Florida: Fight Over Unleashed Dog, Gun Pulled

Florida: Fight Over Unleashed Dog, Gun Pulled

This is a discussion on Florida: Fight Over Unleashed Dog, Gun Pulled within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Florida: Fight Over Unleashed Dog, Gun Pulled Forty-one-year-old James Cashin is in jail tonight for allegedly punching another man in the head during an argument. ...

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  1. #1
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    Florida: Fight Over Unleashed Dog, Gun Pulled

    Florida: Fight Over Unleashed Dog, Gun Pulled

    Forty-one-year-old James Cashin is in jail tonight for allegedly punching another man in the head during an argument. Kurt Hartman says he was hit while taking Gus for an early morning walk.
    “Their dog was running loose, no collar, no leash, no nothing,” said Hartmann.
    Hartmann admitted to frustration with Cashin, who lives a half a block away on Park Road. He says Cashin routinely let his dog run loose, so he shared his frustration.
    “It became into a heated exchange, next thing you know, the guy hit me,” said Hartmann.
    Hartmann suffers from cardiomyopathy, and needs a pump to move his blood. he carries a battery pack wherever he goes.”This is just a temporary measure until I can get on a transplant list out of Tampa General Hospital.”
    Lying on the ground, bleeding, and in fear of his life, he says, he pulled out a licensed .40 caliber pistol in self-defense.
    Julie Sherman, a friend of Cashin’s says, it didn’t happen that way.
    “Jimmy was arguing with him because he was calling me names,” said Sherman. “He pulled the gun on me and put it in my face.”
    But according to deputies, there were inconsistencies between Sherman and Cashin’s stories.
    “You don’t bring a fist to a gunfight, you think if I pull out my gun, he’s gonna come after me with his fist? I pull out a gun, he’s going to run,” said Hartmann.
    According to reports, both parties called 911. Hartmann has a concealed weapons permit and deputies say he acted well within the law. Cashin was taken to jail and now faces one county of felony battery.
    Cashin does have a prior criminal record that includes battery and drug charges.
    __________________________________________________ _______________

    Sounds like Mr. Hartman was well within his rights, and this is not the first time Mr. Cashin has had problems.
    Note: Both called 911...
    The last Blood Moon Tetrad for this millennium starts in April 2014 and ends in September 2015...according to NASA.

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  2. #2
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    Lemme guess - your neighbors?
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    VIP Member Array 9MMare's Avatar
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    Good example of the system recognizing 'disparity of force.' (Altho the case isnt closed yet)
    Fortune favors the bold.

    Freedom doesn't mean safe, it means free.

    The thing about "defense" is that it has practically nothing to do with guns. (As passed on by CCW9MM)

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    Member Array schwaa's Avatar
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    Wow, that story confused me for a minute.
    Last edited by schwaa; February 14th, 2010 at 04:14 PM.
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    Wow a criminal that doesn't obey leash laws,whodathunkit
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    VIP Member Array Patti's Avatar
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    It appears that the right guy is behind bars.
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    VIP Member Array rottkeeper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by retsupt99 View Post
    __________________________________________________ _______________


    Note: Both called 911...
    The BG thought calling would make him look like the victim.
    For as the lightning comes from the east and flashes to the west, so also will the coming of the son of man be. Mathew 24:27

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    Senior Member Array DrLewall's Avatar
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    the BG now knows his victim carries..and knows where he lives too...Mr Hartman needs to be in condx ORANGE from now on
    "Brains before Bullets"

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    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
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    Lying on the ground, bleeding, and in fear of his life, he says, he pulled out a licensed .40 caliber pistol in self-defense.

    Julie Sherman, a friend of Cashin’s says, it didn’t happen that way.

    “Jimmy was arguing with him because he was calling me names,” said Sherman. “He pulled the gun on me and put it in my face.”
    A very poorly written article. Who in the world is this "Julie Sherman" person, and why does her opinion matter? The article fails to indicate whether she was there, or whether she is merely parroting the story of the one combatant. Though, the "calling me names" part suggests she was there. Hard to tell what's what, in a simple he said / she said.

