Middle of night - door is kicked in - do you shoot?

This is a discussion on Middle of night - door is kicked in - do you shoot? within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; If your door is kicked in and you hear people rushing into the house, do you shoot first? Or do you take time to ask ...

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Thread: Middle of night - door is kicked in - do you shoot?

  1. #1
    Senior Member Array Chevy-SS's Avatar
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    Middle of night - door is kicked in - do you shoot?

    If your door is kicked in and you hear people rushing into the house, do you shoot first? Or do you take time to ask if they're police?

    I refer to the latest tragedy as a result of the "no knock" raids that police seem intent upon forcing on the American public. Here's the latest example. Why couldn't they just arrest the guy when he went to the store or something?
    Pa. woman charged after FBI agent shot, killed - USATODAY.com

    "No knock" raids are reckless and reprehensible IMO, and they should be stopped immediately, for all but the most serious of criminals.

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    'Be careful, even in small matters' - Miyamoto Musashi

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    VIP Member Array dukalmighty's Avatar
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    I'm not doing anything criminal,but they have hit the wrong house before.#1 before I shoot I will identify my target,I also believe if the cops hit the wrong house then they are illegally entering my home anyway and If I shoot in fear for my life ,hopefully a jury will realise that the cops screwed up and just because somebody yells cops ,and I'm not doing anything to warrant a raid then I'm going to believe It's criminals doing a home invasion acting like cops.
    "Outside of the killings, Washington has one of the lowest crime rates in the country,"
    --Mayor Marion Barry, Washington , DC .

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    Both reprehensible and stupid.

    Hopefully, these bad outcomes will teach the management some lessons; when will they ever learn?

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    Ex Member Array JOHNSMITH's Avatar
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    I've thought about this too. Unfortunately, I doubt any jury is going to agree with you. I do believe that if it was an honest mistake, then so be it. It would be tragic but how would the homeowner have known?

    Anyway, I guess the only thing to is "hope." Hope that you see them right as they come in, with their long guns and tac lights, dressed in ninja gear. I'd just hate for them to break into the bedroom of someone, prompting a very quick response by the innocent homeowner.

    Bad situation. I also do not like no-knock warrants at all. The problem is that a mistake is a mistake, and that even if they do save it for the worst criminal, there's still the risk they may hit a nearby, uninvolved house.

    Hope is a bad place to be when we're talking about things that matter; but what else can you do?

    "I'm from the government and I'm here to help"

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    Senior Member Array Paladin132's Avatar
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    Duck, I wish I could cite the city it happened in but I remember reading where that happened, and the repercussions. Remember, a SWAT team is going to engage you once you fire. Not saying what I would do, but I will say once you shoot a officer you are going to have the strict attention of many fairly well trained and armed officers devoted to you. In the story they killed the man that shot at them while trying to help their fallen comrad. Also remember, the guys kickin in the door more than likely aren't making the call to do it (in most places they don't at all) and while I agree they hit the wrong place and are messing up sometimes, and well it would suck for them to get shot, I also understand with the things happening in this world that I wouldn't want to hold the homeowner responsible at all. Its a all - round lousy situation.

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    VIP Member Array hogdaddy's Avatar
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    Sonds like they had right house JMO /BUT my door kicked in i would moore than likely Let LEAD FLY IF you mistake only mobil home amunst ten houses You Need LEAD

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    VIP Member Array dukalmighty's Avatar
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    The story above involved people that were dealing drugs out of their home and if the husband knew they were cops by running downstairs to flush cocaine why didn't his wife.There was an incident in Michigan IIRC where a huang immigrants house was hit by a swat team and the guy fired at them and they returned over 38 shots before his son could tell him they were cops,I can't remember if any cops were hit.but the guy was justified
    "Outside of the killings, Washington has one of the lowest crime rates in the country,"
    --Mayor Marion Barry, Washington , DC .

