October 21st, 2008 09:21 AM
Clear my house - Help me do it safely.
I have two defensive scenarios that I'd like help with. They both involve clearing my house. I have a T-intersection upstairs that poses a problem for me. I know that I have to move through it quickly and I will be exposed at some point. my bedroom also has a nice hallway that leads to it...it is a great "fatal funnel" for the bad guys.
Situation #1: I am upstairs, in bed, and hear a bump in the night. I hear breaking glass or a door busts open and I know there is a bad guy downstairs. Not sure if anyone has made it upstairs yet(I am a sound sleeper).
My first priority in this situation is to get my kids from their rooms and get them, and my wife, back into the master bedroom safely to call the police. Our best bet in this situation is to hold up in the master bedroom and not go searching for trouble in other areas ofthe house. I sleep next to my .40 and there is a 12gauge under the bed.
What is the best route to take to get the kids. Assume the guest room door is closed as it normally is. I would think I have my wife guard the stairs with the 12 while I clear the kids room to scoop them up and then retreat back to the master. What is best route I should take to do this?
Situation#2: I come home and something doesn't feel right(nothing bad observed that would warrant calling the cops). I want to do a sweep of my house with my .40. Starting at the bottom of the stairs, what is the best way to clear all of the rooms upstairs?
My tricky floorplan:
Speak softly, and carry a big stick.
October 21st, 2008 10:16 AM
For situation #1:
The best route is straight down the hallway; that maximizes distance and your visual. The tricky (read dangerous) part is all the doors - they are all threat areas. The BG could already be in any one of them.
Since the guest bedroom door is closed, that helps.With it closed a BG can't see you without opening it; if it opens it'll be a cue.
If you really believe there's a imminent threat you have to 'clear' both of the children's rooms. The doorways and closets are all threat areas, in fact anything you can't see through, around, over, or under is a threat area.
Assuming you have your children, you now face 'clearing' your way back to the master BR. If your wife has been watching the hallway, she can tell you if it's still clear, without her, you could not assume that because it was clear on the way to the kids, it is still clear.
Plus, if a BG appeared behind you and the kids, the wife is armed, the BG may be, you, your kids, and your wife are all in a line with the BG - very, very bad.
As for situation #2:
Assuming your children are not upstairs, don't go. I know we don't want to call the police, but clearing a house is very, very dangerous, even moreso if you are alone. First, stairways are especially menacing and dangerous. Then when you get to the top of the stairs you basically have a four way intersection and there is no way one man can clear this configuration without turning your back to an uncleared area. If you make one mistake it could be your last.
Based on a bunch of FOF scenario training I've had, your house is a nightmare for one person to clear, and don't feel bad, most all houses are nightmares for one person to clear. I've even had two opportunities to clear a house with the local LEO. One was frightening because of poor tactics on the part of the officer, the next time two cops and I went in and that didn't seem so bad - they had much better tactics.
Call the cops, let a bunch of them check it out.
I'm too young to be this old!
Getting old isn't good for you!
October 21st, 2008 10:37 AM
I read an article that stated, statistics prove that it takes a minimum of 3 people to effectively clear a building. If even 1 bad guy has a weapon and intends to use it, 1 of those 3 people will sustain an injury 98% of the time.
Unfortunately the LEOs in my town might show up within 40 minutes, if at all. My knowledge of this is actual experience with our local LE agency (nice huh?).
Last edited by G96X0; October 21st, 2008 at 10:42 AM.
October 21st, 2008 10:38 AM
Its always tough to clear a building on your own; but honestly, your floor plan is pretty easy.
As a precaution, I'd keep your guest room closed and provide myself with some visual clue if someone has entered there or not.
Other than that, I wont even attempt to teach you how to clear a building via the internet.
Last edited by SIXTO; October 21st, 2008 at 12:50 PM.
"Just blame Sixto"
October 21st, 2008 10:46 AM
Tangle's take on the situations is a real good one. WRT clearing your house ANY time, remember that doorways and hallways are 'funnels' and considered kill-zones. SIT#1:If you and your wife are up quickly enough, your sceaniro...wife covering the stairsand you retrieving the children, is a good one. I would add that your Master Bathroom should be your 'safe-room'....layred security with two sets of doors betwen you and the BG's.
SIT#2: Call the cops and STAY OUT! If the children are home, well do what you gotta do.
"Just getting a concealed carry permit means you haven't commited a crime yet. CCP holders commit crimes." Daniel Vice, senior attorney for the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence, quoted on Fox & Friends, 8 Jul, 2008
(Sometimes) "a fight avioded is a fight won." ... claude clay
October 21st, 2008 10:53 AM
Looking at your layout.
If the 12 guage is the only other unsecure gun in the house and your wife is trained with it.
Arm wife with it and clear the nursey while she is holding the ground at the small inlet space between the bedrooms and bring child 1 to her and let her follow into toddler's room while you clear it and stand your ground there!
Do not return into hallway and call police.
The reason being the master bedroom in my thought's is a target area for theft and if someone want's to do harm they will go after adult's first.
And by looking at your layout that give's you the advatange of being behind the perp's when they go toward the master bedroom, cornering them in if needed and still allowing a escape path for the wife and kid's out behind you.
And if the door on the toddlers room swing's in the direction shown you get a perfect peek spot to watch the hallway without giving yourself away unless they come to that door.
