that particular crime was circumstance...you tell me how the friend helped in solving the situation.



    And my avatar says SIXTO in chinese. (or at least it does the best I can tell...my chinese skills are not the best)
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  7. #52
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    For some insights and confirmation of your thoughts, hang outside, in the a.m., your county courthouse (if you have a separate criminal courts building, that's the place you want) and watch the people coming in for hearings, trial, sentencing, etc. - generally beginning at about 0800 hours. And then count those who come out later that a.m. day (about 90-95%), smiling, laughing, high-fiving their buddies, and then back onto the street, into some very nice cars, with their gun-carrying friends who are waiting to escort them to the parking garage (where I guess they again arm themselves).

    I was at the County Courthouse yesterday on a civil matter and generally speaking, my observations of the ratio of wannabe-tough guys to real BGs to stone cold killer-type BGs (socio/psychos) is about 80%/15%/5% (actually, somewhere between 1% and 5%).

    Some might disagree with my analysis, which is flawed, I admit, but it's based on prior experience in dealing with some real serious BGs in real-world situations. I enjoyed watching, observing how they looked around, behaved, looked at me and either dismissing me out of hand or looking at me like a predator who recognizes a hunter (and some actually smiling/smirking and my smiling back). Strange how that happens frequently. Some of you might know what I mean.

    Unfortunately, the court system and politicians use a one-size-fitzall approach towards crime and criminals and that is distinctly liberal - the poor criminal is not personally responsible. The fault lies with society, family, TV, schools - everyone else is responsible. No personal responsibility in today's society - for anything! It's always sombody else's fault.

    I have some answers, but they have a strong moral foundation. Not everything is gray, situational. There is black and white. There are moral absolutes. And there is Good and there is Evil. The State's job is to protect its good citizens, not the evil ones. I'll leave it there as to how they're doing...
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  8. #53
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    Experts???

    Quote Originally Posted by CR2008 View Post
    ....So basically, what if they wanted to bound you with duck tape, and demand you get on your knees, according the the "EXPERTS" you should comply....
    OK so what is an "Expert"?

    The definition I like best is:
    1) We learn in algebra that "X" is an unknown.
    2) A "Spurt" is a drip under pressure.

    So, it's an unknown drip under pressure.

    How about:

    Expert = "Someone 50 miles from home w/ no one in the audience who knows him."

    Or:

    1) "Ex" means "Former, antique, out of fashion, out of touch, or outmoded"
    2) "Pert" means "a planning and control process" or (in Middle English), "unconcealed, bold."

    So, "No longer in touch with planning or in control." Or "no longer bold"

    'Nuf said.

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  9. #54
    Senior Member Array CR2008's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by joelg View Post
    For some insights and confirmation of your thoughts, hang outside, in the a.m., your county courthouse (if you have a separate criminal courts building, that's the place you want) and watch the people coming in for hearings, trial, sentencing, etc. - generally beginning at about 0800 hours. And then count those who come out later that a.m. day (about 90-95%), smiling, laughing, high-fiving their buddies, and then back onto the street, into some very nice cars, with their gun-carrying friends who are waiting to escort them to the parking garage (where I guess they again arm themselves).

    I was at the County Courthouse yesterday on a civil matter and generally speaking, my observations of the ratio of wannabe-tough guys to real BGs to stone cold killer-type BGs (socio/psychos) is about 80%/15%/5% (actually, somewhere between 1% and 5%).

    Some might disagree with my analysis, which is flawed, I admit, but it's based on prior experience in dealing with some real serious BGs in real-world situations. I enjoyed watching, observing how they looked around, behaved, looked at me and either dismissing me out of hand or looking at me like a predator who recognizes a hunter (and some actually smiling/smirking and my smiling back). Strange how that happens frequently. Some of you might know what I mean.

    Unfortunately, the court system and politicians use a one-size-fitzall approach towards crime and criminals and that is distinctly liberal - the poor criminal is not personally responsible. The fault lies with society, family, TV, schools - everyone else is responsible. No personal responsibility in today's society - for anything! It's always sombody else's fault.

    I have some answers, but they have a strong moral foundation. Not everything is gray, situational. There is black and white. There are moral absolutes. And there is Good and there is Evil. The State's job is to protect its good citizens, not the evil ones. I'll leave it there as to how they're doing...
    I had to serve as a Jurer 1 1/2 years ago for a murder trial in which a 16 year old had been ambushed tried to dump garbage, 5 suspects (3 armed with handguns), all had latex cloves and duck tape... they killed the uncle while he was trying to get away, then they executed the boy.... how you think these guys looked? They looked like regular delinquents around (16-18 years old), you would figure they were simply 'trouble makers' but most people would not have known they were killers.

    Also, after my bother had his car stollen, I had to be in and out of court often, I got to hear one pre-trial hearing where the suspect was involved in several violent armed robberies... he looked like a middle schooler, and his defence lawyer claimed he was "just a baby." Would you think he does not have the will to take your life for nothing? I would not assume anything of the sort... and it's even worst in a country like Jamaica and other 3rd world countries with high violent crime rates, there are 12 year old gang bangers out there who would but lead through you for their "initiation rights" and they won't lose a minute of sleep over killing you too.

    Check out some recent mug shots in any big city... they have younger looking violent offenders that they did in the past.

    Another thing is that the 'wanabes' who grow in their criminal histories usually turn out to become more violent with time... so a 'wanabe' could become a stone cold killer 5-10 years down the line after being in and out of prison, the 'criminal university.' It's for these reasons I respect the 3 strike laws.

  10. #55
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    I believe in the three strike law for ALL individuals who like to rob innocent people...strike one and two, COM...strike three H...

    Easy to say, tough to incorporate into practice...hope I never have to test my nerves and musce memory...

    It is a cruel world out there...and I do not plan on losing my life to some dirtbag...it could happen, but I will defend personal space to the best of my ability...

    I know every scenario is completely different...these vid's help me to think of/realize/imagine my reactions...to the possibilities that can overcome you in a 'moment'...very scary, indeed...

    Don't know how you cops out there deal with this on a daily basis.

    Stay armed...stay safe!
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  11. #56
    VIP Member Array cdwolf's Avatar
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    I just posted this in another thread, but it is a good read if you haven't seen it yet.

    A Nation of Cowards
    GUN CONTROL= I WANT TO BE THE ONE IN CONTROL OF THE GUN

    A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

  12. #57
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    IMHO if someone is attempting to rob you at gun/knifepoint they are showing intent to kill/maim you and you need to defend yourself , preferably with a few well place hollowpoints . The "experts" can tell us whatever they want to , but the fact's speak for themselves being unarmed makes you an easy victim, being armed doesn't make you invincible , but at least it gives you a fighting chance.

  13. #58
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    The notion of complying is a statistically viable option that has a very high success rate of something like 87-88%. That means in 12-13% of the time that you comply, the bad guy is still going to harm you. If I could wind the lottery 12-13% of the time, I would invest $500 every lottery until I won, then invest more each time.

    For the general population who has no training in self defense and who has given self defense about as much thought as performing an appendectomy on themselves, compliance is the best way to go...statistically speaking. For the rest of it, it is a stupid notion.
    Considering yourself to be defenseless is the first administrative step to becoming a victim.

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