This is a discussion on Loved One at Knife Point. within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Many on this forum do carry a drop wallet. I do not believe in them. If you want to know my reasons, you can look ...
Many on this forum do carry a drop wallet. I do not believe in them. If you want to know my reasons, you can look at post #3 at http://www.defensivecarry.com/vbulle...situation.html
There are two sides to every issue: one side is right and the other is wrong, but the middle is always evil.
Who is John Galt?
I think you covered it as your only option is to give him your wallet or a drop wallet. Whatever it takes to gain the release of your loved one. I wouldn't announce I have a gun because he would want that too. Then what do you do? If he releases her you are no longer if fear of GBH or death are you? If he tries to take her after you have complied with his demand that is a different ball game altogether. The gun comes out and he goes down at the first opportunity.
DEMOCRACY IS TWO WOLVES AND A LAMB VOTING ON WHAT TO HAVE FOR LUNCH. LIBERTY IS A WELL ARMED LAMB CONTESTING THE VOTE.
Certified Instructor for Minnesota Carry Permit
NRA Pistol and Personal Protection Insrtuctor
Utah Permit Certified Instructor
I'll throw my wallet or keys down to make this happen. Pulling a gun prior to this as an intimidation tool is not a good idea. The last thing that is needed is a standoff. Just because you have a gun does not give you the upper hand here; he has your wife/gf at knifepoint. There is a chance he may take his chances and just bug out, but if he doesn't you have a situation where you every move is a gamble.
Trying for a headshot or rush shot? Not here. I can get those in on paper no problem from 7 yds, but with my wife in the way? It would have to be the LAST and ONLY way to end the situation. The "rush shots" work in some of those police videos as they have other guys to make distractions. If its only you, fat chance.
Naa...I say comply to a point, to create a situation where you DO gain the upper hand. Ideally, this would be where he lets go of your wife/gf to pick up your stuff and then you can show him his mistake.
I don't need a dummy wallet...if someone decides to take my wallet, he's the dummy...
I'm at a point in my life that I'm entirely fed up with all the crime...I watch everyone and I'm always armed at home.
Maybe I can be caught off guard, but it won't be an easy task for the local dirtbags...at the first sign or any slight awareness of brewing trouble...my reactions will be violent...I'm too old to play games...leave me alone...I will ruin your day!
Stay armed...stay alert...stay safe!
Proverbs 27:12 says: “The prudent see danger and take refuge, but the simple keep going and suffer for it.”
Certified Glock Armorer
NRA Life Member
Here's your alternative to the dummy wallet...
Tell the BG look don’t do anything to hurt her/him, slowly pull out your gun and point at GBs head, while telling him, if you harm that person I will drop you like a sack of potatoes. The only way you can win this is to leave now without harming anyone!
If this isn’t met with an immediate response to retreat put one in his head asap!
I practice hostage targets more than any other target types and head shots from concealment.
He will expect you to go for your wallet which for me is strong side, I can give him the wallet or the business end of what I'm carrying.
I like options right to the end, worst case I throw the wallet and them some lead.
Here's my question:
In the knife point scenario, am I justified in shooting the BG without a CWL? I keep a pistol in the glovebox. If I go to the vehicle and pull a gun, is it legal since it is obviously no longer in my private conveyance?
Let me rephrase, I'm going to shoot the SOB with or without my CWL. I guess my question is am I going to jail for 25-life because I was trying to save my wife's life?
NO you had it securly encased snap holster in glove box (LEAGAL)
+1000 on what retsup99 said.
IMHO one must always confront EVIL with a
decisive, controled, and overwhelming responce.
I also strongly suggest that everyone that carries a sidearm practice
hostage drills. Situational awarness is key, however stuff does
happen that can take one by suprise. With that being said. Both my
wife and daughters are aware that given this particular senario they
will need to go low and to my left because a head shot is sure
to follow. Just for the record my Wife and I have a reciprosity
agreement on this senario.( I got the better end of the deal... she's
a better shot than me.)
Safety First....Keep your groups tight,
Yes, tough situation. But I believe this is the sort of thing people train for. It's one of the most personal and has only a few options.Loved One at Knife Point.
While I'm nobody's match expert, in terms of accuracy, this is the sort of situation I try to prepare for: taking out a BG that has one of my family. I believe that I am sufficiently accurate with a variety of pistols and calibers out to 10yds, in competition or on paper, against moving targets in the field to take the shot(s).
Now, my folks and sister won't really have anything to do with my firearms or my carrying, so they're not exactly a part of the planning process for tactics. That's a big problem, as they can't be part of the solution, can't contribute to the take-down, can't necessarily know enough to fake a heart attack, or whatever element of the planning involved them. I dearly wish they would approve of being part of the planning process, as we call could benefit by a bit of direct talk and planning, simple movements that would be required in a situation, simple "team" tactics. That could make all the difference.
Yes, one or more shots might graze the GG, and it's possible one might be fatal, sure. Many people survive gunshot wounds that don't strike vitals.
No guarantees with any option you take, but this one at least has a high probability of taking out the BG. No way will I disarm. No way will I allow my family member to be killed by the BG, if I can stop it. Which leaves either subterfuge and waiting for the moment, or taking the moment. I opt to be in the driver's seat, in this scenario ... for better or worse.
This solution isn't for everyone. And I'm reasonably sure that if the situation changed a bit, it wouldn't be for me either. But, within 5-7yds or so, a loved one under physical control by a lone BG, and me with a firearm I am skilled in using, I see it as the most viable option.
Other places aren't so fortunate.
Heck why not work out a plan with the wife. I nod she dodges and moves to give me a shot I draw and kill.. If your holding my wife.. Leaving alive is not an option.
You might be weak but God is Strong!
My wife knows that if that were to happen, she would go completely limp and drop all her weight as if she passed out, opening the window a little wider at which point I would terminate the threat.
ALWAYS carry! - NEVER tell!
"A superior Operator is best defined as someone who uses his superior
judgement to keep himself out of situations that would require a display of his