The Search For Mediocrity - Page 3

The Search For Mediocrity

This is a discussion on The Search For Mediocrity within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by razor02097 Law enforcement and military get much better training as part of their job. We civilians have to pay out the anus ...

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Thread: The Search For Mediocrity

  1. #31
    VIP Member Array MitchellCT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by razor02097 View Post
    Law enforcement and military get much better training as part of their job. We civilians have to pay out the anus for training and at the end of the day... it's for inferior training. The CCW class (like the driving test) is to make sure you know the minimum laws and to test whether or not you can actually physically handle a gun.
    I duno what classes you've been going to...but I think you have been having different experiences with training that I have.

    Maybe you aught to do more research as to who gets your training money?

    As to paying for training out the bung-hole - you get what you pay for, and you get out of it what you put into it.

    You can invest about $2,000 and 1 to 2 years of "spare time" (some evenings, part or all of weekend/s and an ocasional day off from work for "an important personal matter"...), and if you are willing to do the work in terms of travel to 1 or 2 classes, dry practice at home, time in the gym, the proper reading /DVD material, ect...

    You can gather a skillset that puts you a lot closer to "nightmare" than "noob" fairly quickly. Not overnight...but fairly quickly.

    People seem rather defensive about mediocrity. You can raise the bar to a degree you find uncomfortable and try to achieve it...and you may fail to live up to the standards you set for yourself, but always try to get their with doing just a little more, and a little more...and a little more...

    Or you can set the bar at your own level and be happy with the skills you have. You can complain about the cost of training. The quality of training. The cost of ammo. You don't have time...

    Excuses. They, like the aforementioned anus, all smell.

    I'll leave you with this:

    Losers always whine about their best!, Sean Connery, The Rock (movie), John Patrick Mason, Sound Bite


  2. #32
    Distinguished Member Array razor02097's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MitchellCT View Post
    I duno what classes you've been going to...but I think you have been having different experiences with training that I have.

    Maybe you aught to do more research as to who gets your training money?

    As to paying for training out the bung-hole - you get what you pay for, and you get out of it what you put into it.

    You can invest about $2,000 and 1 to 2 years of "spare time" (some evenings, part or all of weekend/s and an ocasional day off from work for "an important personal matter"...), and if you are willing to do the work in terms of travel to 1 or 2 classes, dry practice at home, time in the gym, the proper reading /DVD material, ect...

    You can gather a skillset that puts you a lot closer to "nightmare" than "noob" fairly quickly. Not overnight...but fairly quickly.

    People seem rather defensive about mediocrity. You can raise the bar to a degree you find uncomfortable and try to achieve it...and you may fail to live up to the standards you set for yourself, but always try to get their with doing just a little more, and a little more...and a little more...

    Or you can set the bar at your own level and be happy with the skills you have. You can complain about the cost of training. The quality of training. The cost of ammo. You don't have time...

    Excuses. They, like the aforementioned anus, all smell.

    I'll leave you with this:

    Losers always whine about their best!, Sean Connery, The Rock (movie), John Patrick Mason, Sound Bite
    You completely missed the point. No matter the training, no matter the mindset, no matter how much you spend. Standing there fighting isn't always the best option.

    I have researched plenty into courses not just defensive pistol training, but unarmed and edged weapon. I am saying as a civilian taking 1 or 2 courses no matter how much they cost isn't always going to be enough to take a looney with a rifle. You have to know when to retreat and when to fight.
    There is something about firing 4,200 thirty millimeter rounds/min that makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside.

