Situation over the past weekend (was I wrong?)

This is a discussion on Situation over the past weekend (was I wrong?) within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; To clarify; I have not been officially charged with anything; I want to make sure that's known. I've been told to report to the PD ...

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Thread: Situation over the past weekend (was I wrong?)

  1. #46
    Member Array novcdtshotz's Avatar
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    To clarify; I have not been officially charged with anything; I want to make sure that's known.

    I've been told to report to the PD on Thursday for "follow-up action." As someone here has pointed out (as did my lawyer, and my LEO / lawyer buddies) .. this is a common way to get someone to in effect "turn themselves in." The worst-case scenario is the one that seems to be bubbling up as "what's going to happen," to date, nothing has actually "happened."

    My lawyer has dealt extensively with this type of thing before, and says that it's entirely likely that I will face charges, and has seen it happen in the past; but we'll wait until Thursday to get the final word. I will keep everyone updated as more info becomes available.

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  3. #47
    New Member Array Editingfx's Avatar
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    says that it's entirely likely that I will face charges, and has seen it happen in the past
    If good wishes are worth anything, no doubt your karma will be full to the brim with support of all of us here. Ludicrous that you need to legally defend yourself from the situation you posted. Cheers, mate.

  4. #48
    mrm
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    Member Array mrm's Avatar
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    If this happened exaclty like you say then either your state is stupid or the cops are what the heck were you supposed to do give him the keys, I would have done the exact same thing. But then again Im in Montana where it seems we are still somwhat free.
    "I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use."
    - Galileo Galilei (1564-1642)

  5. #49
    Ex Member Array NavyLT's Avatar
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    Good luck to you, my friend, from me too. I hope it all turns out OK.

  6. #50
    Member Array nlax2011's Avatar
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    Good luck this week!! +1 to taking the lawyer with you.

    I'd also limit what you say on here.

  7. #51
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    What is the law, what is not the law, how it is interpreted...who knows. The system is not always fair and does not always do what is right. Whether you are charged or not - what will be, will be, as in up to the prosecutors office.

    First, stop talking about it to friends, and folks on the board. Stop talking to anyone. Shut up (meant politely). Anything you say or write...

    Second, get in touch with a lawyer asap, and have him with you when you go to the appointment on Thursday. A little $ spent now could save you a whole lotta hastle later.

    Third, don't change the story, don't invent things, don't offer up details unless asked. Don't bring up the screwdriver of the bad guy, etc. Stick to the facts and only answer what the attorney tells you to answer.

    In 6 - 12 months, you may have a good experience to relate to the board. Good luck, but especially remember #1 above.

  8. #52
    VIP Member Array Patti's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by novcdtshotz View Post
    It's a long time LEO friend who told me to be ready to be charged; I was called by the police dept. and told to report to the station later this week for "follow up," that's where he got the "watch your butt on this one" feeling. He gave me the name of a good attorney he's dealt with personally, and I've already consulted. I'll be retaining him if this goes badly.

    He says he's seen a lot of stupid stuff, and more than once has seen the "victim" turned into the accused. His argument is a worst-case one (which I appreciate, because I'd rather be prepared than caught off guard). He thinks that if the guy gets a good attorney, he could spin me gripping my pistol as "threatening intent," and that I was "holding this person against their will with a deadly weapon."

    I have some friends in the PD here, and they're a mixed bag of opinions. Some are sure that nothing will come back at me, but another is of the "be prepared for the worst, I've seen it happen" mentality.

    I work in the defense community, so a lot of my co-workers are former military / LEO. Their opinions have been everything from "walk away and call the cops" to "I'da shot his butt on the spot."
    DO NOT go to the PD without your attorney. Your cop friend is giving you a good heads-up.

    Heed the warning.
    Socialism is the philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance and the gospel of envy. Winston Churchill

  9. #53
    Distinguished Member Array Anubis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by novcdtshotz View Post
    Lying to the police is not an option.
    True. Not talking to the police is an option. It's hard to believe your lawyer is OK with the voluntary trip to the police station. Seems like it would have been better to have declined the invitation; if they want to charge you they will arrest you, if not they will leave you alone.

