pocket carry J frame making me lazy

This is a discussion on pocket carry J frame making me lazy within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Up untill I got my M38 J frame I carried my Glock 26 everywhere. The days that I didnt wear it to work in a ...

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Thread: pocket carry J frame making me lazy

  1. #1
    Senior Member Array camsdaddy's Avatar
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    pocket carry J frame making me lazy

    Up untill I got my M38 J frame I carried my Glock 26 everywhere. The days that I didnt wear it to work in a smart carry I put it on as soon as I entered the house. I thought about it last night on my way to Walmart that I had left the house with only my J frame after dark to go to the most dangerous store in town. I have been carrying my M38 in my front pocket to work just because its easier and I work at a laid back ag related business that is pretty low threat. I feel that 5 will be enough in almost any situation. We have had one couple murdered here at our Walmart its also a place where young folk like to go to just wander around. I dont know I just wonder if I thought I needed a 10+ gun that I was confident it 6 months ago and nothing has really changed other than I have aquired the perfect pocket solution.

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  3. #2
    VIP Member Array xXxplosive's Avatar
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    Carried a J for 18 yrs..................never had any issues with it and it was there when it was needed.

  4. #3
    Member Array MN2Go's Avatar
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    Many people carry the J-frame as a primary, because it’s reliable, lightweight, powerful enough (?) and small – easy to carry every day.

    On the other hand, 5 rounds and a speed strip or two, are limitations in the SD situation with numerous BGs. This is where the tactics come in play. How to deal with, for example, two BGs? Start with the closest with a double and head shots to the second and the rest of the pack, should there be more attackers? Every round should count, because shot placement is critical.

    Carrying a G26 (or any other firearm) presents its own potential problems. The gun may jam and you need to reload or clear it in the middle of the situation. Nothing is guaranteed in life.

    I was quite content carrying a 640 for a long time. My situation has changed somewhat, and I feel the need for more firepower. Due to the fact that 90 % of my shooting (round count) has been with 1911, I feel most comfortable with that design.

    Everybody needs to evaluate his or her situation and select the gun accordingly. There is nothing wrong with choosing the J-frame as the primary. It has served well for a long time – an excellent track record.

    I’ve never heard anyone complaining having too much firepower when the need arises.

    J-frame is the perfect pocket solution for many of us.

  5. #4
    Member Array proscene's Avatar
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    Statistics

    While not 100% iron clad:
    Majority of gun incidences last no more than five seconds and no more than 5 rounds fired in the conflict. But, that being said I want 10 or more rounds available to me IF I ever have a confrontation.
    Glock 32 & 27
    Kimber Ultra & Crimson
    Ruger SR9c
    Kahr PM9
    Sig P238

  6. #5
    Member Array LawyerDagget's Avatar
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    I have a J-frame and as a matter of fact I am carrying it solo today in an ankle holster. It is comfortable and I just didn't want to fully gear up today...yet as I stood in the closet mulling this over, I had to admit to myself that I wasn't doing the optimal, I was trying to slide by today and I knew it. Yet I did it anyway.

    I have taken a lot of training with Tom Givens, and generally in every class he says something that usually catches me dead to rights, dispels a myth, hits a nerve, serves as epiphany in some way. At his Tulsa conference a couple of weeks ago, he mentioned "how many of you head to the Stop & Rob at 9 pm because you are out of milk and just slip the J-frame into your pocket?"

    Of course I have done that, and even after hearing this I have done it again today. He reminded everyone that generally the J-frame is a single-serve choice. Statistically the numbers he points to are eye-opening concerning multiple assailant attacks. He compiles records on his students involved in shootings after they take his training as well as from the FBI uniform crime report. It is hard to deny that my J-frame and 5 shots is not optimal. You will fight with what you have on you.

    I sat their convicted...guilty. My J-frame is best used as my bug, a fact I know yet still allow myself to do what I did today. So, now that I have typed this message and feel thoroughly guilty, I'll go home at lunch and get my primary carry.

    You mileage may vary, but I'm convinced I should carry my primary all the time, with my spares and not backslide. I'm certainly not passing judgment on the snubbie (neither is Givens), but I don't get to pick the day I will need my pistol, and when I need it I will need it really bad, so for me I need to fight the lazys that I had today.

