The flip side....I stopped a CHL holder

This is a discussion on The flip side....I stopped a CHL holder within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Totally agree that's the best practice in terms of defending yourself against a charge. When pulled over, that's not usually my goal though: I've usually ...

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Thread: The flip side....I stopped a CHL holder

  1. #31
    New Member Array Photographer's Avatar
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    Totally agree that's the best practice in terms of defending yourself against a charge. When pulled over, that's not usually my goal though: I've usually got a good idea why I'm being pulled over, since I have a heavy foot. If I get a ticket, I'll pay it.

    By being candid and polite with the officer though, I only get a ticket in 50% of encounters, and probably a third of those tickets are for offenses that are non-reportable to insurance companies, such as obstructed view for the dash mounted GPS.

    Technically illegal, it serves as reminder to watch my speed, without generating a (insurance) points generating traffic ticket.

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  3. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by dldeuce View Post
    Hmm, not enough of a concern for your safety to even bother asking about a gun at first contact.
    At first contact I do what I'm trained to do....get ID/insurance.
    My comments about this guy's license/reg/insurance/etc was because most of the time all of it isn't in order.

    We don't make stops and immediately go up and ask if they have a gun. Other stuff depends on the stop, how the person is acting, the vehicle, etc. For instance, this guy was wearing a backpack. I made him take it off and set it on the ground, made him stay on his bike.
    He never showed any signs or gave any indication of being anything other than a heavy throttle rider.

    Quote Originally Posted by dldeuce
    Good thing they "finally" have that thing "working." Yet, it only "works" for the small sliver of society that is least likely to be the kind of desperate individuals that would risk capital murder of a police officer over a $150 speeding ticket. I suppose that if this person had just robbed a bank and is actually armed and dangerous, you'd be relieved that you didn't get the BEEP BEEP "Concealed Weapons Permit" message on your computer? You just made initial contact with an armed and dangerous criminal, but at least you can rest assured he doesn't have a concealed weapons permit?
    You obviously haven't paid attention to me/my posts on this site
    I'm not a LEO that is against civilian gun ownership or anti-carry.
    I don't hassle people with guns/permits. I had my CHL for 5 years before becoming LEO and still maintain it.
    I am on the same side of the fence as you are with the CHL must notify vs everyone else doesn't have to....I think its stupid.
    Your comments/questions here are nothing but provocative to a person that you don't understand and don't need to provoke. I remember your problems with LE, your delay in getting your CHL, etc and I understand all those concerns, but don't direct that resentment towards me. And please don't detract from the thread.
    I made my statement about our computer finally working right since it now gives me information about wanted people and other info I need, not because I can now bust the chops of a CHL holder (meaning its using the database properly now). Me personally, I don't care if someone is CHL when I run their stuff. I know in other places it will cause the officer to overreact and drag the person through the muck.
    I'd rather have more interaction with a CHL holder since I like to converse with them and show them we like the fact they have a license and take care of themselves.
    LEO/CHL
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    "I got a touch of hangover bureaucrat, don't push me"
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    Independence is declared; it must be maintained. Sam Houston-3/2/1836
    If loose gun laws are good for criminals why do criminals support gun control?

  4. #33
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    I haven't read all the posts...

    Quote Originally Posted by BlueNinjaGo View Post
    71 in a 45 and you let him off without a ticket? Jeesh... I never got that lucky and I was never THAT far over the speed limit.
    ...and don't on some of these long threads. I don't remember reading where he let the guy off without a ticket. Obviously, speeding wasn't the main issue.

  5. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by StevePVB View Post
    ...and don't on some of these long threads. I don't remember reading where he let the guy off without a ticket. Obviously, speeding wasn't the main issue.
    yeah...6th line of my starting post I said
    I write his ticket and go to him and ask: "Do you have your gun with you?"
    ....but speeding was the main issue, the reason I stopped him
    LEO/CHL
    Certified Glock Armorer

    "I got a touch of hangover bureaucrat, don't push me"
    --G.W. McClintock

    Independence is declared; it must be maintained. Sam Houston-3/2/1836
    If loose gun laws are good for criminals why do criminals support gun control?

  6. #35
    VIP Member Array Eagleks's Avatar
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    I don't do anything to get stopped...That's the easiest way to handle it. LOL.

    About 90 % here, when they see it pop-up, won't even ask if they are carrying... it's irrevelant... unless the person is doing something or showing that there may be a need to know.

