What would you in this carjacking scenario

This is a discussion on What would you in this carjacking scenario within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; this is probably one of the crappiest scenarios i can think of and will ot end well unless the gun toters are taken totally by ...

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Thread: What would you in this carjacking scenario

  1. #16
    Distinguished Member Array bladenbullet's Avatar
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    this is probably one of the crappiest scenarios i can think of and will ot end well unless the gun toters are taken totally by surprise with either the gun or the car...my intent is not to flee in a flurry of gunfire but thats probably whats going to happen...if they both have guns i do not have the means to dispatch them both before shots are fired back so i'm on the accelerator and hoping i get the opportunity to drag at least one of them along to be identified later...

    i thought about offering up the wallet before getting out of the car as a gesture to reach for my weapon while i accelerate away...i dont see good no matter what but as i have told my wife previously...if it looks like we're going to die i will go balls to the wall with whatever i have to prevent it or die trying...the last thing i want to do is make it easy for someone to take me out and if they do i want them to have scars to remember it by or join me on the way down...

    its hard to trump a gun already pointed at you but the only way to find out if they have the balls to pull the trigger is squeeze em and see what comes out...with luck they dont and you get away clean with a great story to tell...if not...there will be a story and hopefully youll be the one telling it...

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  3. #17
    Member Array Geno's Avatar
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    Floor it! You do not have the time to do anything else IMO.

  4. #18
    Senior Member Array Adkjoe's Avatar
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    I also drive a wrangler so I don't have a trunk so this would be different for me. Either way though there would be no getting out of the car. I drive with the doors off and the top down in the summer to. I would floor it and duck, theirs no way I'm getting out. I'm very aware at stops at night and I would like to think I would see someone coming up to the jeep and I would have time to floor it before he got the chance to tell me to get out but you never know.

    Then I'd turn around and run them over with 35" mud tires.
    Vermont does not issue Permit/Licenses to Carry a Concealed firearm. Vermont allows anyone
    who can legally own a firearm to carry it concealed without a permit of any kind.

  5. #19
    VIP Member Array JonInNY's Avatar
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    I would hit the gas as well, although the delay in the car leaving and the BG shooting might not be in your favor. I would also try and avoid, if possible, shootinf from inside the car. You would probably have significant, and possibly permanent hearing damage/loss. Of course if that's your only option, you would have to at least try.
    "Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch; Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote."
    -- Benjamin Franklin

  6. #20
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    Floor it and get small.

    If they're willing to shoot you for fleeing, it stands to reason they'll shoot you once they get you out of the trunk.

    I'll die doing something active to resolve the situation over being executed....
    Battle Plan (n) - a list of things that aren't going to happen if you are attacked.
    Blame it on Sixto - now that is a viable plan.

  7. #21
    Distinguished Member Array tiwee's Avatar
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    A young couple was in the car near a park at night, driving through. At a stoplight, they are told by two people at gunpoint to get out of the car.
    Skips from 'at a stoplight' to 'told by two people at gunpoint to get out of the car'. This is a big gap. I presume that was intentional in order to frame the question about getting out of the car etc. A lot of my thinking and planning centers on that gap.

    At night, stopping at an intersection near a park is not in my plans. First, I won't be in that part of town at night if possible. Second, I won't stop if people are at the intersection in the dark. Third, if anyone appears out of nowhere, I plan to roll before they get close enough to talk to me.

    In the case of - appears out of nowhere. Seems to me we are most vulnerable to approach from behind. So I try, as a routine, to keep an eye on the rear view mirrors when stopped in traffic. It is remarkable how many people behind you in traffic are looking down at something. Perhaps cell phones or radio dials or shopping lists.

  8. #22
    Member Array TheSaiga308's Avatar
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    Well, I was in this situation with my then fiancee, now my wife. Usually I did not stop at an intersection in this particular area if late at night because of the high crime rate (I would check carefully for traffic and roll slowly through if safe to do so). One night while traveling back from my parents place, we stopped at a railway crossing because a train was crossing. First mistake we made was we both did not have our doors locked.

