A Challenge to Those on Our Side ...

A Challenge to Those on Our Side ...

This is a discussion on A Challenge to Those on Our Side ... within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I pose a challenge to all who post here. I am new here but in my short time, I see a certain number of people ...

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Thread: A Challenge to Those on Our Side ...

  1. #1
    Ex Member Array HoustonRaven's Avatar
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    A Challenge to Those on Our Side ...

    I pose a challenge to all who post here.

    I am new here but in my short time, I see a certain number of people here (small in numbers, granted) who would rather engage in political chest thumping than in promoting our rightious cause.

    What is more important to you ... promoting the notion of CC or pinning a label on the opposition?

    Is it more important to you that you label someone an "anti" or a "liberal" than it is to promote and educate on the benefits of CC?

    I ask this question in all seriousness as I see this as the most important issue holding back the debate.

    I lived in Maryland before moving to Texas and I saw this dynamic play out. But one example, there is a Facebook group that rightfully promotes state reciprocity, but then continually slams "liberals" with name calling and the like. In a state that's is 4-1 liberal, you will need those "liberals" to get anything done in terms of reciprocity. Again, the importance of name calling seems to trump our goal of furthering CC.

    So to does this dynamic play out on these boards from time to time. I am as conservative as the day is long, believing in limited federal govt, strong states rights, an adherence to the rule of law, strict construction to the Constitution via judicial restraint, lower taxes to foster a strong economy, etc. My friends on the left have a differing view point on a lot of those concepts and, and yes, the vast majority of our opposition rests on the left side of the aisle.

    While there are some on the left who will stop at nothing to see we fail, we must embrace those on the left who agree with this vital issue as our own. This issue is far more important an issue to actively alienate those on the left. Way to important to make carrying strictly the domain of those of us on the right. And far too important of an issue to name call those on the left, who will need if we ever want to further the cause of CC or even open carry.

    I guess it's pie in the sky thinking but I want a politically neutral 2nd Amendment, free of the left v. right debate.


  2. #2
    Member Array mtrogers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HoustonRaven View Post
    I pose a challenge to all who post here.

    I am new here but in my short time...

    As someone who is pro-gun but falls left of center on a lot of other issues, I agree with your statement. As with any political disagreement, you get more done by being respectful than with name calling. Both sides of the aisle are guilty of this....

    Edit to say the only people I outright disparage are Raven fans....ugggg.....GO STEELERS :)
    Last edited by mtrogers; July 6th, 2010 at 01:53 PM. Reason: ranven fans

  3. #3
    VIP Member Array Old School's Avatar
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    Well said. I am a Libertarian at heart and you and I agree on the important issues but most of all the constitution. I grew up in Maryland and moved to Florida in the late 70's. I was in law enforcement in Maryland so the repressive gun laws of that state did not affect me then. Bi-partisenship is nessessary to change the laws in those states that continue to ignore what the constitution says in the second amendment. I continue to work in law enforcement in Florida but if I didnot I would still be afforded the right to obtain a concealed weapons permit and excercise my right to self protection as you do in Texas. I agree that this right should be given to all lawabiding citizens of these United States of America. Continue the good fight sir and GO RAVENS !
    "Violence is seldom the answer, but when it is the answer it is the only answer".

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  4. #4
    Member Array Griffworks's Avatar
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    So say we all!

    I'm of a Liberal bent, tho consider myself more in the middle. It bugs the crap outta me to see those negative folks who spout "liberal" like it's akin to how some folks refer to non-whites in a despairing fashion. I could easily point my booger hooker at the Conservative mindset and do similar negative comments and jabs, but don't. It's counter productive.
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    And spoons made Rosie O'Donnel fat.

  5. #5
    Member Array PatAz's Avatar
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    Good posting by all.

  6. #6
    Distinguished Member Array ErnieNWillis's Avatar
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    Being pretty far to the right I can understand your frustrations. I get pretty bent when libs call Tea Party members "tea baggers" or "racists".

  7. #7
    Member Array rhenriksen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HoustonRaven View Post
    I guess it's pie in the sky thinking but I want a politically neutral 2nd Amendment, free of the left v. right debate.
    I'll give you an 'amen' for that.