A good thing to do is to let the kid's or you choose something to go on there door that show's off it's a kid's room. Yes you may think that could casue a problem but if it's theft they are after that makes your room the prime target and atleast give's advatage to you.
Btw: get a doorway sensor like they use in store's to annouce visitor's and put it at the start of the hallway with the quiet bell in the master bedroom. This would give the adavtage to know if someone come's upstairs even if in toddler room standing your ground.
Keep the wife and kid's OUT!
My method is my wife knows to never get out of the car or get back in with the kids quickly if i tell her to, and fire up the motor. If i don't come out within a few min's for her or if she hear's shot's or yelling or if someone else come's to door. BUG OUT!!! And get clear and safe and call police.
Without seeing bottom floor plan i can't give a accurate. But seperate each section into threat's, eliminating everthing while keeping a eye on the staircase and listening for the doorway alarm you installed (Situation 1) in the hallway upstairs.
They will do one of three thing's.
Hide - Beaware of good hiding location's and check them safely.
Attack you - Stay safe and watch out around corner's.
Flee - Any entrance to your house become's a danger zone.
A good thing to do is to beaware of your belonging's in your house very well to notice small change's to see if stuff has been disturbed.
October 21st, 2008 10:57 AM
Thanks for the replys, but I want to emphesize a couple points:
Situation #1: What I want to know is a specific route plan on how do we effectively get the kids?
Here is the type of thing I'm looking for(and what I perceived as correct):
Do we both go down the hallway(armed), one quick clears the hallway bathroom, Then the wife watches the stairs and toddler room from guest room entrance area with shotgun while I quickly enter nursery, clear it and take baby to master bedroom. Then I come back and do the same for toddler room...we both retreat back down the cleared hallway into master bedroom to safety?
Situation #2: Again, there is no alarm or real warning signs that warrant calling the cops. But I don't just want to venture through my house in condition white or even yellow. I want to make sure, something not feeling right isn't a reason to call the cops always(the boy who cried wolf comes to mind). What route do I take to effectively clear the upstairs by myself...I realize it's tricky but it's something that needs to be done?
EDIT: Thanks Toba, good ideas...that really gives me some food for thought !
Speak softly, and carry a big stick.
October 21st, 2008 11:58 AM
Something to consider
You might want look at a privacy lock on the guest bedroom door. The one that uses a straight pin like a piece of clothes hanger, as a key. Then if you don't constantly use the room, just keep it locked and remove it from the equation. It also adds a little privacy for your occasional guest and should one of the kids lock themselves in, you can access without having to worry about a specific key.
October 21st, 2008 12:24 PM
Child safety gates across the top and bottom of the stairs, with bells or something attached to them.
October 21st, 2008 12:30 PM
Situation 1: Move with wife down hallway. She covers stairs while you clear hall bathroom. She then maintains position in the hall bathroom doorway and overwatches the stairs and toddler's room while you clear the nursery and move the baby back. You then move back and clear the toddler's room. She collapses down and follows you as you pass the bathroom and wait for the police. This allows her to observe your back as you enter the nursery as well as the stairs without being in the fatal funnel immediately before the guest bedroom door. If there is a guy in there and he hears noises he may shoot through the door. Unlikely but possible and there is no reason to put here in the way there. The guy could in theory open the guest bedroom door and begin to move towards you but once he moved into the main hallway she would be able to see him. That's the best way to do it with your resources, in my humble opinion.
October 21st, 2008 02:43 PM
You should get an alarm system installed. No need for the type that comes with monitoring and costs a monthly fee, what you want is something that will wake you up the moment the BGs enter your house. When the alarm goes off, there is a chance right there that they will decide it is not worth it and leave. If they do not, you have been woken up within plenty of time to get to the hallway to protect the kids before they get to the stairs.
Originally Posted by youngda9
"Trust in God with hand on sword"
-Inscription on my family's coat of arms from medieval England
---Carry options: G26/MTAC, PF9/MiniTuck, PPK/Pocket, USP40/OWB---
---NOTE: I am not an expert. If I ever start acting like a know-it-all, please call me on it immediately.
October 21st, 2008 02:58 PM
Originally Posted by GWRedDragon
You are perfectly capable of calling 911 free when the alarm goes off.
The muzzle end of a .45 pretty much says, "Go Away" in every language.
Fast is fine, accuracy is final. Learn to be slow in a hurry.
"I never met a man that had been in a gunfight and wished that he had a smaller gun. Ever."
October 21st, 2008 03:03 PM
I need a little more info like what is your address, where do you keep the safe, where do you hide the gold,silver and diamonds? What time is the house empty? Just kidding.
October 21st, 2008 03:10 PM
You're thinking "inside the box", asking "How do I clear my house?"
Listen to what everybody says: houseclearing is DANGEROUS. Then, change the question: "Why would I NEED to clear my house?" Answer: because the BG might be able to reach a position from which he threatens my loved ones.
Fix THAT problem, instead.
Install a decorative but functional wrought iron gate, in a sturdy frame, at the top of the stairs, secure it at night, and be done with it.
October 21st, 2008 03:43 PM
I don't know how you would go about doing it, but if you go this route make sure it doesnt become a death trap in a fire.
Originally Posted by Sergeant Mac
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