What is up with California? - Page 4

What is up with California?

This is a discussion on What is up with California? within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by CEW58 Last summer I took a road trip to San Diego. Prior to going I wrote to the California Bureau of Firearms ...

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  1. #46
    Member Array Rivers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CEW58 View Post
    Last summer I took a road trip to San Diego. Prior to going I wrote to the California Bureau of Firearms to make absolutely sure I would not be in violation of the law there. It was my understanding based on the letter they sent me that my magazines had to be unloaded. Did I misread something or has it changed since last summer?
    Nothing has changed except for how some bureaucrats interpret the law to fit the political climate. For the record, here are the actual statutes so you can interpret them yourself. The big question is: Is a loaded magazine that has been placed next to an unloaded pistol (both inside a locked container) somehow attached to the pistol? No, it isn't. Why isn't it attached? Because if you pick up the pistol, the loaded magazine does not automatically get picked up too.

    The exception to this definition refers to persons who are in the process of committing a felony / gang-related activities. Then the standard of unloaded firearm with ammunition readily available, as on the same person, constitutes a loaded gun.

    Here are the pertinent laws:
    California Penal Code Section 12026.1
    (a) Section 12025 shall not be construed to prohibit any citizen of the United States over the age of 18 years who resides or is temporarily within this state, and who is not prohibited by state or federal law from possessing, receiving, owning, or purchasing a firearm, from transporting or carrying any pistol, revolver, or other firearm capable of being concealed upon the person, provided that the following applies to the firearm:
    (1) The firearm is within a motor vehicle and it is locked in the vehicle's trunk or in a locked container in the vehicle other than the utility or glove compartment.
    (2) The firearm is carried by the person directly to or from any motor vehicle for any lawful purpose and, while carrying the firearm, the firearm is contained within a locked container.
    (b) The provisions of this section do not prohibit or limit the otherwise lawful carrying or transportation of any pistol, revolver, or other firearm capable of being concealed upon the person in accordance with this chapter.
    (c) As used in this section, "locked container" means a secure container which is fully enclosed and locked by a padlock, key lock, combination lock, or similar locking device.

    California Penal Code § 12031(g)
    (g) A firearm shall be deemed to be loaded for the purposes of this section when there is an unexpended cartridge or shell, consisting of a case that holds a charge of powder and a bullet or shot, in, or attached in any manner to, the firearm, including, but not limited to, in the firing chamber, magazine, or clip thereof attached to the firearm; except that a muzzle-loader firearm shall be deemed to be loaded when it is capped or primed and has a powder charge and ball or shot in the barrel or cylinder.


  2. #47
    Distinguished Member Array PastorPack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moga View Post
    SOME of them? *****. Now that's a knee slapper.
    Ok, good point. Most of our gun laws suck. But believe it or not we have a few goodies. For example, CA allows its CCW holders to CC on school campuses, in restaurants with bars, churches, state parks.

    Plus California is home to some of the nation's must see destinations: Yosemite, Sequoia National Park, the Golden Gate Bridge, Surf City (Huntington Beach), Joshua Tree National Monument, Mt. Whitney, Mt. Lassen, the "real" Disnneyland, Redwood forests, Napa valley. Where else can you surf in the morning and ski in the afternoon (yes, I've done it)? We are home to the Pacific Flyway, which boasts some of the best waterfowl hunting in America. And the list goes on and on.

    California's motto: At least we are not as bad as Illinois or New Jersey.
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  3. #48
    Member Array Rivers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PastorPack View Post
    California's motto: At least we are not as bad as Illinois or New Jersey.
    On the up-side, CA is backpedalling into "shall issue" CCW. Being virtually bankrupt, CA is releasing thousands of felons from prison early because we can't afford to house them. It won't be long now, folks.

  4. #49
    Senior Member Array CEW58's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rivers View Post
    On the up-side, CA is backpedalling into "shall issue" CCW. Being virtually bankrupt, CA is releasing thousands of felons from prison early because we can't afford to house them. It won't be long now, folks.
    It would be great if CA went to "shall issue" *and* started honoring out of state permits as well! It's too bad it might take the release of felons (like John A. Gardner III) to make that happen.

