Interesting situation tonight.

**rottkeeper** · December 21st, 2009 11:29 PM

Originally Posted by mrtrumpet1

Rock and Glock: Well first off I stated IMHO so no appology is required, notice the words MY and OPINION. Second off I said in Georgia not Colorado (the cops may be different out there). Third off the facts are stated in the OP's post, get on to the other people that are saying file a complaint. Fourth off the guys I grew up with were to lazy to do something else thats no lie (one of my friends that became a DOC pulled his gun on me and my friend one night when he was drunk). Fifth off they have become buttholes (I'm pretty sure you don't know these guys), some of these guys have since been fired from the force because they got drunk and recked 2 police cruisers and one Trail Blazer. Sixth off whats wrong with Georgia??? Seventh off the important problems are armed robbery, drug busts, disputes etc. (ie. not pulling you over for busted tail light and not turning on your flashers just to run a red light). And lastly there is no one person better than I am, I don't care what you do for a living. I really hate when cops use their "authority" just to hassle you. I can become a butt hole too, but I choose not to.

With the exception of your post in this thread?

With that being said, all of of this is from MY PERSONAL experience. I never once asked for somebody I don't even know to critique an OPINION. I find nothing wrong with my post.

I too think you a very offensive with your (in you face attitude). Your generalizations are immature and off base. IMHO

When you post on a public forum you are going to get people who will critique your opinion. That is how discussions work, one party offers an opinion and another offers theirs based on the text of others along with their own thoughts.

**DefensiveCarry.com** · December 21st, 2009 11:29 PM

**mrtrumpet1** · December 21st, 2009 11:41 PM

Rottkeeper: Exactly my OPINION is causing contraversy. You're offended (obviously), but what are you getting at I'm adding an opinion to be discussed. I'm sure some people agree with my position. Another thing, I discuss how I discuss. I'm not intending on being in your face. And "generalizations"... Aren't opinions formed from generalizations?

**Jackle1886** · December 22nd, 2009 12:14 AM

Apparently the guy who "lost" his wallet works there. I just happened to be sitting in the general area he last remembered it in, and so we got pointed out. But only the two guys at the table were questioned, neither of the ladies were asked anything.

**Bm7b5** · December 22nd, 2009 12:18 AM

Originally Posted by Treo

Officer, I do not consent to any searches

Officer, I do not wish to answer any questions or make any statement at this time.

Am I free to go.

Learn it, live it, love it

YouTube - Dont Talk to Police

It is interesting that so many people who are ardent defenders of the 2nd ammendment are willing to give up their 4th ammedment rights so easily. Treo nails it.

Also, the police really did nothing wrong, and were not being bullies or overstepping their authority in my mind. They are within their rights to disarm you during their encounter with you. They can also ask you whatever questions they would like to ask. You consented to the questioning by not doing what Treo says above.

**Jackle1886** · December 22nd, 2009 12:31 AM

You are correct. Lesson learned.

**Sticks** · December 22nd, 2009 05:32 AM

Originally Posted by Jackle1886

...

I got up and walked to the entryway area where a second officer stood (the first one who approached us). After introducing myself to them, shaking their hands and getting their names, I informed them that I have a CPL and was carrying.

They proceeded to question me about a lost wallet, if I had it, knew anything, etc. I informed them that I had been here two hours, left my chair twice for the restroom, and hadn't seen any wallet. Also, if I had found one, I would of turned it in (which I've done with wallets and cell phones before).

They kept questioning me and then threatened me with checking the security cameras....

This is just me - At that point, I'd be done, and depending on my mood, I might say "I hope you have your ducks in a row, let's go watch a movie." More likely my better judgment would kick in and, "We're done. Arrest me now, otherwise I'm going back to my family."

... One officer handed me my magazine back, told me to put it in my pocket, and then handed back my gun as he told me it wasn't a good idea to carry in there and I should "leave it in the car."

I promptly reholstered and walked back in to take my seat...

I'd have reloaded (after informing them of my intentions, slowly and safely) then reholstered. I may be wrong, but I don't believe the police have the authority to dictate the condition of your sidearm. Might have made things a bit on the interesting side, It was loaded when they took it, I'd expect it to be in the same condition after they concluded their business.

**Divebum47** · December 22nd, 2009 06:59 AM

Originally Posted by mrtrumpet1

Man cops are crooked IMHO. I haven't met one that I've liked yet. Just because you have a badge doesn't make you a bigger or better person. I'm from Georgia and what I've seen so far is that cops like to cause more problems than fix them. But on the other hand I haven't had a single problem with sheriff deputies, they deal with the important problems. Some of my best friends from high school went on to be city police or department of corrections and they took that route cuz they were too lazy to do anything with their lives. They've become butt holes since. I would def file a complaint and see where that gets you.

