I may have inadvertently posted this in the wrong forum. I apologize.
This is a discussion on .22 versus .45 within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I imagine how reading the title will look, so let me get to the question I have . I own a .22(Sig Mosquito) target pistol ...
I imagine how reading the title will look, so let me get to the question I have .
I own a .22(Sig Mosquito) target pistol that will cycle 11 rounds very well and very accurately. I also own a .45(XD Tactical) that will cycle 14 rounds in the same manner.
As bedroom/home defense (I live with 2 roomates, I'm the first door down the hallway) I actually don't mind keeping either of them with a round in the chamber. I've seen .22 HP rounds punch through 10 layers of plywood. Also have a few recovered rounds that mushroomed nicely.
My question/thought train comes to, I cant help but think 11 rounds of .22 would be enough to discourage most people. If the point isn't made after 4-5 rounds, it's time to go to the big brother.
Am I wrong for wanting to pick it up first and "look better in court" (god forbid the need arise) using a much lighter round versus a proven man stopper? I can dump 11 rounds out of the .22 more accurately than I can the .45, and I wont be borderline deaf afterwards.
My thinking is largely, if the S does HTF, I've got a small caliber that won't affect my sight or hearing. If the threat isn't deterred with that, then all bets are off.
Forgive me if my question is awkward, but I'm usually better at thinking than I am typing.
Stopping a threat with a .22 target pistol just seems more...acceptable? than stopping a threat with a .45 with the word "Tactical" attached to it's slide.
Tear me a new one, offer advice, thoughts. Wouldn't have posted if I didn't want feedback.
I may have inadvertently posted this in the wrong forum. I apologize.
No question. 45 ACP.
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Get the U.S. out of the U.N.
If you're truly justified in the use of lethal force (based on your state laws, etc.), then you better be prepared (physically, mentally, spiritually, etc.) to draw and use the lethal force weapon. Otherwise, get a dog, pepper spray, tazer, or some other less than lethal force alternatives. If you were not justified in the use of lethal force and shot someone 8 times with a 22, the caliber would be irrelevant in court. A 22 is still considered lethal force just like a 45 and the issue would be circumstances relative to state law not caliber. The only difference is the BG won't be able to testify against you in the case of the 45. Just my thoughts...I'm not a lawyer, don't pretend to be one, dont play one on TV, and didn't stay at a holiday inn express last night.
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When your life is on the line, stopping the treat by ANY means possible is the only thing acceptable. And you want to stop the threat ASAP. The .45 is a non issue, use it. I would rather live to explain myself than fight my way to the .45 if the .22 did not work. I'm very accurate with my .22. But the only way I carry it as an SD gun is in areas where it is the only legal caliber I can carry. Crazy state gamelands laws.
Currently my HD gun just switched from a 9mm G19 to a Rem 870 12 gauge. I'm not worried about how it looks as long as it's a clean shoot. My state says I have the right to use lethal force in certain instances, it does not describe how I can use it.
Appreciate the responses thus far. .45 is going to bed ready to rock.
As stated elsewhere training and practice can make up for caliber in many cases, but a good shot with a .45 will undoubtedly do more damage (read: potential threat stoppage) than that same shot with a .22
At that point the question may come down to: which looks better in court, a potential multiple shooting with a .22 or perhaps only a single time with a .45
Also keep in mind that you may not get the opportunity to switch guns if the first one you choose doesn't get the job done.
IMO, start strong and use the .22 as a bug.
Every .22lr I have owned has had some sort of malfunction issues that would preclude me from designating it for emergency use. The failures that seem to happen are light primer strikes (where the firing pin dents the rim, but no ignition) and failures to eject. Yours might be ultra-reliable (but I doubt it).
I just don't think rimfire is dependable enough for life and death...
Get a good flashlight and be sure to positively identify a BG before shooting at them. Drunk roommates and friends are annoying, but generally not worth shooting. ;)
Mapping out access points to your apartment (doors, windows...) and where you will "defend" from can give you an idea where stray rounds might go. A little planning and a strategically placed bookcase or two provide some protection.
"a reminder that no law can replace personal responsibility" - Bill Clinton 2010.
This thought process can jump between the two camps forever. However, I'd like to bring in another take on the issue. In my bed-side pistol, I have a six shot .22mag revolver loaded with CCI HP, but the first round to fire is a CCi Shotshell. Why? Because I live in a motorhome with extremely thin walls. If I ever (heaven forbid) accidently fire the revolver, the round is unlikely to penetrate the walls and harm an innocent by-stander/child. But it certainly would harm a human, and if firing at someone, I would be firing multiply times. Also, at close range, accuracy wouldn't be a major issue.
Just my thoughts on this contentious issue. This is not to stir up a heated discussion, but my 'take' on the problem.
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For home defense I'd use the 12 Guage if possible.
Since that wasn't mentioned as an option by you, I would opt for the .45 ACP over the .22 LR caliber handgun. I'm less worried about hearing damage and more concerned with being able to stop a threat before the threat can harm me or a loved one.
Court might say the .22 was cruel and unusual punishment when the guy lives. With the .45 there will be no questions from the guy.
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Use the .45....
Don"t let stupid be your skill set....
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In addition to the points already raised, I'd be concerned the .22 would punch through several walls, endangering your roomates. A .45 is a slower, heavier round and won't go through nearly as much.
Mythbusters did a test with a .45, and ball ammo shot from around 36" high only travelled around 350 feet before hitting the ground. A .22 can travel much, much further.
In the eyes of the law, a shooting is a shooting - you don't get bonus points for using a smaller caliber. In a defensive shooting, your goal is to stop the threat, and the .45 is a much, much better choice in that regard.
I wouldn't even give this a second thought: go with the .45 by all means! It's YOUR life you're defending! Why worry about the bad guy's life?
If I recall correctly a while back someone posted a link to a story about a girl that shot an attacker in her home multiple time (several hits placed in good areas) with a 32 caliber. She barely escaped with her life even after multiply hits. I agree, use a caliber that will stop the threat FOR SURE , and do it NOW.