  3. #33
    Ex Member Array azchevy's Avatar
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    I work out 4X a week, cardio 5X a week, am active in self defense classes 2X a week, shoot 4X a week, and I go to some sort of training once per quarter. Why? Because I can. Why? Because I want my body to be in top shape and I carry a weapon, I want to be as proficient with that weapon as I can be for something that may never happen to most people, but already has to me years ago.... and I enjoy the hell out of it. It is not a hobby, but a passion. Same reason why IDPA and PP guys train and shoot.... I am competitive with myself. I want to learn and train and be the best I can be.... the training I am getting now in the civilian world is a lot more fight focused than the training I received in the military. Some people are addicted to video games, or collecting things, or watching sports.... I am addicted to training and shooting. It has been in my blood since I was a young child. Not to mention it was job specific for me for years. Even now I still keep it up. Why? Because I enjoy it. I would rather go into a door with a bunch of trained and over confident individuals than a bunch of confident and untrained individuals any day of the week.

  4. #34
    Member Array Bandolero's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by razor02097 View Post
    Law enforcement and military get much better training as part of their job. We civilians have to pay out the anus for training and at the end of the day... it's for inferior training.
    I don't know that I would necessarily agree with that. I have trained with John Farnam, Gabe Suarez and Mas' Ayoob and found their training to be pretty darn good. Better than some of the other training I have had.

    I think the LEO/military training world is much like the civilian training world. There are different levels of training one can go through, often depending upon one's job. Basic academy training is often geared for the successful passage of the lowest common denominators. It reminds me of some of the bare bones CCW classes where a student is not going to learn anything exceptional.

    And then there is the world of LEO tactical teams/Spec Ops. The training there is exponentially elevated above that of the basic training level. As a civilian if you attend some of the better civilian training courses, you will find that what you are training in is exponentially elevated above that of the basic CCW classes.

    Some of the best firearms guys I have ever met have been in civilian courses. Many of them are way better than folks I used to work with. Higher level of commitment. Better handling skills. Seeking to improve themselves versus being forced to attend training.

    True dat that many LEOs/soldiers do not have to pay for their training, but many do on their own dime. And many of them go to these civilian courses to try and give themselves every training edge they can.

  5. #35
    Distinguished Member Array bladenbullet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MitchellCT View Post

    People seem rather defensive about mediocrity.

    Excuses. They, like the aforementioned anus, all smell.

    I'll leave you with this:

    Losers always whine about their best!, Sean Connery, The Rock (movie), John Patrick Mason, Sound Bite
    actually...people get just as defensive about how much training they believe someone should have and how much they have themselves...it seems to be a measurement of appendages of sorts for some...but does not prove they are capable of making rational decisions...

    what is it on this site that makes people want to use the stuff they see and hear in movies to support their claims to superiority?...what an interesting concept....use fantasy to support reality...

    we're not going to watch tom cruise take on a bad guy with a gun again are we?...

    Quote Originally Posted by razor02097 View Post
    You completely missed the point. No matter the training, no matter the mindset, no matter how much you spend. Standing there fighting isn't always the best option.

    I have researched plenty into courses not just defensive pistol training, but unarmed and edged weapon. I am saying as a civilian taking 1 or 2 courses no matter how much they cost isn't always going to be enough to take a looney with a rifle. You have to know when to retreat and when to fight.
    it seems some believe the training they have along with the fact that they are allowed to carry a gun makes them believe they are held to an order of requirement to face the demons and rid the world of them...a rite of passage perhaps?...

  6. #36
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    the article was written by Gabe Suarez, I got the email myself a couple days ago, it was not anti-gun, far from it....it was think about what you are doing and don't just get a gun and leave it in the nightstand thinking it will all work ok and you'll perform ok when the SHTF

    bash on Suarez and his stuff if you want,....thats not the point and I'm not defending him

    the point is you the individual need to make a decision to carry seriously, not just I want a gun and all will be well;
    you need to make the decision of what to carry based on whats right for you--research, test, try, etc, not make your decision because of Billy Bob says its the best while putting up product and prices on his pawn shop shelves or decked out in his XXXX brand attire,
    and you need to make the decision to best prepare yourself (train) to be prepared to use that weapon in scenarios other than just someone breaking into your house or just xxxxxx because it can happen anywhere, there are dirtbags out there in every place imaginable and you could be forced to draw anywhere anytime