    My first indication that something was happening was seeing something in the passenger side mirror. It was moving quickly and my first thought was that it was a cyclist. I remember thinking, what is this person doing don't they see the train? Then the next moment the passenger door is flung open and almost immediately my door is flung open. At the first door opening I realized what was happening and it was at this point that time seemed to slow down for me. Things seemed to happen in slow motion for awhile. I remember glancing to my side, glancing to my fiancee's side, hearing her scream out "What do you want! STOP!". I immediately looked up trying to see a way out. At that point the last part of the train was starting to come across the road. I then amazingly could calculate that this was my chance and floored it. It was a small stick shift truck and I managed not to stall it.

    I have trouble remembering whether I had a gun on me or not since this happened back when I think I first had a gun. I would not have had time to draw it and my first instinct was to get out of there! I did not take time to see the assailants but remember that I was able to smell the beer on their breath. There seemed to be at least two on my side and at least two on her side. So I'm thinking that there were at least 4 men perhaps more since I didn't have time to count them all. Most of my focus was in assessing a way out. It was only afterward that my fiancee told me she saw one of them on her side with a gun. Miraculously as we sped away with doors swinging they did not fire any rounds.

    They either a) Did not actually have any rounds with them,
    b) Were too drunk to see properly or
    c) Gave up when they saw us escaping as they probably did not foresee us being able to escape. Whatever the reason I know that God was looking after us.
    Through it all I do not remember them being able to touch me even with the door open throughout the incident and I remember seeing my fiancee appear to be fending them off. All I can say is "Thank you God" and yes peddle to the metal worked in this instance. Perhaps checking for traffic and pulling off through the red light may have worked for this couple. I'm no expert. Perhaps a LEO with more expertise who reads this could give us some more guidance of better tactics to use if any of us have to face this situation in future.

    Some additional points that I've been taught are:
    1) Keep your doors locked at all times
    2) Stop far enough away from an intersection or other vehicles to give yourself a way out.
    3) Keeping your window just slightly cracked making it harder to shatter your windows.
    4) Keeping valuables out of sight helps deter those looking to break, steal and run.
    5) Do 360 degree scans periodically when stopped and practice raising your level of awareness during these times.

    Maybe someone else can add to this list.
    Thought I had something to share relevant to this story.
    Thanks

    PS. Where I was from they did not have any railway crossing barricades (luckily for me this time), in case you were wondering. I would have then had another obstacle to contend with.
    Last edited by TheSaiga308; December 8th, 2009 at 04:57 PM.
    "Firearms stand next in importance to the Constitution itself. They are the people's liberty teeth keystone... more than 99% of them by their silence indicate that they are in safe and sane hands. The very atmosphere of firearms everywhere restrains evil interference."
    - GEORGE WASHINGTON

  9. #23
    Member Array Bm7b5's Avatar
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    As someone else mentioned, there is a lot critical information relative to the gap and there are a lot of things one can do to improve one's odds prior to being out of the car and ordered into the trunk. However, assuming I am unarmed and that I am already out of the car and my woman and I are being ordered into the trunk at gun point, I think running is a good choice. It didn't work out for the man, but it did for the woman. There are not guarantees in these situations.

    I plan to take the following course sometime in the next year.

    Street & Vehicle Tactics Training

    Hopefully I'll learn something about these situations.
    A traffic ticket is formal recognition of a lapse in situational awareness.

  10. #24
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    The short answer is, flight or fight but nothing in between.

    Class time: As a former LEO I learned to always be mindful of how I position my car at a stop. Granted, if you’re the only car at the stopped position, and another car pulls along side of you, your options may be more limited but you can still adjust. As I pull up to a stop in multi lane traffic, I place my body (seated position) in their blind spot. If you’re in the middle lane, then keep the one car length rule and adjust to the vehicle/occupants who appear more, or less threatening. If they want to look my way, they will have to look over their shoulder whereby giving me a distinct advantage. If I’m the only car approaching the stop, I always maintain the full car length rule from the crosswalk, which actually looks peculiar to others. This allows me to adjust my position or room to flee. After all these years, I still amaze myself of just how much I actually retained, and still practice to this day.
    Regards,
    “Monsters are real and so are ghosts. They live inside of us, and sometimes they win.”
    ~ Stephen King

