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Pizza delivery

4K views 36 replies 25 participants last post by  stargzer 
#1 ·
I've been interested in making some extra cash in addition to my current job. Tomorrow there is a good chance I will get a pizza delivery job. I know pizza men are big targets for robberies and while the company has a "no guns" policy I will still be carrying. My life over my job I always say. Is it justifiable to shoot a robber who is only after my money? Where do you draw the line? Armed robber, unarmed robber? Preventing your route of escape? I know there is a lot of money in pizza delivery, and I have concerns.

Scenario: I am coming back from a delivery to my car and there is an seemingly unarmed guy who is leaning on my car and says "a little cash would be nice" as he points to the guys off in the corner of my eye. I notice 2 other guys with baseball bats behind the bushes. What would you do?

Any tips to stay safe while delivering? I can't really choose where I go obviously...
 
#3 ·
Pretty much. I mean I've been carrying for some time now and the chances of me getting mugged, especially in this area are slim to nil. I hope it stays that way.

I figure there are a lot of pizza men in this area and I really have not heard of a robbery. I just hope I'm not the lucky one :rolleyes:

Edit: and just for the record I already conceal a Kel-Tec P3AT at work now, i've never had an issue.
 
#5 ·
Honestly I would re-evaluate how bad you need the extra cash. You already know the company doesn't allow carry, which could add to your woes if you ever have to use your firearm.

Robbery is a violent crime, and the line is drawn when you seriously fear for your life.

I'd probably look for a safer job, but that is coming from a grunt, so take it for what it is worth.
 
#6 ·
First, IANAL...

If a robber is armed and threatening your life or limb, you can do whatever it takes to stop the threat even if the robber is mortally wounded as a result of your defense.

In some states you are required to "retreat to the wall". In other words, you must try as best you can to avoid violence. In other states this is not required, just the threat is enough for you to take action. Check your state's laws on self-defense.

Even if you are legally OK you may still be prosecuted and have to prove your assertions. You may also be sued by people close to the robber. Fighting either of these situations could prove costly in money and time, and there is always the possibility you may lose.

I suggest getting a copy of Massad Ayoob's book "In the Gravest Extreme". Some of the information is dated, but the sections on the legal considerations of self-defense are excellent.

Some of the most important things to remember if you find yourself in the aftermath of a bad situation is;
1. YOU make the 911 call yourself as quickly as possible, and give as little detail as possible to get the police and/or EMT personnel there quickly.
2. When the police arrive politely tell them that you will cooperate with them and answer their questions once your lawyer is present. DO NOT TALK TO THE POLICE!!!!!!!

Bobo
 
#7 ·
I'm a pizza jockey. I carry a gun.

In that situation I would draw to a ready position and order them to leave me alone. Then call 911 and report as I drive away.

Some tips:

Never, ever park in the drive way. Always park on the street. Never leave your vehicle running.

Carry two flashlights.

If you get to an address and the porch light is burnt out, call the customer and have them come outside. Keep your flashlight low and illuminate their hands. Always, always watch their hands.

Always look around you. Your head should be on a swivel. Illuminate both sides of the house as you drive by. Light up the corners of the house as you walk up. Listen for whispering, etc. Talk a little louder than normal at night (except the money stuff). Hi, how are you tonight?... Total comes to $16.83 please. There's your change...Thanks a lot, I appreciate it, have a great night.

Do not flash the cash on the way back. Neighbors will look out their windows if someone is talking loud at night. Witnesses to anything are good.

I keep the change money ("bank") in my right front pocket and the customer money (payments) in the left front pocket.

Adhere to the company's money policy. Keep $20 change on you. 2-$5s and 10 singles. That's it. The policy where I work is no $50s or $100 unless it's within $20 of the total ($36.00 order is ok for a $50, because I give them $14 back-less than $20).

Always make a money drop into the store. They should have a drop box.

If possible, don't put a car topper on your vehicle. This makes your vehicle a target for all sorts of crap.

If at any moment you feel unsafe, don't go there. Period.

Dogs love pizza guys. I've had to shoot and kill a dog that rushed to attack me.
 
#30 ·
I'm a pizza jockey. I carry a gun.

I drive for a major Pizza delivery company also. I've had my CCW for four years, just renewed it. I have never stopped carrying, even though the company says NO. Carrying a Para P-12 loaded w/ Black Talon .45 ACP (Carry the biggest caliber you can conceal and shoot well):image035:, cocked and locked IWB (Galco STO n Go)with the company shirt over and not tucked in. I buy the EXTRA LARGE ones, even though I'm a large...helps conceal better:wave:

Some tips:

Never, ever park in the drive way. Always park on the street. Never leave your vehicle running.