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    There is no illegal activity in my home. I also know the neighbors pretty well and could say the same for about 5 houses in any direction.
    If someone kicks in my door, the perceived threat will be met with enough force to stop the threat.
    I'll worry about who it was after the threat is ended.

    Stay armed...stay safe!
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    VIP Member Array Eagleks's Avatar
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    They better be wearing a big POLICE on their shirts, and yell out "POLICE" , and then be convincing that they really are the Police.

    It's best they not knock down the door, a knock would work fine, since there is nothing here or with me that should gain their interests. But, if it did occur ... I might not hear them yelling "police" ... since I have a hearing issue, and if my glasses aren't on I wouldn't be able to read their shirts anyway... and might shoot the silhoutte, especially if they are aggressively coming at me.

    I think no-knock warrants are something they should think really hard before doing. And, if they innocently get shot in the process.... that's a risk the Police Dept is accepting.

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    VIP Member Array goldshellback's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chevy-SS View Post
    If your door is kicked in and you hear people rushing into the house, do you shoot first? Or do you take time to ask if they're police?
    Violently entering my home would be bad. 'No-Knocks' have thier place, BUT, those in charge better have NO DOUBT as to who and EXACTLY where they "arn't knocking". There'a a case in Atlanta where several cops have been convicted after 'hitting' the wrong house. Cops Defend Shooting 92-Year-Old Woman, Elderly Atlanta Woman Dies After Shootout With Cops, Who Say She Shot At Them First - CBS News
    "Just getting a concealed carry permit means you haven't commited a crime yet. CCP holders commit crimes." Daniel Vice, senior attorney for the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence, quoted on Fox & Friends, 8 Jul, 2008

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    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
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    Middle of night - door is kicked in - do you shoot?
    Violent entry to my home will end violently, absolutely. There's almost no way to discern an "honest mistake" when that sort of entry is being made.
    Your best weapon is your brain. Don't leave home without it.
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    Senior Member Array cwblanco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by paul34 View Post
    I've thought about this too. Unfortunately, I doubt any jury is going to agree with you. I do believe that if it was an honest mistake, then so be it. It would be tragic but how would the homeowner have known?
    I once defendanted a civil rights no-knock wrong-apartment case in Federal Court. We had to try it twice. See:

    Duncan v. Barnes - AltLaw

    Admittedly, the circumstances are chaotic. A sledge hammer was used to break down the doors to make a quick entry. Fortunately no one was hurt. It was embarrassing for all involved.

    Because no-knock entry was legal, based upon the jury instructions, the jury was lenient with the law officers for an honest mistake where the warrant described the wrong apartment.

    Still though, the thought of it happening is frightening. I always have wondered what would have happened if the occupants had been armed and ready.

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    Senior Member Array Duisburg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by paul34 View Post
    I've thought about this too. Unfortunately, I doubt any jury is going to agree with you. I do believe that if it was an honest mistake, then so be it. It would be tragic but how would the homeowner have known?


    Bad situation. I also do not like no-knock warrants at all. The problem is that a mistake is a mistake, and that even if they do save it for the worst criminal, there's still the risk they may hit a nearby, uninvolved house.

    "I'm from the government and I'm here to help"


    +1 to that! Your home is your castle
    I am sworn to protect the Constitution of the U.S.A. from all threats both foreign and domestic.

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    Distinguished Member Array Rcher's Avatar
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    A deliberate illegal forced entry into my home will be met with force until the threat has ended ... period. There are no illegal activities in my home, ever.

    >>---->
    "Government is not the solution to our problem; government IS the problem". - Ronald Reagan 1981

  15. #15
    Senior Member Array Duisburg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ccw9mm View Post
    Violent entry to my home will end violently, absolutely. There's almost no way to discern an "honest mistake" when that sort of entry is being made.
    +1
    I agree 100%

    Violent entry into my home will end VERY violently, no matter how honest the "mistake" is. Training teaches cops, SWAT and Military that mistakes can kill.

    I am sworn to protect the Constitution of the U.S.A. from all threats both foreign and domestic.

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