April 23rd, 2010 03:05 PM
Deadly force is deadly force. If you shoot someone with ANY kind of firearm and ANY kind of ammunition, there is a substantial chance of killing that person.
Originally Posted by GOSmartGO
The plain truth is that all the best ways of stopping somebody in a deadly force situation have a reasonable chance of killing them.
What do you win if you shoot somebody trying to kill you, they succeed in killing you, then die in the hospital a week later?
If I have to shoot, it'll be to stop. If that kills my assailant, then that's just another reason NOT to do things which cause innocent people to have to shoot you.
If you aren't practicing trying to keep your assailant from beating, choking, stabbing or shooting you while you're working the slide, you're not really practicing for the scenario which you've created for yourself. I suspect that you're going to find that a LOT harder than just drawing and chambering a round. Do you know how you're going to chamber a round one handed while hanging onto an assailant's arm, a butcher knife clutched in his hand, while the two of you gyrate wildly about? If you don't, you might want to consider carrying with a round chambered.
Originally Posted by GOSmartGO
April 23rd, 2010 03:12 PM
i have a gun, holster, etc.
my first time on here. read the question and the responses.
very good question & answers.
i have taught n.r.a. pistol and PP classes for years. i chose not to do multi student size classes. instead i do one or two at a time. i feel i can do a better job that way.
in the PP class, the last two chapters had to be taught by a lawyer, police officer, judge, etc. they taught what happens 'after you pull the trigger '. first class was a real eye opener for me.
all the legel stuff showed up. a cost was placed on your defense. right or wrong, it will cost you dearly to defend yourself. thing is you are alive and well. training is the key. common sense is a key, as is the fine line between pulling the trigger and not pulling the trigger. if you have not done so yourself, then i suggest you check out this aspect of gun ownership.
people who carry concealed, or who just own a firearm, should always remember the responsibility that goes with gun ownership.
training is the first step in attaining that responsibility. know your firearm, know your limitations, know your strong points, improve on your weak points.
maybe i have entered some information you can use. i know i will learn a lot from this site. everyone be safe and careful.
April 23rd, 2010 03:18 PM
I've been carrying 6 months and have been studying hard daily. The shooting part is important, but what I believe is even more critical is the mind training that must take place for your and others safety.
I spent many hours at in the following forum section as they discuss real world and potential scenarios. Don't just read but put yourself in the position of the defender. Even experts here after years of study have difficulty the first time something really bad goes down. They say "I couldn't believe this was happening" and often hesitate. The better prepared you are mentally the better your chance of surviving.
Carry & Defensive Scenarios
PS: I printed out many excellent articles and put them into a binder as a textbook for my education. You'll need to read them more than once.
Last edited by OldLincoln; April 23rd, 2010 at 03:20 PM.
Reason: Add PS
April 23rd, 2010 06:09 PM
i didn't read all the replies but if no one mentioned it....practice practice practice with the weak hand also - its gratifying to be able to hit the mark with either hand - a least to me
"Gun control is like trying to reduce drunk driving by making it tougher for sober people to own cars."
April 23rd, 2010 07:50 PM
The LCP has a long, heavy trigger pull and is perfectly safe being carried with one in the chamber. A human can briefly run 15' in one second. How fast can you draw, rack, aim, and fire? Racking has two downsides:
Or, if I was faced with a threat, would I be able to rack the slide in time?
1. It requires memory to do it. You must, in the panic of battle, remember your gun is empty to begin with. For example, my young daughter wanted a revolver for her bedside. She chose a hammerless. Her reasoning? "I don't want the temptation of taking the time to cock the hammer to be there if I need to fire quickly." I agreed with her reasoning.
2. Racking requires your off hand which you may not have free. You may be carrying something, or fending off the BG or pushing a loved one behind you as the BG approaches.
April 23rd, 2010 08:05 PM
+1 for the Speer GDHP. That's what I carry in all of my .380's
I always carry +1. Even when I carried my LCP inside my vest at work (via Kel-Tec belt clip) I carried it with one in the chamber.
And welcome to the forum!
Colt New Agent, Dan Wesson V-Bob, Glock 19,20SF, 23, 26, 27, 29, 30SF, 36, Kahr P380 w/CT, PM9, PM45, CW9(SOLD), Kel-Tec P32, P3AT, PF9(SOLD), Kimber Ultra Crimson Carry II, Stainless Pro TLE/RL II (SOLD), Rohrbaugh R9s, Ruger LCP w/CT, LCR, SP101 S&W J-Frame 638 w/CT, M&P 340 w/CT, Walther PPK/S
April 23rd, 2010 08:52 PM
Next practice at a distance that is more realistic for self defense. I believe the majority of self defense shootings occurs at about 4 to 9 feet. A lot closer than 21 feet.
April 23rd, 2010 09:10 PM
One in the chamber for me even when using my Smartcarry. The fine folks of this forum helped me see the light on that question.
As for FMJ my two backup magazines are loaded with FMJ. I figure if I have fired 19 rounds of hollow points and the fight is not over I'm in deep doo doo. At that point in time I want something that can penetrate a lot of things. I might be wrong in my thinking but I'll stay with it for now.
I carry four magazines.
April 24th, 2010 11:24 AM
Regarding hollow point rounds, make SURE that the exact rounds you carry are ones you've shot at least a box or two of and that they feed properly. Some pocket guns like the LCP are well oiled machines with FMJ but get a little fussy with hollow points (especially when new- glad you've broken yours in.)
NOTE OF CAUTION: Ruger specifically states that you should NOT fire +P ammo (or any "hot" loaded ammo) from the LCP. Make sure that whatever you buy/carry is something your gun can handle without blowing up.
While hollow points generally have less chance of overpenetration than FMJ, it is far better to shoot FMJ if that feeds 100% of the time over JHP that fail more often.
Like many things, it's not about what people say, but about what actually IS. Make sure to carry the best ammo you can that feeds well in your gun and that you can actually shoot well with.
April 24th, 2010 12:20 PM
I agree with the FMJ vs HP argument. I carry Federal 155gr .40. Definitely keep one in the chamber.
My shooting practice involves groups of 3-4. I also practice quick follow ups with multiple targets, including quickly replacing the magazine.
Knowing is half the battle.
April 24th, 2010 02:57 PM
I carry a .380 Taurus TCP and at first I didn't feel comfortable carrying with a round in the chamber. I got over it in about a week or two.
As far as shooting to kill, just remember you are shooting to SURVIVE. The BG's health is secondary and his death can be an unfortunate side effect to your right to self preservation.
April 24th, 2010 04:56 PM
April 24th, 2010 06:33 PM
Yeah, in addition to what you said, don't forget to practice, practice, practice.
Daniel L. Hawes - 540 347 2430 - HTTP://www.VirginiaLegalDefense.com
Nothing I say as "user" should be taken as either advertising for attorney services or legal advice. Legal questions should be presented to a competent attorney licensed to practice in the relevant state.
April 25th, 2010 05:22 PM
Let me get this straight. You bought a P238 and an LCP both in .380?
Why in the world would you buy two guns of the same caliber?
Edited to add question: Why did you not buy a larger caliber gun and THEN, the 380?
It just sticks out like a sore thumb. Simply, trade the 380 you don't like in on a 9mm and carry THAT as a primary and have the 380 as the BUG. Sorry, but your "logic" is slapping me up-side-the-head....
Last edited by Gibber; April 25th, 2010 at 05:26 PM.
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