    I'd like to come back on future trips as a tourist. The lady I hope to marry has family and friends there. I have family there. But future trips would become even more likely if I could be legally armed for her protection and mine.
    The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits. ~ Albert Einstein

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  5. #50
    Senior Member Array Moga's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rivers View Post
    On the up-side, CA is backpedalling into "shall issue" CCW. Being virtually bankrupt, CA is releasing thousands of felons from prison early because we can't afford to house them. It won't be long now, folks.
    Heavens help you folks. Between that, the illegals, and the narco-terrorists, you all are in a precarious situation and forced to rely on an overtaxed and heavily understaffed law enforcement community. I mean, we all are, but you southern Californians are in another league altogether. I hope it isn't long before you get shall-issue. Hopefully after that you folks can get the AWB-language lifted from your books.
    2nd Amendment: because personal violence never makes an appointment.
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  6. #51
    Member Array Kahrdoor's Avatar
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    Last year I spent 3 months in the Modesto area in CA as a Campground Host. Went to Arizona and got my CCW and got used to concealed carry. I agreed to come back here this year, which I have. Now I am feeling almost naked walking around town with no pistol. Obviously my last time here. Can hardly wait to get back to a friendly state.

  7. #52
    Senior Member Array boatail's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rivers View Post
    In all fairness, the anti-CA rant is seriously misdirected. Anyone reading these forums most assuredly did not vote for the liberal idiots that are currently running CA. Please focus the rant into a forum that actually has readers who voted those jerks into office.

    Generally speaking, gun enthusiasts from CA who remain in CA should be commended for sticking out the fight against Sacramento's anti-gun bias. Whether you (US citizens outside of CA) like it or not, CA and its laws, for better or worse, do influence the rest of the nation. Look at microstamping, for example. If it wasn't for the really smart guys in the pro-gun legal fight here, that law would have actually made a difference that we'd have to overturn in court, a costly time-consuming gamble. But the law is now written so it's more of a non-issue. Think of having an inevitable battle. Our side got the prize defined to something that was worthless, then lost a battle that we knew we couldn't win because of the liberal lawmakers. We lost something that was worthless. Yes, a win would have been a moral victory but we took what we could get. Without our fight and the issues raised in CA, how many other states would have enacted that stupid law? We hope to keep the lawmakers in check while getting the courts to overturn their previous efforts due to Constitutional issues thanks to the recent and upcoming SCOTUS decisions.
    Forgive me, it's not directed at anyone who cares about our right to carry or the state itself, it just really concerns me how the citizens of your state are having their rights whittled away by a few in power that think they know better. It concerns me that it has spread so far already. I don't live there, so I can't vote there, so I rant and rave on occasion. Like I said, sorry, it's not directed at you ( unless you are an elected official ) I'm treading on the fine line of politics here, so I'll zip it...

  8. #53
    Senior Member Array Rob P.'s Avatar
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    Boattail, Most of us understand where you're coming from. However, one flaw in your thinking is believing that "most" Californians are against the gun laws.

    This is NOT true. "Most" Californians live in our 4 large cities (Sacramento, San Francisco, Los Angeles, and San Diego) and outnumber the rest of the State population. It is in these 4 political enclaves that our laws are created and enacted. Even if the rest of the State votes NO! en mass with no exceptions the laws WILL be passed by a majority of voters.

    We have no voice and our votes don't count. THAT is where our political process breaks down.

  9. #54
    Member Array Rivers's Avatar
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    Boatail, no offense taken. I understand how it's intended to those who frustrate the heck out of us. Just don't forget that CA has some of the most dedicated pro-gun activists in the USA. Nothing like a soldier who fights every day to hone some good fightin' skills. Of the cities mentioned, San Diego is actually the only conservative one. Most of our Congressional reps are Republicans, only one is a Dem. And they pretty much all vote along the party lines. We just need to change the political climate in Sacramento too.