  8. #8
    VIP Member Array Brass63's Avatar
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    I agree with you that calling names and attacking those with different political views is counter-productive and unfair to those on the left, or in the middle who are pro-2nd ammendment.
    At the same time though, being 'left' or being 'right', (or Libertarian) points to different ways of viewing our world. The far-right and the far-left both favor a big, powerful, and controlling government that supposedly knows better than the individual.
    History has shown...over and over again that the bigger and more intrusive the government, the less rights and freedoms the individual has. (e.g. Europe before and during WW2 and Europe today.)
    It is for that very reason, our framers wrote our Constitution...with its Bill of Rights and the limitations placed on the federal government.
    Hopefully, all of us as gun-rights advocates can agree on that.
    The United States Constitution 1791. All Rights Reserved.

  9. #9
    VIP Member Array Harryball's Avatar
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    Pro 2A = Friendly

    Anti 2A = Not Friendly


    Thats about it on the subject for me...
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  10. #10
    Ex Member Array HoustonRaven's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Old School View Post
    Continue the good fight sir and GO RAVENS !

  11. #11
    Senior Member Array DaveJay's Avatar
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    Compared to a lot of people on this board, I am a flaming liberal...

    On another board I visit regularly, I'm regularly called a nazi (and that's the nice names)...

    I figure I'm an old-school conservative in the William Buckley school of politics...Strong beliefs, yet realistic in knowing to accomplish things we need to work with both side of an issue...

    I'm not saying sell out on core beliefs...take 2A...

    Never would I agree with, say, the Mayor of Chicago or the Attorney General of Massachusetts...both of whom would rather nullify the Constitution in the name of "safety"...No, I fully support the right of a U.S. citizen to possess and carry a weapon...

    I can accept "reasonable" state regulation...just as states can reasonably regulate our right to vote (both rights granted by the same Constitution)...and since I believe that's a states right to issue those regulations, what is reasonable in one state might not be reasonable in another...I accept that...

    People who oppose our 2A rights fall into several categories...the worst being those who want to disarm everyone and are virulent in their words...those folks are just plain unreachable...

    Others can be reached with calm, rational and reasonable discussion...calling them names, lumping them in with the first group, does nothing but hurt our cause...

    Others are simply afraid of weapons...sheep, yes...but sheep that are leadable if handled properly...why would we want to drive them off simply because they are afraid...why not help teach them and lessen their fears...

    Just my
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  12. #12
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    I guess it's pie in the sky thinking but I want a politically neutral 2nd Amendment, free of the left v. right debate.
    Yep, its a pie in the sky thinking and although most of us would really like it to be that way, we realize that it is not.

    The Second Amendment has been and will always be a hotly contested subject for debate, and ones view point of life has everything to do with it.

    The simple people just see it as an avenue to control guns and think no more of it. There are other people that see it as a way to control people. There are people, many of them elected, that work day and night to reduce my and your ability to protect ourselves and our loved ones.

    Here's the thing. I don't care if YOU hate guns and don't believe that anyone should own them because that is your right to do so.

    Just don't be stupid enough to think that because you don't see it as a need, I don't either because I believe that it is the responsibility of a man to protect his family and himself, and no-one should have to depend on someone else to do so.

    Of course this is directed at no one in particular, its just a hypothetical.

    I see it like this. Try to deprive me of that right of self defense, and you are my enemy. I don't care much if you call yourself a Liberal,Conservative,Libertarian,Congressman, Senator, Mr. President or anything in between.

    Make it harder for me and mine and I will not be your friend.
    I would rather stand against the cannons of the wicked than against the prayers of the righteous.


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  13. #13
    VIP Member Array ctsketch's Avatar
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    I think as soon as you start labeling and name calling the other side, you only hurt your cause, we need all the votes we can get for gun rights
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  14. #14
    Senior Moderator
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    Not only that, but Liberals are our greatest untapped reserve of potential gunowners...all we have to do is change their minds...

    I would rather stand against the cannons of the wicked than against the prayers of the righteous.


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  15. #15
    Senior Member Array Sig35seven's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HoustonRaven View Post
    I guess it's pie in the sky thinking but I want a politically neutral 2nd Amendment, free of the left v. right debate.
    Agreed. It almost seems as though there is a definitive set of rules that each side must abide by and if you dare step out of those pre-set parameters then you are a traitor to your party.

    The left wing is NOT the enemy. Both parties are part of a balance that makes this country work. Not all the ideas coming from the left are bad. The same applies to the right. This political 'tug of war' is the only way to political neutrality.

    "United we stand,divided we fall."

    There is no unity in the word... NO.
    "Confidence is food for the wise man but liquor for the fool"

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