    Still, if the person who pulled the gun was clearly name-calling and escalating, it's hard to justify the subsequent pulling of a gun, even if smacked once.
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    Thoughts: Justifiable self defense (A.O.J.).
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  10. #10
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    Did a 8 year old write that artical??? My head is still spinning.


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    Member Array mcgyver210's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ccw9mm View Post
    A very poorly written article. Who in the world is this "Julie Sherman" person, and why does her opinion matter? The article fails to indicate whether she was there, or whether she is merely parroting the story of the one combatant. Though, the "calling me names" part suggests she was there. Hard to tell what's what, in a simple he said / she said.

    Still, if the person who pulled the gun was clearly name-calling and escalating, it's hard to justify the subsequent pulling of a gun, even if smacked once.
    Im in total agreement it seemed the way it was written that the so called victim started the whole argument in the first place & should have kept his mouth shut if he really didn't want to fight.

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    My understanding is that Hartmann was justified in brandishing his weapon to Cashin because he was stricken to the ground, and suffers from a heart condition requiring sensitive medical equipment to ensure his survival. It seems reasonable to me that, if you have a delicate heart condition and someone strikes you to the ground with such violence that you are bloodied, you might fear for your life. Heart condition or no, being violently forced to the ground by an aggressor is a very vulnerable position; at that point, Hartmann (or anyone) is one stomp away from spinal cord injury, and subsequently a lifetime of paralysis.

    What do you guys think? The law already cleared him, but do you feel Hartmann was right to brandish?

  13. #13
    Distinguished Member Array 21bubba's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by andyw328 View Post
    My understanding is that Hartmann was justified in brandishing his weapon to Cashin because he was stricken to the ground, and suffers from a heart condition requiring sensitive medical equipment to ensure his survival. It seems reasonable to me that, if you have a delicate heart condition and someone strikes you to the ground with such violence that you are bloodied, you might fear for your life. Heart condition or no, being violently forced to the ground by an aggressor is a very vulnerable position; at that point, Hartmann (or anyone) is one stomp away from spinal cord injury, and subsequently a lifetime of paralysis.

    What do you guys think? The law already cleared him, but do you feel Hartmann was right to brandish?
    Hard call to make. I'm still unable to understand that story.

  14. #14
    Member Array mcgyver210's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by andyw328 View Post
    My understanding is that Hartmann was justified in brandishing his weapon to Cashin because he was stricken to the ground, and suffers from a heart condition requiring sensitive medical equipment to ensure his survival. It seems reasonable to me that, if you have a delicate heart condition and someone strikes you to the ground with such violence that you are bloodied, you might fear for your life. Heart condition or no, being violently forced to the ground by an aggressor is a very vulnerable position; at that point, Hartmann (or anyone) is one stomp away from spinal cord injury, and subsequently a lifetime of paralysis.

    What do you guys think? The law already cleared him, but do you feel Hartmann was right to brandish?

    There is always more to a confrontation than is said but just from what Hartman supposedly said I believe he was really the cause of the whole confrontation. Also if I had a medical condition that would make it immediately life threatening to be in a fight I would have kept my opinion to my self therefore most likely the conflict wouldn't have happened IMO.

    On the other hand if Hartmann hadn't actually started the confrontation I may have had more sympathy for him. I wonder how it would have turned out if Hartmann hadn't had the medical condition which seems to be the reason he wasn't also in trouble IMO that is.

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    Member Array PaxMentis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by andyw328 View Post
    My understanding is that Hartmann was justified in brandishing his weapon to Cashin because he was stricken to the ground, and suffers from a heart condition requiring sensitive medical equipment to ensure his survival. It seems reasonable to me that, if you have a delicate heart condition and someone strikes you to the ground with such violence that you are bloodied, you might fear for your life. Heart condition or no, being violently forced to the ground by an aggressor is a very vulnerable position; at that point, Hartmann (or anyone) is one stomp away from spinal cord injury, and subsequently a lifetime of paralysis.

    What do you guys think? The law already cleared him, but do you feel Hartmann was right to brandish?
    In this case I would tend to defer to the officers who were there and investigated...they said it was justified.
    Gun Control: The theory that a woman found dead in an alley, raped and strangled with her panty hose, is somehow morally superior to a woman explaining to police how her attacker got that fatal bullet wound.

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