Move or die, Marine. Move or die.
This is a discussion on Move or die, Marine. Move or die. within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I work with a Marine at times. I've worked with him periodically over the last couple years and gotten to know him pretty well. He ...
March 31st, 2009 02:51 PM
Move or die, Marine. Move or die.
I work with a Marine at times. I've worked with him periodically over the last couple years and gotten to know him pretty well. He no longer serves on active duty, but once a Marine, always a Marine, right?
He says little about his active duty service, and I don't ask. However, every now and then a word or sentence will slip out and I get a glimpse of what his service entailed. He served on at least two foreign continents, and not the two most people would expect.
I've learned enough from him about weapons and self defense that I believe him when he speaks of such. It is not uncommon for him to off-handedly recommend a specific tactic or weapon, and then after several days or weeks of my independent research, I find out he is exactly on target.
He highly values knives and .45's for close-in one-man work, but he also has a great respect for shotguns and specific long guns for other situations. Oh, and he's very partial to the N-frame .357 he carried as a back-up while an LEO, although nothing will ever take the place of his service 1911 which he still carries.
When he speaks of tactics, he only deals with the quickest and most efficient way of dispatching a foe. He good-naturedly makes fun of my high-cap mags, with a couple of his favorite phrases being "Know your weapon" and "One shot, one kill". Yeh, anyone can say those phrases, but I believe he can back them up. And I believe he has.
Anyway, the other night we were shootin' the bull in private. Then the topic suddenly turns, and he begins to open up and tell me about the first time he killed a man. As he began to speak, his face immediately turned bright red, his eyes opened wider than normal, his pupils actually dilated as I watched, and the whites of his eyes became so moist and deep they almost looked translucent, sort of like the eyes of some druggees I've seen. He was reliving an event from decades ago, and his body was reacting involuntarily as if the scene was reoccurring right in front of him.
His voice slowed and dropped to little more than a whisper even though no one else was around, and this is what he said:
If we are involved in a self-defense situation, whether it involves knives, guns, or neither, we may see things we don't normally see which have the potential to cause us to freeze. We may see a victim, perhaps a friend or loved one, with blood splattered or spurting. I read a report this week where a 5-year-old was decapitated in front of witnesses before they could respond. We may see our own blood spurting and feel the unfamiliar impacts of weapons or fists.
Originally Posted by a U.S. Marine
We cannot become fixated on any grotesque scenes in front of us to the point where we fail to address the threat. I'm sure the LEO's and veterans know this already, and probably the hunters.
There has been much written about "getting off the X" when a confrontation occurs. This is along the same line of reasoning. I think this is especially important when encountering an armed assailant or multiple assailants.
Now, my friend has moved on to other careers which brought many other self-defense situations. He was an LEO for several years. More recently, he spent months in post-Katrina, and he brought back the bacterial infections to prove it. He no longer hesitates as he did when he was 19. Frankly, now he's a stone-cold killer. His shaved head doesn't give it away, but his eyes and his actions do. If anything goes down, he won't be my backup: he'll be my flank, if I can possibly react as fast as he will.
In my opinion, the advice of his sergeant still applies today to us all:
Move or die, Sheepdog. Move or die.
Last edited by grady; April 1st, 2009 at 01:07 AM.
Reason: capitalized Marine throughout
March 31st, 2009 03:12 PM
Grady, thanks for posting this.
Target Shooting isn't self defense, and I can't shoot for crap anyway. It's been said by others, and worth repeating, MOVE!
I'm moving to cover, and then looking for better cover. People think that shooting at a square range will prepare them for a self defensive encounter. It will help you learn how to shoot, but it won't help you learn how to survive. A moving target is hard to hit. Therefore, MOVE!
I understand what you wrote, in regards to your friend and the changes he underwent as he was telling the story. Tell him to take care and stay safe, and you do the same too.
March 31st, 2009 03:22 PM
Very interesting and to the point. Thanks for sharing.
I often noticed that those who "went to hell and back" very seldom talk about it.
MOVE always; who said: in a combat situation, if you have a perfect stance and grip, you are not moving fast enough !!!
The first rule of a gunfight: "Don't be there !"
The second rule: "Bring enough gun"
jfl (NRA Life Member/Instructor - GOA - IDPA - GSSF - ex-IHMSA)
March 31st, 2009 03:48 PM
good post Grady, thanks for sharing. I think the advice given to him couldn't be any better, move or die.
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants."
March 31st, 2009 04:05 PM
'Stick n' move.'
Good post Grady.
"Killers who are not deterred by laws against murder are not going to be deterred by laws against guns. " - Robert A. Levy
"A license to carry a concealed weapon does not make you a free-lance policeman." - Florida Div. of Licensing
March 31st, 2009 04:23 PM
Yes, good thread. Thanks for that.
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"The Double Tap Center Mass Boogie. Learn it, know it, love it, shoot it. Good guys should live, bad guys not so much. " - Ted Nugent 09
March 31st, 2009 04:30 PM
Grady, Thanks for a good post and the reminder. Never let yourself become a stationary target.
March 31st, 2009 04:33 PM
All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing.
March 31st, 2009 06:33 PM
Interesting post, thanks!
The last Blood Moon Tetrad for this millennium starts in April 2014 and ends in September 2015...according to NASA.
Certified Glock Armorer
NRA Life Member[/B]
March 31st, 2009 06:47 PM
Pretty insightful, good post.
Fortes Fortuna Juvat
Former, USMC 0311, OIF/OEF vet
NRA Pistol/Rifle/Shotgun/Reloading Instructor, RSO, Ohio CHL Instructor
March 31st, 2009 06:57 PM
If one is serious about training for self defense with a pistol, then the word MOVE should be ingrained into their reactions. If you do not move, then remember this acronym..... M.O.V.E. Motionless Operators Ventilate Easily .
Sometimes in life you have to stand your ground. It's a hard lesson to learn and even most adults don't get it, but in the end only I can be responsible for my life. If faced with any type of adversity, only I can overcome it. Waiting for someone else to take responsibility is a long fruitless wait.
March 31st, 2009 07:25 PM
Thank you for the post, Grady.
The tyrant dies and his rule is over, the martyr dies and his rule begins. ― The Journals of Kierkegaard
March 31st, 2009 07:40 PM
Well-written and good points made.
So much is written in threads about the gun, mags, caliber, ammo, etc., your post is written about the "platform" the gun is attached to.
Turn the election's in 2014 to a "2A Revolution". It will serve as a 1994 refresher not to "infringe" on our Second Amendment. We know who they are now.........SEND 'EM HOME. Our success in this will be proportional to how hard we work to make it happen.
April 1st, 2009 12:34 AM
Excellent post Sir, and thank you for the info. But if I may make a small correction.
A "marine" is:
1. of or pertaining to the sea; existing in or produced by the sea: marine vegetation.
2. pertaining to navigation or shipping; nautical; naval; maritime.
a "Marine" is a U.S. Marine Corp serviceman(woman).
April 1st, 2009 01:09 AM
Oops. I had a few of them right, but I've got them all right now. My apologies and thanks for the clarification.
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