  10. #55
    Member Array mkuisi8mo's Avatar
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    Cali & NY are both gulags to stay clear of, regardless of how beautiful their respective geographies are...one has a Feinstein, the other a Schumer...the two gun-grabbing bottom feeding crooks who are authors of the AWB. A reason why the state versions never "sunsetted" when the Fed version did.

    The city political machines control the state, and shove their agendas down the throats of rural country folk who live in the largest land areas.

    There are plenty of "free states" that are equally as beautiful to see, visit and live-in where people are half-way free in this screwed up mess of a deteriorating U.S. of A..

    Getting out of NY was the best move I ever made & will never go back there or to Cali to even visit relatives (including my kids) in both places ever again. If either place has anything I need, I'll get it off the I-net. My relatives can come to see me....if they don't understand, the heck with them...the door swings both ways!
    Last edited by Scott; April 8th, 2010 at 08:14 PM. Reason: Profanity

  11. #56
    VIP Member Array Cupcake's Avatar
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    MI has more coastline than CA and we welcome your AZ permit. We got dunes, a gazillion waterfalls, some lighthouses. Just sayin.
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  12. #57
    Senior Member Array Rob P.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cupcake View Post
    MI has more coastline than CA and we welcome your AZ permit. We got dunes, a gazillion waterfalls, some lighthouses. Just sayin.
    And snow

    And record unemployment

    And snow

    And high crime

    And snow.

    Oh yeah, it snows there too.

  13. #58
    VIP Member Array Cupcake's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rob P. View Post
    And snow

    And record unemployment

    And snow

    And high crime

    And snow.

    Oh yeah, it snows there too.
    Don't leave out the good stuff- we have some of the most experienced soup kitchen workers and trauma surgeons in the country too! Really, It's not that bad unless you're hanging out in a few problem cities. OK, the snow can be annoying.
    Spend few minutes learning about my journey from Zero to Athlete in this mini documentary!
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  14. #59
    Senior Member Array Rob P.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cupcake View Post
    Don't leave out the good stuff- we have some of the most experienced soup kitchen workers and trauma surgeons in the country too! Really, It's not that bad unless you're hanging out in a few problem cities. OK, the snow can be annoying.
    Mi esposa is from Flint. My MIL still lives therebouts. I know all about Michigan and have NO PLANS to EVER move there.

    I would think about retiring & moving to New Mexico or Arizona but would likely stay here in California. My property taxes are ~ $1400/yr on $100K house. I pay 8.25% sales tax and around 12% State income tax. I don't know that I can do better in another State.

  15. #60
    Senior Member Array Moga's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rivers View Post
    Boatail, no offense taken. I understand how it's intended to those who frustrate the heck out of us. Just don't forget that CA has some of the most dedicated pro-gun activists in the USA. Nothing like a soldier who fights every day to hone some good fightin' skills. Of the cities mentioned, San Diego is actually the only conservative one. Most of our Congressional reps are Republicans, only one is a Dem. And they pretty much all vote along the party lines. We just need to change the political climate in Sacramento too.


    Well I sure hope that the reputed "conservative" base in SD helps you folks to bury this bill and its sponsor before it ever sees the light of day:


    Assemblywoman Lori Saldaña, D-San Diego, and allies of legislation she introduced Wednesday to ban the public display of unloaded weapons believe so.

    <That's not my typo; I copied the above directly from the host site. Apparently any one can be a journalist after attaining a fourth-grade ejubukation>

    State law permitting Californians to display their empty-chamber firearms has been on the books since about 1968, drawing little attention.

    But a surge in demonstrations of people exercising that right in the San Diego region and nationally has attracted scrutiny.

    “It wasn’t a problem we had to deal with. As it’s become more prevalent over the last two years, we’ve had to deal with it,” said Emeryville Police Chief Ken James, whose statewide law enforcement organization supports the measure. “If we hadn’t had a lot of these open-carry events, police chiefs probably wouldn’t be involved in it,” he added.

    State bill would end open-carry gun rights - SignOnSanDiego.com
    It is Assembly Bill 1934.
    2nd Amendment: because personal violence never makes an appointment.
    Evil resides in the heart of the individual, not in inanimate objects.
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