    Good luck!

  10. #54
    Member Array twocan's Avatar
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    This situation is exactly the reason that we need to get the laws changed so that the criminal is not allowed to sue the law abiding citizen because the criminal got caught while breaking the law.

    We all need to focus on controlling the lawyes by changing the laws that allow this kind of foolishness.

    Thoughts will be with you on Thursday.

    Capt. Art

  11. #55
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    You did what I would have done...legal help can never hurt.

    This dirtbag is fortunate that he did not try this stunt in TX...as he may have been shot off of the bike....

    It's a shame that we have to have an attorney to be with us at the police station, but if they are asking for more info from you...let the lawyer do your talking. It will be a few hundred dollars well spent.

    Stay armed...from another Hog man...stay safe!
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  12. #56
    Member Array novcdtshotz's Avatar
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    Streetfighter guy myself

    Not to worry; the hog is in the future! I'm getting too old for this thing!

    I'll be light on details the next few days; don't worry, once everything's straightened out I'll give an update (good or bad )

  13. #57
    Member Array KralBlbec's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by retsupt99 View Post
    It's a shame that we have to have an attorney to be with us at the police station, but if they are asking for more info from you...let the lawyer do your talking. It will be a few hundred dollars well spent.

    Stay armed...from another Hog man...stay safe!
    I just looked it up for what it would be here in Washington in the law books. We actually have a provision that specifies that anyone found to have been justified in their use of force in defense of self, others, or property cannot be prosecuted AND that all legal fees incurred will be paid by the court. I'd recommend to look it up and see if there is anything similar there.

  14. #58
    VIP Member Array Tom G's Avatar
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    There are a lot of so called experts who will tell you every thing about the law they think they know. You made a citizens arrest and never drew your gun. Any cop with common sense would would see that you were in the right.

  15. #59
    VIP Member Array grady's Avatar
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    I think you did good. What were you supposed to do, say "Please, mister, will you not steal my bike and not hurt me?"

    I think you showed tremendous retraint.

    Good job on contacting a lawyer. Hope he or she is a good one. Anti's abound and are sometimes dressed in robes, suits, or uniforms.

  16. #60
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    +1 on getting an attorney, because I am certainly not one.

    A couple of things I see in your favor.

    If I understand correctly Va. is an open carry State, so having pistol exposed should not be considered brandishing as long as it remained in your holster. Which, apparently it did.

    Also, in my State and probably yours (you'll have to check), but it is legal to effect a citizens arrest. That is in effect, what you were doing by asking him to sit and remain on the scene until the police arrived. Also, at no time did you lay hands on the subject or prevent him from leaving if he chose to do so.

    I believe I read that there were two witnesses who came forward to support your version of events. Hopefully the police had the forethought to obtain their names, address & phone numbers when they took their statements. (pretty shotty police work if they neglected that aspect, and then try to jam you up over the event later).

    Also, you have a person in the act of committing a felony who had a makeshift edged weapon, which is a deadly weapon. I have a couple of dozen post mortem photos of people who were killed by a screwdriver to support the lethality of such a weapon. (Now, a screwdriver is just a screwdriver unless, it is being wielded as a weapon in a threatening manner, which I feel may be some shaky ground here. It is also why retaining an attorney is such a great idea)

    I think your attorney could make a good case for you having your gun visible to the person having the knowledge of the possible lethal effects of being stabbed with a even a 3 inch screwdriver.

    I wouldn't freak out until you have something to freak out over. I can easily see that they just want you to come down to provide additional information to the detectives in follow-up.

    However, I would certainly exercise good judgment and have your attorney come with you. Either way it goes, it will be money well spent.

    Please keep us informed when it's appropriate to share more details.

    Welcome to the forum.

    I feel you acted in good faith and should have nothing to worry about.

    We are all anxious for any knowledge we can get out of this incident.
    -Bark'n
    Semper Fi


    "The gun is the great equalizer... For it is the gun, that allows the meek to repel the monsters; Whom are bigger, stronger and without conscience, prey on those who without one, would surely perish."

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