Creepy situation that led me to carrying..what I can carry

Creepy situation that led me to carrying..what I can carry

This is a discussion on Creepy situation that led me to carrying..what I can carry within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I'm in California, so I can't carry a gun (worst feeling ever), but I'm still in the process of looking for a gun for home ...

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Thread: Creepy situation that led me to carrying..what I can carry

  1. #1
    Member Array knifeone's Avatar
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    Creepy situation that led me to carrying..what I can carry

    I'm in California, so I can't carry a gun (worst feeling ever), but I'm still in the process of looking for a gun for home defense. Currently, I carry two folding knives when I'm out and about and have a large double-edged fixed blade for home defense. Before the following incident happened, I only carried a small SAK, steel-toed boots, hand-to-hand training, and very good situational awareness. Good thing for now on is, even though I didn't carry knives I sure know how to fight with them : ) Man, I wish I would have had a proper knife when this was happening.

    About a month ago, my sister and her friend (both fun-loving, carefree, good-natured teenagers) asked me to take them to Walmart/Wally World to look for some school stuff, so I said sure. We left the house at about 6:30pm, put some gas in the tank, and got to Walmart at around 6:50pm or so.

    I was following behind them sizing up everything and everyone and noticed a big, tall older man who was dressed up in Cowboy boots, jeans, and a flannel type shirt. He was about 6'4", 200lbs. I immediately got a strange vibe from him even after just seeing him for the first time.

    I kept following the girls. We were downstairs about two more minutes before we headed upstairs. Approximately three to four minutes later, he walked by us while we were upstairs. Strong coincidence he's up there a few minutes after we go upstairs? Not likely, but I immediately informed the girls of what was happening. I told them what happened downstairs and they didn't even see him then. It was weird because even though upstairs walking by once was the first time they saw him, they immediately caught on to what I told them about him following us and they were starting to get scared. I assured them I could take him out if he didn't have a gun, but I was getting the vibe that he might very well be carrying.

    After I informed them, we all wanted to get the heck out of the store. We headed for the escalator, got on and as we were proceeding to get on, he was looking over a shelf at us at my 2-3o'clock position about 20ft away from the escalator. At this point, I'm starting to freak out a bit myself.

    Things get worse.

    At 6/10th's the way down the escalator my sister's friend is giving me a look of utter shock and tells me that he's on the escalator as we're on it. He's about 1.5/10th's the way down at this point. Quick thinking girl says to me super fast, if we turn around and go back up, that proves 100% that he's following us. We get off, turn two paces to our left and hop back on the escalator going up. When he gets to the bottom of the escalator, he very swiftly walked to the elevator, got in, and was heading back up.

    We sure as heck didn't want to meet him at the top. Honestly, at this point, I wasn't going to be surprised by anything he might have tried. I earlier told them that we would do whatever it took to get away even if that meant knocking everything over in the store, running over to get a machete, anything.

    So, as we're heading up we run down the escalator and jump off, quickly pay for the things (since we figured this move would buy us at least 5 minutes), and bolted the heck out of the store. I wanted to report this more than anything, but I honestly wasn't sure what to do. I was so afraid that he might attempt something on someone else in the store.

    Anyways, we run to the car, get in, drive away as fast as possible and take a super bizarre, twist and turn way of getting back home to make sure we were not somehow followed.

    After this I bought a flashlight and pepper spray for my mom and sister and I bought a bunch of knives for myself. I had a huge talk with them. My heart nearly stopped pumping after I informed my family of what could have possibly happened if I wasn't there with them. My sister and friend probably wouldn't have even been aware of him until it was too late. I could barely even type that sentence. Enough of that.

    This man had his sights on them. He wanted them and no one else at the time. We were the only thing on his radar.

    --------

    If you want to keep reading, I sort of have more, but it's a different incident. I enjoy reading the long stories you guys post in this section so much, so I'm thinking a lot of you great people will as well.

    About 5 days ago, I got home at roughly 10:30p.m. I park on the side of the curb with my car going up the street. Left tires against curb. I'm making sure I got everything before heading inside and as I'm doing so, I see a car driving towards me. I live in a middle-class suburb type development with homes being about 20ft away from each other or some such. I really don't think anything of the car coming, I mean it's only 10:30p.m., however my neighborhood does wind down really early for some reason.

    This was the same car I saw in my rear view mirror all the way down at the other side of the street. It was the same car as my ex-girlfriend, so I was thinking maybe she was thinking about me or something and was in the area and wanted to just drive by my house.

    As the car is approaching this direction though and soon becomes almost parallel with my car, I notice multiple black men in their mid-to-late twenties. I'm not racist or anything, but there isn't a single black person in this entire development of hundreds of homes. Also, they were driving pretty darn slow as they drove past my car. I honestly was preparing myself for a potential drive-by. If it was one guy, I wouldn't have been as concerned, but this was a car full of 4-5 black men that looked like they were up to no good. They just didn't look like they belonged anywhere near here.