You need to get out a little more. (Added(In my opinion)) I've had the honor of working with PD's all over the Eastern US, working with the Panasonic Toughbook and associated peripherals. In the vast majority of cases, the cops I've worked with are good people and dedicated to their jobs - just like the majority of civilians.

**mrtrumpet1** · December 22nd, 2009 03:31 PM

Yeah I'm not here to high jack the thread or piss anybody off. All I'm saying is that I've had nothing but bad experiences with city police and it seems that the OP had a bad run in with them and so have I. I don't think its right that just because you have a badge that means you can be a bully about it. Oh and I do get out but I'm always wandering what excuse a cop is going to try to pull me over for or waste my time on. He should report the harassment to the police chief and take it from there.

**mrtrumpet1** · December 22nd, 2009 03:35 PM

P.S. I'm glad you don't have to tell an LEO that you are carrying in the state of Georgia :)

**JJVP** · December 22nd, 2009 06:30 PM

Originally Posted by Jackle1886

The laws in MI pertaining to my situation are as follows.
* Must inform officer
* .02 BAC limit when carrying
*CAN carry in restaurants that serve alcohol, but not in bars

I was out celebrating my sisters birthday. Her, a friend, myself, and my gf were having dinner in a bistro/pub. Everyone there was eating with the exception of two or three people at the bar. And not everyone was drinking, so, it was definitely deriving more of it's income from the sale of food than alcohol.

When I first got there, my gf and I ordered a sampler of their beer. This came in 4 shot sized glasses, which we split. I also tasted my sisters, which was two or three sips at most. I had 5 slices of pizza, a glass of water, and a rootbeer.

We were all sitting there, right about the second hour, when a LEO walks right up to us and asks my sisters friend if he could speak with him. A few minutes later he came back, ad the story was that someone had lost a wallet and the cops questioned him. Maybe 30 seconds after he got back a second officer approached us again and asked to speak with me.

I got up and walked to the entryway area where a second officer stood (the first one who approached us). After introducing myself to them, shaking their hands and getting their names, I informed them that I have a CPL and was carrying.

They proceeded to question me about a lost wallet, if I had it, knew anything, etc. I informed them that I had been here two hours, left my chair twice for the restroom, and hadn't seen any wallet. Also, if I had found one, I would of turned it in (which I've done with wallets and cell phones before).

They kept questioning me and then threatened me with checking the security cameras. That didn't bother me as I had nothing to be afraid of.

So after a few minutes of questions, they asked me if I had been drinking. I told them less than one, after which I was turned around, had my hands up on the back of my head. My fingers were locked together and I was relieved of my weapon. Now this was in viewing area of HALF OF THE RESTAURANT.

We went outside, and they asked me again how much I had to drink. I replied that my gf and I split a sample of the beer, which translated to 2 shot glasses worth of beer, which really is not even half of one drink. They ran the serial numbers on my gun, and gave me a breathalyzer test. Never told me what I blew, but I'm assuming it was nothing. One officer handed me my magazine back, told me to put it in my pocket, and then handed back my gun as he told me it wasn't a good idea to carry in there and I should "leave it in the car."

I promptly reholstered and walked back in to take my seat.

Now, I understand that a LEO's number one job is to return home safely at night. I understand that one bit. The part that does bother me, is the two of us getting singled out. They never questioned anyone else in the whole place. My girlfriend had a view of the door from her seat and watched them from the time they came in through the whole thing.

I showed them respect, by giving them my name and shaking their hands, and by informing them right away. If they were concerned about me carrying, then why wouldn't they disarm me right away? Instead they waited until after they questioned me, which was fine. But then why not step outside, out of the view of everyone, and take my carry piece then? The looks I got when I returned to the restaurant...you would of thought I was some convict!

Just wanted to get everyone's thoughts on this...it was quite the interesting night.

A few final comments. If your going to drink, yes it is better to not carry. I was well within my rights to do what I did, and followed the letter of the law. If it was later in the evening, instead of 5:30, I might not of carried. But the fact that I went in to have dinner at a restaurant, instead of a drink at a pub, to me makes all the difference.

I'm thinking of writing the town PD, as I feel they could of been more professional in their dealings, or at least told us the truth as to why they were questioning us; not profiling us either.

Thoughts?

"They kept questioning me and then threatened me with checking the security cameras. "

I would have told him that if they had security cameras that could identify who took/found the wallet, why were they harassing customers rather than reviewing the video.

