He just started shooting

He just started shooting

This is a discussion on He just started shooting within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I did a search for something like this but didn't find anything so here it goes. I'm sure most of us have heard of the ...

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Thread: He just started shooting

  1. #1
    Member Array TacticalSS's Avatar
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    He just started shooting

    I did a search for something like this but didn't find anything so here it goes.

    I'm sure most of us have heard of the four Lakewood Officers who were assassinated last November. This touches me deeply as it was very close to where I live.

    Let's say you, a law abiding citizen, was in the Forza coffee shop while this was happened. Clearly the guy target the officers and only the officers. If you were legally carrying for firearm that fateful day, would you have intervened? I know there was a struggle to or out the door between one officer and the BG, so probably pulling a gun before they were all down would not be a good idea. Maybe just getting physically involved? No involvement?

    Also something to think about, after he murders the four, he flees from the store. If you were there, with your firearm, would you have done something after he murdered the officers and was running from the scene? It seems pretty clear he was an immediate, life threatening danger to the public, would you have ordered him on the ground and/or shot him if/when he didn't comply?

    I'm trying to stay out of saying what I would do because it's to emotional, and I'm not sure I would have been thinking clearly.


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  2. #2
    Member Array SAMI's Avatar
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    I'd have shot him in the back while leaving the store if that's the best shot that was available to me. If this man was willing to murder 4 LEO, he's capable of taking out anyone. I would more than likely unload an entire magazine of .40 into that SOB.

    EDIT... I'd have no problem taking this guy out in the parking lot either.
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  3. #3
    Member Array TacticalSS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SAMI View Post
    I'd have shot him in the back while leaving the store if that's the best shot that was available to me. If this man was willing to murder 4 LEO, he's capable of taking out anyone.
    Well that's exactly what I would have said/done... glad I'm not the only one.


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    VIP Member Array First Sgt's Avatar
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    Next to my family, those in uniform mean a lot to me. Just because I spent 20 plus years in the military as well as being a Vietnam Vet. We ALL looked out for each other. Go figure. LEO's, Firefighters, EMT's, are all uniform folks as far as I'm concerned. I believe in this circumstance I might have foresaken my "be a good witness" attitude and would have looked for a shot. JMO
    Sometimes in life you have to stand your ground. It's a hard lesson to learn and even most adults don't get it, but in the end only I can be responsible for my life. If faced with any type of adversity, only I can overcome it. Waiting for someone else to take responsibility is a long fruitless wait.

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    Member Array Kenny256's Avatar
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    I would have tried to help or just taken care of it when he was running.
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  6. #6
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    Would I have intervened? If I had any chance of helping save the officers lives I would in a second.

    Once he left however I would not chase him down nor shoot him in the back unless I thought he was out to do more harm.
    YOU are the weapon, your firearm is just a tool!

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    We all know how fast you can shoot four shoots at point blank range. This whole scenario from start to finish could of took 3 seconds. In three seconds I doubt you could of even figured out who was doing what. In 5 seconds you might have a picture of what is going on but not sure who is who. As with any scenario there are a lot of what if's. If I knew who the bad guy was and IF I could draw my fire arm in a timely fashion and take out the bad guy without putting anybody in harms way then yes but I highly doubt that could of been done in the situation.

    Just because you are there does not mean you must respond to the situation. You do what you can or are willing but it is not required.

    God forbid the day when a CCW accidentally shoots an innocent while trying to shoot a bad guy. On that day CC will take the biggest blow ever.

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    VIP Member Array paaiyan's Avatar
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    I don't think I could live with myself knowing I could have possibly prevented or lessened such a tragedy and didn't. If I was sure I knew what was going down and knew I could make the shot safely, I'd have taken it.
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    Member Array OngngFreedom's Avatar
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    Not only yes but "hell yeah".

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    VIP Member Array 9MMare's Avatar
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    I've thought it about a million times. I'm pretty sure I wouldnt have been able to get my weapon clear & aimed by the time he was exiting...he shot all 4 in rapid succession. One cop followed him all the way out to his vehicle (where he shot the POS). So altho I likely would have taken a position of cover in the doorway and looked for a shot...there was a cop in close proximity and all kinds of questions about backstop in that open parking lot. I hope that I would have the frame of mind to get out there and get a plate number...I know I would be rendering first aid to fallen cops.
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  11. #11
    VIP Member Array 9MMare's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Landor View Post
    God forbid the day when a CCW accidentally shoots an innocent while trying to shoot a bad guy. On that day CC will take the biggest blow ever.
    x10 I fear this as well.

    I'm not aware of any such instances....are there?
    Fortune favors the bold.

    Freedom doesn't mean safe, it means free.

    The thing about "defense" is that it has practically nothing to do with guns. (As passed on by CCW9MM)

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    VIP Member Array 9MMare's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tag View Post
    Would I have intervened? If I had any chance of helping save the officers lives I would in a second.

    Once he left however I would not chase him down nor shoot him in the back unless I thought he was out to do more harm.
    I'm fairly sure that shooting him in the back would be justified in most states as there would be a strong likelihood that a reasonable person would believe he could immediately be a danger to others.

    And the cop who followed him out didnt shoot him in the back either, he shot him in the stomach. (Just FYI)
    Fortune favors the bold.

    Freedom doesn't mean safe, it means free.

    The thing about "defense" is that it has practically nothing to do with guns. (As passed on by CCW9MM)

  13. #13
    VIP Member Array chiefjason's Avatar
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    Physically intervene with a MWAG, no. Unless I was the focus of the threat. Basically, I'm not grabbing an armed man unless it's my only choice.

    Take a shot if I got one, yep. In this case, I hope with no hesitation. I can't think of a clearer case where protecting a 3rd party would be justified.

  14. #14
    Member Array steelhawk's Avatar
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    My SA is higher than sheep, but not what Police Officers have. If I was there, I would be scrambling to get cover for myself and/or family first.

    By then, the killer would have been gone, leaving his devastation behind, probably with me wondering what just happened.

    In this scenario, it is unlikely that I could have intervened.

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    Member Array DIXIETWISTER's Avatar
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    I would like to think I would have tried to help, and yes I would have definitely shot him in the back. and probably have ran him down and finished him off...the finish him off might get you in trouble though.
    You may not like guns. You may choose not to own one. That is your right.
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    2)Pray they get there in time." - A wise man

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