    So that's twice I've seen them so far, but they've only seen me once. Once they get to the end of the street, I'm about to get out, but I see them make an illegal u-turn at the three way stop and figure that if I get out I won't be able to make it inside and close the electric garage door in time, so I'm still sitting in my car and they are driving down the street slowly and they look at me and continue driving. Once they get to the end of the street, they make an illegal u-turn AGAIN and drive up the street towards me, slowly, and once they get to the stop at the end, they proceed to drive into another section of the development. There are only three possibly vehicle exits and where they were going wasn't one of them.

    I hurried my butt inside, woke my Dad up, told me what happened and asked what I should do about this. He said to call 911 (he seemed concerned about the situation but not overly, act now, holy crap concerned), I said I wasn't sure about that as I'm not sure if it's emergency worthy, so I call the Sheriff's department and tell them what happened. They said they would have a car patrol the area for the rest of the night. I was looking out the front window of the house for nearly 40 minutes and didn't yet see the police drive by yet (maybe they did, maybe they didn't). At least it was reported though.

    After this, I had a huge talk about getting guns to protect the house and my Dad is all for it, so we are in search of two handguns at the moment. Awesome for defense and it will be a heck of a lot of fun for us to shoot together at the range.

    About 5 months before this, I had a similar incident with a strange vehicle driving slow in the neighborhood, but I didn't report it as it wasn't quite blatant enough in my opinion. Not even CLOSE to this.

    Is there anything I could have done differently guys? Any other thoughts? Have anything similar to this happen? Whatever is on your mind, please feel free to discuss.

    I'm really looking forward to your responses.

    edit:

    One other thought that I mine as well add here is that I can't believe how complacent my neighbors are and people in general. If bad guys wanted to do something, it would be so easy. Also, just when I'm at stores, it's crazy noticing how open people leave themselves. I especially worry for women and children with non-protective parents : (


  2. #2
    VIP Member Array KenpoTex's Avatar
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    1st story: Sounds like you did fine, your SA allowed you to see the threat, you left, problem solved. I don't know that I would have bothered to stop and check out since that might have cost you the time you gained but you lucked out this time.
    Getting flashlights and OC, etc. is fine but none of that does any good without the ability to see a threat coming and the training to deal with it. See about getting your family members some sort of training, even if it's just a weekend seminar or something. Have them read Principles of Personal Defense by Col. Jeff Cooper, and The Gift Of Fear by Gavin DeBecker.

    2nd story:
    sounds like they were definitely "casing" your neighborhood...you called the cops, that's about all you can do. Consider "beefing up" your home security. Motion lights, good locks, a dog, etc. All of these things will help make your home a harder target.
    "Being a predator isn't always comfortable but the only other option is to be prey. That is not an acceptable option." ~Phil Messina

    If you carry in Condition 3, you have two empty chambers. One in the weapon...the other between your ears.

    Matt K.

  3. #3
    Senior Member Array Rotorblade's Avatar
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    First story sounds like the guy might have been store security........

    Would you have done anything differently in either case if you had been armed?

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rotorblade View Post
    First story sounds like the guy might have been store security........

    Would you have done anything differently in either case if you had been armed?
    Sounds about right. Teen girls are usually high up on the list of typical shoplifters. Contacting a store employee would probably have been a good idea. If the guy was not sore security at least they would have been able to follow and have a decent overview of the guy and his actions.
    Most kidnappers (whatever) will not grab someone in a crowded area. Parking lots , ect are much more likely dangerous areas.


    Second story, get a plate # and description of the car & occupants.
    "In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." Thomas Jefferson


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  5. #5
    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by knifeone View Post
    I'm in California, so I can't carry a gun ...
    Actually, as you probably know, California is a "might-issue" state, in which the power over your CHL issuance is in the hands of the county sheriff of the county in which you reside. Reside in a county with an honorable sheriff, and getting a CHL is a good as done. BTDT, myself, having lived in Kali for years.

    ... and have a large double-edged fixed blade for home defense.
    You are certainly legally allowed in Kali to have weapons at home, for defensive purposes. Simply ensure they're of the non-banned variety, and that you have a safe for proper storage when it's not on your hip, then you'll be fine.

    About a month ago, my sister and her friend (both fun-loving, carefree, good-natured teenagers) asked me to take them to Walmart/Wally World ... at around 6:50pm or so.
    First mistake. WalMart has become a known hangout for thugs and thieves looking to deprive people of their stuff and their lives. Stories abound regarding crimes from theft, assault and muggings to truly heinous things, all because they were marked and targeted at WalMart. In many respects, it has become a criminal meat market to be avoided. At some point, mere good pricing isn't worth it. But then, situations like this are happening all over.

