The moment of truth

This is a discussion on The moment of truth within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Two months ago I was at an intersection in SW Raleigh. There were cars in front of, beside,and behind me ,waiting for the light to ...

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Thread: The moment of truth

  1. #1
    Member Array Hubadub's Avatar
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    The moment of truth

    Two months ago I was at an intersection in SW Raleigh. There were cars in front of, beside,and behind me ,waiting for the light to change. I noticed a burly blonde haired young man up ahead jerking on the other cars passenger door handles and yelling. At first I couldn`t make out what he was saying, but as he got closer, it became clear that he was demanding a ride to a nearby town. I saw him coming toward my truck and I pulled my .357 out of the center console. He pulled at my door handle and yelled that he needed to get to Clayton. I held the pistol at the ready and told him to go away and leave me alone. He then hit the window with the flat of his hand and started cursing. Thankfully, the light changed and I drove away quickly. If he had broken the window I would have shot him. I was scared but ready to defend myself if it came to that. I drove to a nearby parking lot and called the police. It was then that the shakes started. The LEO who responded said that 911 had just been swamped with calls about him and they had the dogs on the way. The fellow was probably screwed up on crack or meth or something I reckon. The policeman said that I would have been justified in using deadly force but I thank God that the light changed before I had to.
    My child is a Honor Student at Camp Polk Correctional Facility.

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  3. #2
    New Member Array Dybolic's Avatar
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    Depending on your state laws you could have been in some hot water if you decided to shoot. I recommend you read up on your state laws.

    The key factors here is he had no deadly weapon, if he had a pipe or knife, or some other blunt object in his hand it would be a clear case of self defense.

    Now technically by law you may argue that you "feared for your life" but the prosecutors are going to rip that case apart.

    Just my 2 cents, I think you handled the situation just fine.
    Phoenix AZ

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    Distinguished Member Array SonofASniper's Avatar
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    I think you did fine, and yea the shakes suck. Chances are very high you would have been justified had the person been able to enter the vehicle.

    Of course, always be aware of your state law, but thankfully you don't have to worry about the other 49 state's laws because the incident didn't take place in those.
    I will support gun control when you can guarantee all guns are removed from this planet. That includes military and law enforcement. When you can accomplish that, then I will be the last person to lay down my gun. Then I will carry the weapon that replaces the gun.

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    Ex Member Array BikerRN's Avatar
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    If you didn't shake I would be worried about you.

    "The only good gunfight is the one you didn't have." You were able to flee without resorting to deadly force. No matter how much of a, (insert derogatory descriptive term here), he was you would still be going through an ordeal that will stay with you for the rest of your life.

    Make sure the situation warrants that before firing on another human being.

    Biker

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    Member Array larefugee's Avatar
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    You could also consider driving against a red light if it looked clear. It would be a tempting alternative to having to blow away a crazy but unarmed man.

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    Member Array Hubadub's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by larefugee View Post
    You could also consider driving against a red light if it looked clear. It would be a tempting alternative to having to blow away a crazy but unarmed man.
    True,but it`s hard to drive through a red light when there are several cars in front of you.
    My child is a Honor Student at Camp Polk Correctional Facility.

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    Senior Member Array rolyat63's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dybolic View Post
    Depending on your state laws you could have been in some hot water if you decided to shoot. I recommend you read up on your state laws.

    The key factors here is he had no deadly weapon, if he had a pipe or knife, or some other blunt object in his hand it would be a clear case of self defense.

    Now technically by law you may argue that you "feared for your life" but the prosecutors are going to rip that case apart.

    Just my 2 cents, I think you handled the situation just fine.

    In FL the castle doctrine extends to your car. If someone breaks in using force you do not need to see a weapon you can presume he/she is there to do you harm. IANAL
    rolyat63
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    Distinguished Member Array JerryM's Avatar
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    If he had broken your window, and if you then showed your gun, I suspect he would have gone away.
    I would not have fired unless he had a weapon of some kind including tire tools or clubs. I do not see how your life was endangered by his breaking your window without some sort of weapon.

    Even if the shooting is justified it will be a lot of trouble that you would regret, and especially if in retrospect you concluded that you could have gone on without shooting.

    Did you call 911?

