Sheepdog vs. Witness

Sheepdog vs. Witness

This is a discussion on Sheepdog vs. Witness within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; L ast evening (dusk) I was driving back home from the local grocery store when I witnessed a homeless female lying on the side of ...

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Thread: Sheepdog vs. Witness

  1. #1
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    Sheepdog vs. Witness


    Last evening (dusk) I was driving back home from the local grocery store when I witnessed a homeless female lying on the side of the road leaning on one forearm crying. I was crossing over a bridge in heavy traffic and there wasn’t anywhere to safely stop.

    As I passed over I saw another homeless person (male) about 10-yards ahead of the female. Another civilian vehicle had already stopped and appeared to be on their cell phone. I pulled up slightly ahead and up on the sidewalk as I also called. While on the phone, I looked over my shoulder as I witnessed the male subject walking back to the female and began kicking her in an apparent fashion, to get her to stand up. Yes, they appeared to be together.

    I was still on the phone with 911 as I stated the location, assault in progress, male vs. female, etc. The occupants of the car that stopped before me exited their car (female first) then the male followed. The guy stopped kicking her as the citizen female approached.

    They were apparently attempting to console and separate the two. I continued to pass on updates to dispatch as I stated the assault had ceased. Apparently, the first responders never actually contacted 911 because dispatch had no other reports, which made my account important.

    The situation appeared to be calming down so I slowly pulled away to a better vantage point. About that time I could see the Calvary approaching from my front. It just so happened to be a local 'she-bear' whom I knew, and believe me, she's no softie'.

    Once I was sure the situation was under control, I continued on my way. Teaching moment, perhaps. I never exited my vehicle for a few reasons.

    1) Dispatch needed accurate information as it unfolded.
    2) The female that approached the couple was unthreatening and it appeared to be the right medicine to calm the guy as he immediately stopped kicking, as her male companion also calmly approached.
    3) Had I joined the party at that juncture, I could have unintentionally embarrassed or otherwise provoked the guy to a different state of mind.

    Also, had he pulled a shank, I would have had only one recourse. Naturally, I was just going for milk and cereal and I was too lazy to grab my Kimber ‘pepper-blaster’ (dumb ass).

    In hindsight, I sorta felt like a coward but fear was never my concern.

    Ok, let the critique begin…
    “Monsters are real and so are ghosts. They live inside of us, and sometimes they win.”
    ~ Stephen King


  2. #2
    Member Array ming's Avatar
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    Good job IMO. I agree with your 3 points. No reason to be upset with yourself.

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    VIP Member Array NC Bullseye's Avatar
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    You should be ashamed of yourself!

    Doing the right thing, what is the world coming to?

    Thanks for reconfirming my belief that there are still those that think.

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    VIP Member Array gottabkiddin's Avatar
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    No criticism from me sir, IMO you handled it way better than I could have.

    I am however surprised that you were unarmed.
    "He that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one." – Luke 22:36

    "If a law is unjust, a man is not only right to disobey it, he is obligated to do so." – Thomas Jefferson

  5. #5
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    Just being a good witness is the best solution, and someone else was already helping...no reason to 'pile on'...
    You did well...
    The last Blood Moon Tetrad for this millennium starts in April 2014 and ends in September 2015...according to NASA.

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  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by gottabkiddin View Post
    No criticism from me sir, IMO you handled it way better than I could have.

    I am however surprised that you were unarmed.
    Oops! Sorry for the confusion as I was armed. I intended to explain that I left my OC spray at home. Had I been the ‘first responder’ as he was kicking her, I would have likely jumped in. However, I would have much preferred to spray the guy (if needed) to stop the assault. Simply, had the situation gone really south, then I could have been buried in paperwork for years.
    “Monsters are real and so are ghosts. They live inside of us, and sometimes they win.”
    ~ Stephen King

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    VIP Member Array wmhawth's Avatar
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    Ok, let the critique begin…
    None necessary. Your actions and the reasons behind them make good sense to me.

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    I definately dont blame you for keeping your distance. One thing taught to me in the cc course is to be wary of domestic type situations involving a male and female. It can have a reverse effect, trying to save the female from a violent bf can turn one target into two if the female is succumbed far in enough in the "battered wife" syndrome. Pulling out on a violent bf can set her off and now she's attacking you alongside her bf, and that looks bad alltogether in the eyes of the PD. The occupants of the car that arrived first could have faced similar effects and thats where you would have to come in and ward off the attack.
    Good job playing the witness.

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    Given that there were two others intervening, and you were in a position to assist if things got out of control before your friend showed up, I think you did great.

    Don't know if you had time and a chance to have a word with the officer, or whether that would help any later on down the road regarding prosecution.

    You stopped, made the phone call, were available to intervene if needed, you were armed to intervene if needed.

    Being retired, I guess you couldn't just jump out and yell "police." So, you did the best you could. I say thumbs up.

  10. #10
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    Thanks 'Hopyard', actually I didn’t retire as a LEO although I was in it long enough to know how seemingly benign situations can change in an instant. Anyway, thanks to all who responded.
    “Monsters are real and so are ghosts. They live inside of us, and sometimes they win.”
    ~ Stephen King

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    You did exactly the right thing ... just enough to solve the problem. Far too many people think reaching for a weapon is the first and only thing to do.

    There was no threat to you, and the responding woman seemed to have interrupted the assault, so other than making the 911 call, what else did you feel you needed to do?

    Bravo to you! And the others who responded to someone in need!
    Retired USAF E-8. Lighten up and enjoy life because:
    Paranoia strikes deep, into your heart it will creep. It starts when you're always afraid... "For What It's Worth" Buffalo Springfield

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    Ex Member Array Treo's Avatar
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    This is just my opinion but I believe that information is more useful than heroics. By giving the police as much information as possible before they arrived at the scene you made their job easier.

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    VIP Member Array Tom G's Avatar
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    No sense getting into a domestic fight. If she stays with this guy this will happen again .keep your distance and call 911 unless it turns into a life & death situation with a weapon.

  14. #14
    Senior Member Array Stirling XD's Avatar
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    I get tired people equating being a good witness to cowardice. Not that I've seen that on this thread.) It is not. In some cases, it is nearly as dangerous as playing Batman and jumping in the middle of something. Defendants hate witnesses. Sounds like you exercised good judgement and did the right thing. Good for you.

  15. #15
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    Well done sir!
    Fortune favors the bold.

    Freedom doesn't mean safe, it means free.

    The thing about "defense" is that it has practically nothing to do with guns. (As passed on by CCW9MM)

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