    the point about the gun store guy is there since it does exist...I've seen it at pawn shop/gun stores, Academy, and Gander Mountain too
    I've personally observed them spread frivolous BS and inaccurate info about the gun laws, what CHL holders can/can't do, and what ammunition and firearms can/can't do, not saying all gun counter workers are like that--thankfully they are not, but some like this do exist
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  7. #37
    Ex Member Array azchevy's Avatar
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    You folks that think you don't need to train and that people who train are in some kind of dick measuring contest should sit down and read a book that precedes all of the tacticool trainers.... Kill or get Killed by Col. Rex Applegate. and also read Bullseyes Don't Shoot Back by Mike Janich and Rex Applegate.

    Good reads.

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bandolero View Post
    So he went to the local gunstore and allowed the oversized cigar smoking salesman to patronize him into buying a double action only Smith and Wesson because it had several safeties and a real heavy and long trigger pull. "It was great for a mediocrity-seeking civilian like John", announced the salesman as he wiped doughnut juice on his Police Revolver Club t-shirt.

    John asked about the Glocks and XDs and M&Ps that looked so modern and cool. "Oh no...those are for professionals son....you are a civilian...you don't need anything like that". Being a mediocrity seeker, and not wanting to be guilty of the sin of arguing, he bought the Smith and Wesson and went home.
    There's nothing mediocre about a S&W revolver. And I don't know where the "several safeties" comes from unless you count the transfer bar and the internal lock. The IL being the only manual safety, and one which I simply ignore.
    Blessed be the Lord my rock who trains my hands for war and my fingers for battle. Psalm 144:1

    Si vis pacem, para bellum

  9. #39
    Distinguished Member Array bladenbullet's Avatar
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    by the way...to elaborate on sean connery's statement in the movie...the part he left out was that the winner doesnt know that the prom queen was getting it already from a guy who didnt play at all...

    theres always more sides to the story than even the winners want to talk about...

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Landric View Post
    I guess I should retire or move to a cave. I carry revolvers for self defense and I'd much rather have a 8-shot M1 Garand than a M4 with 9 pounds of tacticool accessories stuck all over it and a bottomless Beta-C magazine to feed it in the event I found myself in need of a long gun.
    You betcha!
    Since when did a Garand lose its effectiveness?
    I can't believe all the crap that is classified as a "Must have" for firearms these days. Seems to me like the old Springfield muzzle loader with a minie ball put more people in the grave than all the overloaded ARs tucked in the home safes.
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  11. #41
    VIP Member Array MitchellCT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bladenbullet View Post

    what is it on this site that makes people want to use the stuff they see and hear in movies to support their claims to superiority?...what an interesting concept....use fantasy to support reality...
    You didn't get the voice quote saying something I couldn't type here?

    About losers doing their best, and winners going home to nail the prom queen?

    Go to that site again, and click on the link to the movie quote wav file.

    You will understand once you hear Sean Connery explain it in one statement.

  12. #42
    Distinguished Member Array bladenbullet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MitchellCT View Post
    You didn't get the voice quote saying something I couldn't type here?

    About losers doing their best, and winners going home to nail the prom queen?

    Go to that site again, and click on the link to the movie quote wav file.

    You will understand once you hear Sean Connery explain it in one statement.
    ive seen the movie plenty of times and am familiar with it...my post stands along with the follow up to it...

  13. #43
    VIP Member Array MitchellCT's Avatar
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    Well, that line being the only closing point I was making, I don't see how the movie factors in any other way.

    Maybe I should have simply posted the quote and got another infraction. It would be easier...

  14. #44
    Distinguished Member Array razor02097's Avatar
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    bickering over a movie quote? Come on....
    There is something about firing 4,200 thirty millimeter rounds/min that makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside.

  15. #45
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    "When you're afraid of everything out there, quit going out there." - Zombieland


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