    Just my two cents

  7. #6
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    I've been carrying a revolver as my ccw for 8 years. A 5 round revolver in your hand is better than a 19 round pistol at home on the night stand.
    It is surely true that you can lead a horse to water but you can't make them drink. Nor can you make them grateful for your efforts.

  8. #7
    Member Array LawyerDagget's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by atctimmy View Post
    I've been carrying a revolver as my ccw for 8 years. A 5 round revolver in your hand is better than a 19 round pistol at home on the night stand.
    I'm don't think anyone would disagree with this.

  9. #8
    Senior Member Array Moga's Avatar
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    Good post LD. Also, as MN2Go has stated, there isn't a one-size-fits-all solution that will accommodate all of our needs.

    I really like wheel guns but have given them up as primary carry weapons. With regards to the limited amount of ammunition that the system accommodates, add to that the fact that the average carrier isn't likely to achieve > 50% hit rate during a critical incident. Actually, it's not even close. So, you may have one or two rounds with which to possibly encourage several people break off an attack. Know how quickly your gun will be empty? Take a j frame to a dynamic defensive course and see just how soon you'll be reloading after you hear "threat!" Quicker than most of us would like, and putting fire on targets, even under contrived duress, isn't close to being a fair approximation of the stress a person is under when they're suddenly being attacked and forced to fight back with their gun. Hell, the time it takes to drop an empty mag, draw a new one before recharging a bottom feeder is concerning enough. I don't want to allow the attackers to regain their composure and possibly return fire while I fumble with a latch release, or if they're high on intoxicants and not immediately registering pain that's been rendered by a 38 projectile to keep progressing toward me with what ever else is at their disposal.

    Naah, I don't like those chances. I like my j frame but its strictly a BUG. I don't even carry it at home anymore. Make my EDC a large caliber double stacker with at least one extra mag at all times so I can dump modest amounts of fire as quickly as possible in the direction of the threat(s).
    2nd Amendment: because personal violence never makes an appointment.
    Evil resides in the heart of the individual, not in inanimate objects.
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  10. #9
    Member Array Bkrazy's Avatar
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    I sometimes opt for the P3AT while running to the store. I weigh my options and realize what I am doing when I head out the door. Any time I head to a Stop and Rob or a Rob Mart after dark, my situational awareness is heightened. I dont know what it is about the places I have been stationed but they dont have the best of neighborhoods surrounding them. 6 rounds will get me away from a threat and that is all I need to do is get away. If it is a family trip then I will bring my primary.

  11. #10
    Member Array Agamemnon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bkrazy View Post
    6 rounds will get me away from a threat and that is all I need to do is get away. If it is a family trip then I will bring my primary.
    That's a pretty big assumption to make with your life on the line. What if you're jumped? What if there is more than one assailant? Two? Four? All within 'reach out and touch someone' distance? What if you trip? Pull a muscle? Have an assailant who's faster than you?

    I go out often with just my M36 and a five loose rounds in my pocket as spares. I make my decisions based on what I'm doing at the moment. Being armed is the first, most important thing. How many, and what with, are something all together different.

    But using any excuse that has some variation of the following..

    1) I'm a great shot and worship at the altar of 'shot placement', so I don't need any more than X, or no larger caliber than Y.

    2) X rounds is all I need to get away from a SD situation.

    .. is not the right way to think. I don't care who you are, unless you are practiced at being in SD situations, making assumptions based on shot placement, or the ability to flee, is specious and dangerous. Yes, shot placement is very very important, and so is being aware of your surroundings and knowing the avenues of escape. But those things aren't a defense, in and of themselves, and there are no guarantees that either will be successful when it's go time.

    Running against a clock and shooting at inanimate objects simply don't replicate a real world SD scenario. Be careful how you justify your SD choices.

  12. #11
    Member Array Bkrazy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agamemnon View Post
    That's a pretty big assumption to make with your life on the line. What if you're jumped? What if there is more than one assailant? Two? Four? All within 'reach out and touch someone' distance? What if you trip? Pull a muscle? Have an assailant who's faster than you?