"One officer handed me my magazine back, told me to put it in my pocket, and then handed back my gun as he told me it wasn't a good idea to carry in there and I should "leave it in the car.""

I would have said, tell you what, next time I come to this restaurant I will give you a call. Then you can come over and escort me from my car to the restaurant, guard my table while I eat and then escort me back to my car after I finish. If that is OK with you, then I will leave my gun in my car. If not, then I will continue to carry as permitted by the laws of the state.

**QKShooter** · December 22nd, 2009 09:34 PM

The member is a responsible adult.

The law states that his BAC has to be * .02 BAC limit or less when carrying.

So...you guys want to jump on him because he tasted 2 Ounces of beer with a full meal + a glass of Root Beer & a glass of water?

If the law said that the maximum handgun caliber that you could legally carry in your state was a .38 Special - I'm sure that you'all would probably carry a .32 or a .25 auto just to make sure that you were staying well within the confines of what the law allowed...right?

**BugDude** · December 22nd, 2009 09:35 PM

In My Honest Opinion (which obviously absolves one from any responsibility for forum ettiquite), please allow me to analyze the discussion:

New person with 11 posts says:
-Cops are crooked
-Not met one he liked
-Cops like to cause problems not fix
-His best friends became cops, lazy, and buttholes (IMHO, these being his best friends says something about him as well)

-Said IMHO means no apology necessary

-Admits he can be a butthole also, "but chooses not to" (IMHO, his comments prove that the ship has already sailed on this issue)

-Finds nothing wrong with his post (here's your sign that you can't engage in a battle of smarts with an unarmed person)

-He really hates when cops use their "authority" just to hassle him

4 Year person with 4,500+ posts says:
-This is an unacceptable generalization on this forum, and I do not appreciate this attitude. IMHO you owe several members here an apology.

Has the poster of the offensive posts ever stopped to consider the possibility that it may just be him?

Perhaps he is the only consistent feature of all of his bad experiences?

IMHO, the statements outlined above from his posts have answered these questions for me...but that's just me. Everyone else wil have to draw their own individual conclusion.

I find it strange that in over 40 years, I have appreciated and respected LEO, Veterans, and Military personnel and thier families because of the risks and sacrifices they accept to make our society safer for us and I have never once had any such issues with any of them that I have ever met or encountered. I have been stopped, I have received tickets, and I have also been treated with the same respect and professionalism that I have shown them. So, in my OPINION, it would appear from a purely analytical perspective that the only common denominator is the individual. Or as my 8 year old daughter would say it, "the smeller is the feller."

**stanislaskasava** · December 23rd, 2009 12:50 AM

Originally Posted by QKShooter

The member is a responsible adult.

The law states that his BAC has to be * .02 BAC limit or less when carrying.

So...you guys want to jump on him because he tasted 2 Ounces of beer with a full meal + a glass of Root Beer & a glass of water?

If the law said that the maximum handgun caliber that you could legally carry in your state was a .38 Special - I'm sure that you'all would probably carry a .32 or a .25 auto just to make sure that you were staying well within the confines of what the law allowed...right?

Quite right. I fail to see how it is reasonable that he was just sitting there, eating pizza and he ended up disarmed, breathalyzed, and interrogated because some fool lost his $9 million dollar wallet in the snow. Have I missed something? How many LEOs here have ever gone on a 'lost wallet call'? What's the ten code for that?

I can hardly imagine calling 911 to report that I lost my wallet and not having the phone slammed down in disgust on the other end of the line. Let alone the Police arriving and interrogating whoever I put the finger on (and attempting to find cause to arrest them, in order to search them).

Heck, the last time I called the police, it was to report that there was a car driving ahead of me with a strong smell of marijuana eminating from it (either DUI or transporting a large quantity) and I believe the lady said, quote: "Yeah, buddy, we'll get right on that."

Was there no police report filed? How far are y'all willing to go without a police report being filed or charges made? "Sir, empty your pockets!" I think not.

One thing is certain. I would NEVER go back to a restaurant where they make a practice of calling the police on customers instead of simply asking a nice question. No tip for them.

**paramedic70002** · December 23rd, 2009 01:16 AM

Originally Posted by Jackle1886

Apparently the guy who "lost" his wallet works there. I just happened to be sitting in the general area he last remembered it in, and so we got pointed out. But only the two guys at the table were questioned, neither of the ladies were asked anything.

I have lost my wallet about twice in my life, but never at work. Sounds really fishy.

**Bark'n** · December 23rd, 2009 07:07 AM

Originally Posted by BugDude