  11. #25
    Distinguished Member Array PastorPack's Avatar
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    Some additional points that I've been taught are:
    1) Keep your doors locked at all times
    2) Stop far enough away from an intersection or other vehicles to give yourself a way out.
    3) Keeping your window just slightly cracked make it harder to shatter your windows.
    4) Keeping valuables out of sight helps deter those looking to break, steal and run.
    5) Do 360 degree scans periodically when stopped and practice raising your level of awareness during these times.
    #3 seems counter-intuitive. Can anyone offer an explanation on this?
    God is love (1 John 4:8)

  12. #26
    Distinguished Member Array bladenbullet's Avatar
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    a window in the full up position is braced on 4 sides making shattering it a bit easier than if it is only loosely supported on 3...in the partially down position the glass is not firmly held at any point except where it passes through the door...a window that can bounce around is less likely to shatter than one that is held firmly in place...

    side window glass is very brittle and inflexible...

  13. #27
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    I’ll give it a try based on what I know in the proper use of a glass breaker. Side window safety glass is bordered with a soft window seal and when partially opened, it’s under less stress and will flex more readily when force is applied. The reverse example is when breaking a front or rear windshield. It’s more effective to apply force near a corner (curvature) where the stress-rise is greater.

    Oops... I noticed that 'bladenbullet' accurately explained the principle before I refreshed my screen to see his response. The dead horse is now really dead!
    Regards,
    “Monsters are real and so are ghosts. They live inside of us, and sometimes they win.”
    ~ Stephen King

  14. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by CarGunGuy View Post
    What's the rule? Never let yourself be moved to a second crime scene?

    If somehow you were taken out of the car before being able to floor it, I would likely run or fight (run is the best option). Never let yourself be moved to a second location... ever. You will not live, so you might as well go down either fighting or fleeing.

    I believe what the OP was inferring was that IF you were unarmed, what would you do?
    ME THINKS?

    In either case, you are unarmed, or your S A was woefully lacking and you are caught off guard,
    your best bet is to, if possible, divert their attention if possible , start car and floor it , running over as many BG's who are stupid enough to believe you would'nt, in the process of leaving, or if unable to do that, jump and run, trying to knock gunman if possible ,while ducking and running.
    As was stated, getting into trunk is not an option; you WILL most likely die, but not before being raped, tortured, and being used as a human guinea pig at the hands of some rather unscrupulous cretins.
    IMHO



    "To my mind it is wholly irresponsible to go into the world incapable of preventing violence, injury, crime, and death. How feeble is the mindset to accept defenselessness. How unnatural. How cheap. How cowardly. How pathetic." Ted Nugent
    If you want to make God laugh, tell him your plans.

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  15. #29
    Member Array TheSaiga308's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PastorPack View Post
    #3 seems counter-intuitive. Can anyone offer an explanation on this?
    I suppose this is what I've been told. It may not be correct but perhaps Saber, who seems to be able to practically test the theory may be able to verify this. Bladenbullet's explanation is kinda along the line of what I thought. It seems to me that having one side free to flex more instead of being rigidly held in place would allow the absorption of more force upon impact. A practical test of the two situations should get us closer to the truth. Saber if you are able and willing to verify this, how about letting us know the results.
    Thanks
    "Firearms stand next in importance to the Constitution itself. They are the people's liberty teeth keystone... more than 99% of them by their silence indicate that they are in safe and sane hands. The very atmosphere of firearms everywhere restrains evil interference."
    - GEORGE WASHINGTON

  16. #30
    Senior Member Array CowboyColby's Avatar
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    How many of you have the trunk release in the trunk in case this happens? I don't as I drive a pickup but I know in my sister's car there is a trunk release from the inside. How many of you would consider complying with the BGs knowing that at the next stop you could pop the trunk and jump out with your firearm (assuming they did not take it from you) thus regaining the advantage of the element of surprise and retreat with your spouse and covering her as you two run to safety. A downfall would be they didn't stop the car or slow down enough until their destination.

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