    Regards,
    Jerry

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    Senior Member Array Rotorblade's Avatar
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    I drive through some pretty ugly areas and when stopping for red lights I always leave myself a little wiggle room between me and the car in front. I learned this the hard way from having a wacko pound on the hood of my truck one day while wedged tight in traffic.
    I think I'd rather lean on my horn and "push" my way out between cars then have to shoot someone.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JerryM View Post
    If he had broken your window, and if you then showed your gun, I suspect he would have gone away.
    I would not have fired unless he had a weapon of some kind including tire tools or clubs. I do not see how your life was endangered by his breaking your window without some sort of weapon.

    Even if the shooting is justified it will be a lot of trouble that you would regret, and especially if in retrospect you concluded that you could have gone on without shooting.

    Did you call 911?

    Regards,
    Jerry
    Have you ever had a car window broken? Glass blows out all over the place. You would be showered by glass (read lose the initiative when you close your eyes) and then you would have a raving idiot within 12 inches, pawing and grabbing at you. The old "If you're going to pull it you better use it." adage applies here. "Showing" someone a gun when they are 12 inches away is a good way to lose your gun.

    Also, in my state (Ohio) castle doctrine covers me when he breaks the window (armed or not).
    Last edited by atctimmy; July 19th, 2009 at 02:33 PM. Reason: spelling
    It is surely true that you can lead a horse to water but you can't make them drink. Nor can you make them grateful for your efforts.

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    When stopped in traffic, its always a good idea to maintain at least one car length of distance to the vehicle in front of you so that you can maneuver in or out if need be.

    This prevents you from getting "boxed in" and being unable to move. If you have to move to keep some wacko from messing with you and it is safe to do so, just a little bit of movement goes a long way in discouraging someone because if you are angling in or out they have a chance of getting their feet run over and no one wants that.

    It also gives you enough room to get the heck out of Dodge if you can and it is safe to do so.

    Make it a part of your defense and eventually you'll be doing it without having to think about it.
    I would rather stand against the cannons of the wicked than against the prayers of the righteous.


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  13. #12
    Distinguished Member Array JerryM's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by atctimmy View Post
    Have you ever had a car window broken? Glass blows out all over the place. You would be showered by glass (read lose the initiative when you close your eyes) and then you would have a raving idiot within 12 inches, pawing and grabbing at you. The old "If you're going to pull it you better use it." adage applies here. "Showing" someone a gun when they are 12 inches away is a good way to lose your gun.

    Also, in my state (Ohio) castle doctrine covers me when he breaks the window (armed or not).
    I guess we can have different opinions on this. I suspect that a prosecutor and a jury would not consider glass flying a justification for killing someone.
    Do it your way, and if I ever encounter it I will do it mine.

    PS.
    Have you been in such a situation, and did you shoot the guy? If so how did it play out in the legal sense?

    Regards,
    Jerry

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    VIP Member Array automatic slim's Avatar
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    This incident clearly demonstrates the fact that every state needs Castle Doctrine.
    "First gallant South Carolina nobly made the stand."
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    Member Array Hubadub's Avatar
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    The LEO who responded to my call said I would have been justified in using my gun. However, after I dug deeper into N.C. law, I don`t believe he was correct. The law states that the only time that you do not have the "duty" to retreat is when you are under a murderous,felonious or sexual assault. So I either needed to wait until he was choking the life out of me to shoot him or I should have gotten out of my truck and ran. I believe I`ll start carrying a blowtorch in the truck just in case some other freak wants to get in my vehicle uninvited. In N.C. you don`t have to run if you are on your own property or your business property but it does not cover you in your automobile. I`m glad that things worked out the way they did. It is very easy for prosecuters to be Monday morning quaterbacks. They didn`t see this maniac and the crazed look on his face.
    My child is a Honor Student at Camp Polk Correctional Facility.

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    VIP Member Array edr9x23super's Avatar
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    Down here in Texas we don't have to worry about that; once he breaks the window on my truck, he gets an expense paid trip to his maker for swift and terrible judgment.

    It is stupid to let it get far enough to break windows before you are prepared to do anything. Be ready as the original poster was, before the BG arrives; if the guy is stoned on crack or meth he is unpredictable and you need every advantage. And if the guy is foolish enough to argue with someone holding a gun on him, then we need to do the gene pool a favor....

    And if you read into self defense laws nationwide, especially if you ask someone like Mas Ayoob, they will tell you that there are notable exceptions for being strapped into a vehicle via seatbelt, and therefore unable to retreat....
    "Guard with jealous attention the public liberty. Suspect everyone who approaches that jewel. Unfortunately, nothing will preserve it but downright force. Whenever you give up that force, you are inevitably ruined". - Patrick Henry

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