  7. #36
    VIP Member Array dukalmighty's Avatar
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    Maybe If I show him my CHL he will overlook the 12 anxious looking non-english speaking passengers in my Toyota prius that are using bales of pot for seats
    "Outside of the killings, Washington has one of the lowest crime rates in the country,"
    --Mayor Marion Barry, Washington , DC .

  8. #37
    Senior Member Array Curt58's Avatar
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    I got a speeding ticket last year. I was driving my sons Volvo on a Country road and decided to see how it corners for a distance of about 1/2 mile. This road is on the way to my house so I know it well. The DPS Officer clocked me from the other direction as I was exiting the corner. (70 in a 60) I notice in the mirror he starts to turn around, so I just find a safe place to pull over at a cattle guard, as this Country road has no shoulder and no traffic to speak of but occasional Oil Field Trucks and Farmers . I exit the car before he gets out and lean against the left rear fender with my insurance, my sons insurance, and my license and CHL. I tell him I have a gun in the car and and figured he'd rather I not be near it. He looks in the car and asks, "Where is it?" I reply, "In the door pocket". He looks in the seat of the car but the door is closed so there is no way he can see it. He doesn't look very hard, just heads to his car and says stay right there. To which I reply, "No Problem".
    He writes me a ticket and hands it to me to sign. Gets in his car and drives off like he's a little put out. Funny side note, the Officer and I have the same last name.
    The Volvo drives nice and I'd been using the cruise control all week while I had it to keep it at the speed limit. But, just my luck, this one time I decide to play on a nearly deserted road, and I get caught. I usually drive a noisy Dodge Diesel Pickup and can always tell how fast I'm going. But, that Volvo! 70 feels like 50 in it. And it corners like it's on rails.
    My son tells me High End European cars are ticket magnets.

    Just thought I'd share my first stop while armed.
    Rather anticlimatic huh?

  9. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by dukalmighty View Post
    Maybe If I show him my CHL he will overlook the 12 anxious looking non-english speaking passengers in my Toyota prius that are using bales of pot for seats
    LEO/CHL
    Certified Glock Armorer

    "I got a touch of hangover bureaucrat, don't push me"
    --G.W. McClintock

    Independence is declared; it must be maintained. Sam Houston-3/2/1836
    If loose gun laws are good for criminals why do criminals support gun control?

  10. #39
    Distinguished Member Array BlueNinjaGo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by StevePVB View Post
    ...and don't on some of these long threads. I don't remember reading where he let the guy off without a ticket. Obviously, speeding wasn't the main issue.
    Yeah... I read all the posts, and I thought i read the OP carefully, but somehow my eyes skimmed over the part where he said he wrote him a ticket. I noticed the "I pleaded with him to slow down", which I guess my brain connected with "gave a firm warning"...

  11. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlueNinjaGo View Post
    Yeah... I read all the posts, and I thought i read the OP carefully, but somehow my eyes skimmed over the part where he said he wrote him a ticket. I noticed the "I pleaded with him to slow down", which I guess my brain connected with "gave a firm warning"...
    he got a firm warning too.....'do it again and I'll give you another ticket' (no I didn't really say that)
    LEO/CHL
    Certified Glock Armorer

    "I got a touch of hangover bureaucrat, don't push me"
    --G.W. McClintock

    Independence is declared; it must be maintained. Sam Houston-3/2/1836
    If loose gun laws are good for criminals why do criminals support gun control?

  12. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by 64zebra View Post
    you do NOT have to inform unless you are carrying!
    This hasn't changed, its the same as when I took the class in 2005.
    rant off
    Texas recently decriminalized failure to inform. There is no longer any penalty for not informing a LEO that you are carrying.
    Glock "Perfection" is not just a slogan; it is truth in advertising.

  13. #42
    Senior Member Array dldeuce's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 64zebra View Post
    At first contact I do what I'm trained to do....get ID/insurance.
    More importantly, youíre trained to be keenly alert to gun possession in this critical and risky first interaction. You werenít concerned enough to ask. Not when you first approached and not when you returned with the ticket in hand.

    We don't make stops and immediately go up and ask if they have a gun.
    I've driven for over thirty years in Texas. Never once had I been asked about gun possession until I got a CHL.

    I don't hassle people with guns/permits.
    Don't take it so personally, but you were hassling this driver by asking him intrusive questions relating to potential violations of law as a police officer. I got stopped at a federal checkpoint in a national park, and I was asked invasive questions about my possessions in my car. "Is there anything in your car I need to know about?" You may not consider that hassling, but I do. Being questioned under threat of law is being hassled, and cops are only systematically hassling CHL holders over gun possession. You were questioning about gun possession necessarily as part of official business as a police officer. Whether you intended it to be a hassle isn't relevant.