I always try to park in the driveway....that way I can illuminate the path to the door, if they don't have any lights on. After dark,I try to always call the customer and comfirm the order....if they sound drunk, or questionable, you can decide what the best course is....if you feel uncomfortable....let the manager know and then he or she can decide if you should go on the delivery....but, always be prepared for anything. I contact the customer and tell them I'm on my way to deliver their pizza and to have a porch light on and be expecting me.....that usually get me a bigger tip. My car is equipped with a remote start and lock....so, I can leave my car running w/ lights on....well worth the money. also, fun to watch peoples faces when your car starts just as you walk up to it.:rofl:


If you get to an address and the porch light is burnt out, call the customer and have them come outside. Keep your flashlight low and illuminate their hands. Always, always watch their hands.

A cell phone is a must in this type of job. I use mine alot, for directions, when house looks unocupied.

Always look around you.

I am constantly looking around and listening for anything suspect. I recently purchase one of those small but, very powerful halogen flashights....they are great...blindingly bright.

If possible, don't put a car topper on your vehicle. This makes your vehicle a target for all sorts of crap.

My company requires that we have a car topper with lights on after dark, but I do turn off the topper light after 9 PM. I just have to make sure the manager does not see it.:aargh4:

If at any moment you feel unsafe, don't go there. Period.

Dogs love pizza guys. I've had to shoot and kill a dog that rushed to attack me.

I keep a CS/Pepper spray for dogs and my P-12 for two legged dogs.:comeandgetsome:
Some great advice offered by these posters. I hope this helps you. BTW, I make pretty good money in tips and hourly wages...even with the usual stiffs. You are the only one that can determine if it is worth it or not. My company pays a little over $1.50 per delivery(based on the National Avg)...so, we drivers try to get aleast two deliveries per run...still, gas is over $3.70 a gallon here....when we are bz, can get three per run...so just depends on your area....we have a lot of subdivisons. The wear and tear on your vehical is tremendous...I average about 100 to 125 miles per night....my car gives me about 22 to 30 MPG, not too bad. GOOD LUCK with your new job...
Stay safe, Alway vigilant.
 
#8 ·
A few months ago a pizza delivery guy named James Spiers working for Pizza Hut in Des Moines had a gun drawn on him in an attempted robbery. In response he pulled out his gun (owned and carried within the law), shot the robber a bunch of times, and got away safely. As far as I can tell from news reports there was little or no time between when the danger presented itself and when bullets started flying.

Pizza hut has a zero tolerance policy about carrying guns. James was immediately suspended and fired.
 
#10 ·
PLEASE.......

Immediately review the PA statutes that address the use of deadly force. Every state is different and as a cc licensee, it's your responsibility to understand them fully. Failing to do so, can cost you a heck of a lot more than a part-time job.....

I'd also strongly encourage you to carry a less lethal alternative with you such as a good (I like Fox Labs) OC spray and at least one good flashlight.

Stay safe, but make sure you stay legal too.....
 
#11 ·
I would say that Tubby45 has given some pretty sound advice.

I am not one for pulling your pistol unless it is going to be used, but in the situation that you described, that is exactly what I would do. Aiming it directly at the guy leaning up against the car. I am sure he would be gone in a flash, and the other two ball players would be right behind or in front of him.

I don't know what PA law is regarding retreat or whatever, so look it up. Here in Texas, well you all know this is Texas.

Do what you have to keep yourself safe, and make a living for your family. If the pizza thing works for you, be aware, and do it well. It can be dangerous, but doesn't have to be dangerous if you use your head.
 
#12 · (Edited)
Is it justifiable to shoot a robber who is only after my money? Where do you draw the line?
The money belongs to the pizza company that doesn't want you defending yourself. Are you going to put yourself in a potential world of legal troubles for them??? :ticking:

Draw the line where you always do---if Ability, Opportunity, and Jeopardy of being killed or seriously injured present themselves. That is, if you reasonably perceive your life to be in danger, do what you feel is appropriate.

Don't lift a finger just for the company.

ETA: Bob O has a good point about being certain of your local laws, especially with regard to retreating. I don't expect that PA has a strong duty to retreat, but I certainly don't know that for a fact. Be sure!
 
#13 ·
Just like other anytime, your life had better be in danger before you do anything with your gun, and you better be able to articulate just why you did what you did.

Tubby gave you great advice, I'll expand just a little bit drawing from my experience as a "jockey" a long long time ago in a galaxy far far away;

Carry a cell phone, aside from the obvious reasons, its super valuable tool for delivery purposes. I even suggest getting a cheap prepaid deal, because you don't want to get calls for pizza orders on your regular phone.

A good flash light is a must; I suggest a large one for the car and one for your pocket.

Wear cargo pants if possible.