    But using any excuse that has some variation of the following..

    1) I'm a great shot and worship at the altar of 'shot placement', so I don't need any more than X, or no larger caliber than Y.

    2) X rounds is all I need to get away from a SD situation.

    .. is not the right way to think. I don't care who you are, unless you are practiced at being in SD situations, making assumptions based on shot placement, or the ability to flee, is specious and dangerous. Yes, shot placement is very very important, and so is being aware of your surroundings and knowing the avenues of escape. But those things aren't a defense, in and of themselves, and there are no guarantees that either will be successful when it's go time.
    You make some very valid points. You say that shot placement and SA are not a defense in and of themselves. You are correct, but the combination as well as confidence in your own ability should make you feel more comfortable about the situation. There could be multiple attackers, I could be jumped, trip or pull a muscle. I could also discover I have been bitten by a radioactive spider and I now have super powers. If I left the house physically ready to deal with every possible threat every time I went out, I would probably be arrested as the Police generally frown on people wearing body armor carrying scary black rifles riding in uparmored vehicles. I am however mentally prepared to use what I have at hand to get home safely.

  13. #12
    Member Array Big Larry's Avatar
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    Carry two J-frames if you're really worried about it. IMO simply always carrying no matter the situation puts you ahead of 90% of everyone else. Also people that pray on others are looking for individuals that won't fight back, merely brandishing a gun in such a situation is a huge deterrent. Most would be assailants won't stick around if the odds suddenly turn. Granted there are exceptions to everything, but it's ultimately your responsibility to take care of yourself so carry whatever it takes to ease those concerns.
    Walk quietly and carry a big stick.

  14. #13
    Member Array Agamemnon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bkrazy View Post
    If I left the house physically ready to deal with every possible threat every time I went out, I would probably be arrested as the Police generally frown on people wearing body armor carrying scary black rifles riding in uparmored vehicles.
    lol - I know what you mean. :)

    Quote Originally Posted by Bkrazy View Post
    I am however mentally prepared to use what I have at hand to get home safely.
    That's the key. When I go out with my 36, I know that it's more likely that I'll have to go fist-to-cuffs than if I was carrying my .45 with two spare mags. But there are times when the 36 is all I'm willing to, or able to carry and when I do that, like you I mentally prepare for the differences and accept the compromises.

  15. #14
    Member Array MN2Go's Avatar
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    It was the day when OJ Simpson was found not guilty, I went to collect my daughter from the school with my dog. I had to cross an empty supermarket parking lot, and in the middle of it two cars full of gang bangers arrived and started to circle around me. They yelled obscenities and “how do you feel Ronnie boy” referring to Ron Goldman who was slaughtered with Nicole Simpson.

    They drove around me for a while and then the cars stopped, the trash exited the vehicles and started to approach me. There must have been at least eight of them.

    I let my dog loose and drew my .25 Beretta (yup, that was it for me at that time) and pointed it at the gentleman I thought would be the leader of the hyena pack. I calmly said,” Who wants to be the first?” and for some odd reason they stopped in their tracks. I kept the sights on the leader’s head and waited.

    The time stopped. I was so ready to pull the trigger and shoot them in order from closest on.

    Then the leader laughed and called me a “cul-ro,” which means an a-hole in Spanish and the gang returned to their vehicles and left.

    There I was shaking with the .25 in my hand trying to figure out what had just happened. I swore that I’d never go out without my 20-round .38 Super Chip McCormick 1911.

    I can’t imagine what could have transpired had I been unarmed or the fine gentlemen armed.

    On that day a .25 ACP saved me from a lot of trouble. I don’t spit on a .357 J-frame.

    I’ve had to draw a few times in my life without actually resorting to shooting, and every time the introduction of a firearm to the situation has solved the issue.

    I prefer to carry one of my 1911s or the Beretta 92, but the G26 is fine with me, if I don’t get ‘lazy’ and grab the 640 .357.

  16. #15
    Member Array hipthunder's Avatar
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    re

    i have no confidence issues with a .357 Jframe been carrying one for years
    "Gun control is like trying to reduce drunk driving by making it tougher for sober people to own cars."

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