    Anyways, we run to the car, get in, drive away as fast as possible and take a super bizarre, twist and turn way of getting back home to make sure we were not somehow followed.
    Good thinking, if you think you might be followed.

    This man had his sights on them. He wanted them and no one else at the time. We were the only thing on his radar.
    Laws supporting the carrying and use of defensive weaponry defensively, in dangerous/violent situations, are what legally cover upstanding people from doing the honorable thing of defending themselves against lawless attack. Even in California, the laws support this.

    I hurried my butt inside, woke my Dad up ...

    Is there anything I could have done differently guys?
    Hm. An apparent stalking of you with five possibly armed thugs, and you enter your home. At this point, they now know where you live. Caution.

    ... so we are in search of two handguns at the moment. Awesome for defense and it will be a heck of a lot of fun for us to shoot together at the range.
    I've got a CZ P-01 9mm semi-auto (14+1, 3.9" bbl) and love it. It's small and light enough to carry, if you ever get to that point, large enough to have balance and control when shooting, and numerous holster makers cover the model. Extremely reliable and accurate. Probably one of the most under-valued pistols on the market today.

    Suggestion for a safe, if you're going to have a couple/three pistols in the house: American Security (AMSEC), which you can find either online on CraigsList used, at a reputable safe/security shop, or online at places like Home Safe Superstore. Uncertain whereabouts in California you are, but you can search CraigsList fairly effectively with this sort of query on Google: "+site:craigslist.org +intitle:amsec +safe", or narrowing down to your specific CraigsList city.

    Good luck on the pistol search.

    If interested in learning more about concealed carry in California, there are two decent forums I'm aware of: CalCCW.com and CaliforniaCCW.org. Lots of good information in there, including about how to pursue CHL in tough-to-get counties.
    Your best weapon is your brain. Don't leave home without it.
    Thoughts: Justifiable self defense (A.O.J.).
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  6. #6
    VIP Member Array NCHornet's Avatar
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    I didn't read the second but the first story I would have let him see me using my cel phone, even if I was faking it. I also would have never of paid for the items I would have been gone. Another thing, something similar happened to my wife before Christmas, some creep was following her around Walmart and making nasty comments to her. When she took out her cel phone, she told the guy she was calling her husband and he needed to prepare for a beating!! I told her to head for customer service and ask one of the biggest guys that works there to walk her out to her car. Just some things to think about in the future.
    When Seconds Count, The Cops Are Just Minutes Away!!
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  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rotorblade View Post
    First story sounds like the guy might have been store security........

    Would you have done anything differently in either case if you had been armed?
    Yup, two teen girls in a store who appear to be by themselves?...

    Store security for sure. Store security almost never "looks" like store security. I'd have been much more concerned if the guy had been dressed more normally.

    On the second story; I think the OP was right to be very concerned. Awareness was a good "first weapon" there, and being prepared for an escalation would have been advised.

  8. #8
    VIP Member Array paramedic70002's Avatar
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    You were in a two story Wal Mart?
    "Each worker carried his sword strapped to his side." Nehemiah 4:18

    Guns Save Lives. Paramedics Save Lives. But...
    Paramedics With Guns Scare People!

  9. #9
    Senior Member Array JohnKelly's Avatar
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    Good situational awareness. While the first guy may have been security, you got that vibe that he was a possible threat and you followed your instincts. Good job on both cases!

    (edited to add:)

    Your best weapon in any situation will always be the one between your ears. Even when armed, always keep your situational awareness up and scanning.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by paramedic70002 View Post
    You were in a two story Wal Mart?
    I was thinking the same thing.

    The "creepy" guy sounds like he was likely a loss prevention guy.
    Turn the election's in 2014 to a "2A Revolution". It will serve as a 1994 refresher not to "infringe" on our Second Amendment. We know who they are now.........SEND 'EM HOME. Our success in this will be proportional to how hard we work to make it happen.

  11. #11
    Member Array athos76's Avatar
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    I worked Loss Prevention for Wally for a year. Teens were my number one bust. And out of all the teens I busted, 85% were girls. I've busted the full spectrum, from old women to men in business suits. My favorite was a 370 lb woman in a moo-moo who stole 5 vcrs and a multitude of other electronics. When the police searched her vehicle, they found around $30k in Walmart goods.


    Although the first guy could have been security or LP... you still did good. Most LP that I've worked with won't follow a person like that. And we were usually in communication with someone on cameras so we wouldn't walk right out in front of a case.
    The second story... License plate, vehicle description, number of perps and a call to 911...let the LEOs determine if its a false alarm or not.
    "carrying a gun is a lot lighter than carrying a cop in your pocket" -MrTwice99

  12. #12
    Member Array GotSig?'s Avatar
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    Definitely LP, I have caught the ones in my local walmart acting mall ninja-ish all the time Creeping around, peeking around corners, etc.
    كافر(Infidel)
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