Hiking boots are really nice... you'll find out why soon enough.:image035:

I'm not usually an advocate of pepper spray, but a decent can could be very handy and save you a lot of grief.

If you don't know the area you're delivering to, LEARN IT! This will save you time, and make you a lot more money. See if you can get a hold of a copy of the local F.D.'s "map book". Its worth its weight in gold to the delivery man.

Be super weary of apt. complexes, especially government funded ones. Get in, and get out. Put stuff away and prep for next delivery down the road.

Keep a spare car key on you at all times. Trust me, it will be handy.

make those drops each time you head back to the shop. Remember, its not your money! Its simply not worth killing or getting killed over.
 
#14 ·
Having been a jockey in my youth for 3 years, I had my fair share of 'encounters' that I was able to safely retreat from. My last year working there, I did carry a .380 with me (this was in CA and no I did not have a CCW permit). Luckily I worked for a mom and pop pizza joint and the boss carried and had no problem with me carrying and neither did his business partner.

I had 2 pizza's stolen out of my car while delivering to a house. I have been shadowed by an unsavory looking fella while delivering in an apartment complex at night once, luckily I gave him the slip and made a hasty get away. I have delivered to drunkards who felt generous enough to offer me beer and condems as a tip (declined), I had some wack job high on dust confront me in my car while I was waiting to make a left turn at an intersection...he was convinced that I was following him. In all situations, I was able to avoid escalation and retreat.

Just keep your SA set on 11 and follow the advice of some of the other posters. It could save your life and help you avoid having to use your weapon. :comeandgetsome:
 
#15 · (Edited)
Is it justifiable to shoot a robber who is only after my money? Where do you draw the line? Armed robber, unarmed robber?
How do you know your money is the only goal? You can't possibly know this.

My line: if faced with a lethal threat and my life is in danger, the game is on ... and I will survive it if I am at all able. That means acting immediately, forcefully and capably toward my own survival. That's irrespective of whether some lib-noodle will come down later and claim the bugger was unarmed, or wore green, or said he only wanted money, or whatever. A lethal threat is just that. Act, or not.

I believe you'll find that your state's laws grant that your freedom to satisfactorily handle a situation in this manner is upheld.

That all being said, consider what Tubby's saying. Knowing what you know about the obvious increased risks, are you still willing to step into the quagmire? There are other flexible alternatived that don't require being alone in the darker, bleaker sections of town armed with pepperoni, olives and breath mints.

One option I did, when younger and when needing a fill-in type job with crazy hours: temporary agency. I was able to fill as much or little of my time, often with nutty hours. Worked very well for me, and many of the jobs I did have held me in good stead across a career.
 
#16 ·
You really should have been educated about when and when not to shoot in your CCW class. Maybe a refresher of your state's law is in order? I don't mean this to be a wise guy, but carrying a firearm is a HUGE Responsibility and you need to understand your states laws and when it's time for action and most important when it isn't!!\
Generally speaking if another person were placed in the same situation would they also be in fear of immediate bodily injury and /or death. If the answer is yes time to act!!
Please be safe, a large pepperoni pizza just isn't worth it!!

NCH
 
#19 ·
I'd never be a pizza delivery guy. Excesse miles racked on my personal car (maintenence! Wear/tear) Extremely high gas prices (do they pay you for gas based on current gas prices?) and too dang'd risky.
 
#20 ·
I've been interested in making some extra cash in addition to my current job. Tomorrow there is a good chance I will get a pizza delivery job.
You may not believe it, but there is very little money in pizza delivery. I'm not saying you won't make money, you'll bring in quite a bit. The problem is you put out quite a bit as well.

I tell people, the only way to make money delivering pizza is to use Mom and Dad's car to do it, with them paying for insurance and maintenance. I did it for a little while in college, paying for everything myself though. The math doesn't work out. All of my trip money and most of my tips went into gas and maint. costs. At the time, all the drivers were paid minimum wage. We also got $1.50 per trip (and gas was ~$1.50 per gallon) plus tips. Tips were pretty good, $2 or so per house on average.

I'm sure you can find another job that pays better and is safer than delivering pizza. Don't get me wrong, I loved the job. When things got really busy and the boss is yelling at everyone to go faster, my job was to squeal tires coming into the parking lot, run in, grab a pizza, look at the map, run out and squeal tires leaving. Then I drive the speed limit (one speeding ticket eats up a lot of tips) to the house, listening to the radio, etc. The problem is, the easier the job is the lower the pay, and that's true for delivery drivers (hidden, but true).
 