    Me personally, I don't care if someone is CHL when I run their stuff. I know in other places it will cause the officer to overreact and drag the person through the muck.
    Everything was good. Then in your own words ďBeep Beep Beep Concealed Weapons Permit.Ē As a police officer already actively enforcing the law, youíre then questioning him about firearm possession. Donít take it personally. This process is virtually a statewide official policy. I find it offensive and discriminatory. If you donít agree with the policy, then donít participate in it. Mind your own business. In my book, that will go a lot further towards demonstrating respect for the rights of the citizens who pay your salary.

    I'd rather have more interaction with a CHL holder since I like to converse with them and show them we like the fact they have a license and take care of themselves.
    It would be nice if you could actually speak for all police officers, but you cannot. You do not represent all police, and your representation of all police as liking the CHL laws is definitely not accurate. However, Iíve been on the receiving end of exactly this kind of interaction. I was stopped. I was asked about gun possession, and the guy complimented me for actually having the gun with me. I still resented being questioned. I still resented being forced to answer. I still felt hassled. Like I said, his intention was irrelevant.

  14. #43
    VIP Member Array 9MMare's Avatar
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    Curious about the federal checkpoint in a National Park. Was it at an entrance where you paid?

    What did they ask about specifically?

    Because people dont always *know* the laws and regulations pertaining to a park before they get there and havent read them yet, rangers will often ask about alcohol, guns (previous to new law change), etc. By asking first, it can save people tickets/expulsion later.

    The regs and laws between nat. parks and nat. forests are completely different, not to mention those of other natural areas, like state parks and wilderness areas, BLM, etc. The majority of the public doesnt even realize that these places have different designations, much less regs.

    Also, some major highways go thru parks and once you stop within the park, people may not be aware of different regs.
    Fortune favors the bold.

    Freedom doesn't mean safe, it means free.

    The thing about "defense" is that it has practically nothing to do with guns. (As passed on by CCW9MM)

  15. #44
    Senior Member Array dldeuce's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 9MMare View Post
    Curious about the federal checkpoint in a National Park. Was it at an entrance where you paid?
    No. It was inside the park, and they were stopping every car in both directions.

    What did they ask about specifically?
    Any and everything they could think of that would justify further harassment. They were on a generic fishing expedition. "We're the federal government, and we'd like to know if you have anything we'd be interested in your car? You know, so we can assure that you're safe." Just a friendly stop so the federal government can have a little chat with you about safety. That's not harassment right?

    Because people dont always *know* the laws and regulations pertaining to a park before they get there and havent read them yet, rangers will often ask about alcohol, guns (previous to new law change), etc. By asking first, it can save people tickets/expulsion later.
    The federal government had absolutely no business stopping every car at a gestapo checkpoint harassing every driver about state laws like inspection stickers and seat belts. They weren't doing anyone any favors. Their intention was supposedly to perform a public service, but their intention was irrelevant. What they were doing was harassment.

    Likewise, state and local police aren't doing some kind of good will public service by questioning only CHL holders about firearms. They want to do a public service to the citizens? Mind their own business and leave us alone unless probable cause of a crime or a threat to their own safety necessitates otherwise.

  16. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by dldeuce View Post
    No. It was inside the park, and they were stopping every car in both directions.

    Any and everything they could think of that would justify further harassment. They were on a generic fishing expedition. "We're the federal government, and we'd like to know if you have anything we'd be interested in your car? You know, so we can assure that you're safe." Just a friendly stop so the federal government can have a little chat with you about safety. That's not harassment right?


    The federal government had absolutely no business stopping every car at a gestapo checkpoint harassing every driver about state laws like inspection stickers and seat belts. They weren't doing anyone any favors. Their intention was supposedly to perform a public service, but their intention was irrelevant. What they were doing was harassment.

    Were they asking about safety stuff like stickers and seat belts or were they asking about car contents? It's 2 different things. And I'm pretty sure it's BS that they *said* what I bolded above. Were they asking questions about safety? Or were they asking about other stuff?????

    Because safety inspections are perfectly legal and even you admitted they have a purpose. They do them sometimes looking for drunk drivers. Sorry it was an inconvenience. Based on what you've told me so far, you're just mad you got delayed and felt it was intrusive...but thus far said nothing that makes it seem unwarranted or unnecessary. States do this stuff sometimes. Also, you kept saying state and fed....which was it? Was it both?
    Fortune favors the bold.

    Freedom doesn't mean safe, it means free.

    The thing about "defense" is that it has practically nothing to do with guns. (As passed on by CCW9MM)

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