#21 ·
We have a Honda Civic Hybrid... back when I delivered papers I'd fill it up once every 15 days... I think the money will still be good since I won't have to fill up too often. I'll use the same car for pizza delivery. I know the bad areas in town and they are few and far between, heck I know that most of the town is good. Robberies and violent crime is low here, but it does happen once in a while. I'll just keep my guard up much like I did when delivering papers. Thanks for all the advice. :bier:
 
#22 ·
We have a Honda Civic Hybrid...
Viewed from eyes of the predator, this means that you'll be a higher-value target than would otherwise be the case. Caution.
 
#24 ·
At my old apartment I ordered a pizza from Papa Johns. An hour went by and no pizza. So I called them back, and they told me my pizza was stolen and the delivery person was robbed right outside my building. So I asked if they were sending another one (kinda jokingly). Then a LEO knocked on my door, just to verify that I had nothing to do with it. I had to go to the store to get my pizza. Well, they told me they would no longer be delivering to that area. About a week later the same thing with Pizza hut and Dominos. Turns out one of my neighbors thought it would be a good source of income. They had an Undercover cop pose as a delivery man to make the bust. Poor cop had to do 22 deliveries in the area before they figured out who it was.
 
#25 ·
I worked for a major pizza company delivering.

While working there one apartment complex was banned from being delivered too. A female driver was surrounded by 15 people in her car, she simply drove straight at people and they moved :p

Another person was approached threatingly but got in his car fast enough and drove away.

If I could of at the time, I would of carried, regardless of job policy. I have been in a situation myself.

Delivery to an apartment(the worst kind). Had to climb 4 flgihts of stairs in a closed stairwell. No escape. I hated these places. Had two people enter building 10 seconds after I did. Apartment opened to a crowd of people inside, the guy said I could come inside while he 'found' the money. Two people from outside came upstairs, met me at door, guy said I could come in again. I backed away from all the people, but didn't show any signs of retreat, acted like I was getting the pizza's out of the boxes, and just hauled ass down the stairs sprinting, and back to my car.

The two people followed me out yelling something. I don't care if I would get fired, or a customer complaint. If you don't feel safe, leave the environment.

I believe if I had walked into that apartment today I could possibly be robbed, beaten, or worse.

I had too many of those uncomfortable feelings. Along with raising gas prices, the wear and tear on my car, the extra money WAS NOT WORTH IT.

I recommend doing something else for extra money. You fill your tank EVERY DAY almost. You change your oil once a month, putting 3k+ miles a month on your car. And you risk your life going to places you've never gone before, meeting people you don't want to meet, and being stiffed on tips in the process.

It just isnt worth it.
 
#27 ·
You sound like a James Bond type, a man of danger...I guess you like fighting for your life...go ahead take the pizza job...it's gonna' make your day.

I, on the other hand, would find another line of work.

OMO

Stay armed...extra lead to go...stay safe!
 
#28 ·
I delivered for a pizza place about 2 years ago. Because of my surrounding areas i would have to go into a unicorperated city sometimes where you drive down a backroad to get to a house, if that was the case i would always back in. Also for driveways backing in is going to be your best bet. As far as personal safety i carried a gurber fatty but that was it, looking back on it now it was somewhat foolish that i didnt have anything "better", had a luie slugger in the car but that was about it.
 
#32 ·
The above poster is absolutely correct.

When you're doing the job, and getting 100 cash dollars a night... you're like, oh wow, 100 bucks for 5 hours work! Aint bad!

Then you buy gas. Windshield wipers. Fix your bumper someone ran into. Fix your bumper cause it scraped a crappy driveway, change your tires cause of a flat, change your tires cause of wear, change your oil, brakes, fluids, replace a cracked windshield.

You're left with nothing but headache.
 
#35 ·
A lot of Pros and Cons

I've been interested in making some extra cash in addition to my current job.

I know there is a lot of money in pizza delivery, and I have concerns.

I can't really choose where I go obviously...
There seems to be alot of pros and cons to this.....some say good, some say bad.....let me say this about that. First, you didn't tell us your reason for wanting to work extra for more cash....you don't have to answer if its too personal.....as I mentioned, ....humm, maybe I didn't.....BTW, I am retired from the USAF...so I am drawing a small retirement check....I'm working for extra play money:smiley2: and to pay my house off quicker.:biggrin2: I listen to talk radio whenever I'm in the vehicle and have been listening to radio host Dave Ramsey:hand5:...not sure if you heaard him or not....but he is nationally syndicated. He founded FPU ....Financial Peace University. He has help hundreds or maybe even thousands get out of debt and have financial freedom. He recommends pizza delivery as a way to make extra money to get out of debt. You are correct in your think there is a lot of money in the pizza business...how much you make depends on location, having a good, dependable car, and attitude. So, maybe some have tried it and did not make much, but, like I mentioned I make an extra house payment every month and still have play money left over....so......something to think about :scratchchin:,only you can decide if it is worth it or not. Again, Good Luck.
 
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