Anything you say can be used against you...

This is a discussion on Anything you say can be used against you... within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I've been wondering if any of you have reservations about what you post on this forum being used against you if you're ever involved in ...

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Thread: Anything you say can be used against you...

  1. #1
    Member Array gruntingfrog's Avatar
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    Question Anything you say can be used against you...

    I've been wondering if any of you have reservations about what you post on this forum being used against you if you're ever involved in a self defense shooting.

    I have seen many posts from individuals stating things along the lines of "I don't care what the law says, I'll kill the guy," or, "if somebody touches me on the arm, I'm drawing on him." These aren't direct quotes, but examples based on similar things I've read from some members.

    If there's even a doubt as to whether the shooting was justified, these statements could be used by the DA to demonstrate a predetermined homicidal mindset, "Rambo complex," and a proclivity toward violence. I've read of people having something as simple as their bumper stickers used against them in this way, and those aren't even their own words.

    I know if I were on the jury and heard some of these statements coming from the defendant's own mouth (or keyboard, more accurately), it may sway my opinion against the shooter in a questionable shooting event. This is especially so, because it is difficult to determine intent from the written word because of a lack of the standard cues such as vocal inflection, facial expression, etc.

    Imagine being on a jury and hearing the prosecution read a transcript of some of the things you've read -or even posted- here. They'll give it the most sinister reading they can.

    It reminds me of the scene in My Cousin Vinny where the sheriff is reading the transcript of his interview with Ralph Macchio.

    He just kept saying, "I shot the clerk." "I shot the clerk."

    Thoughts?

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  3. #2
    VIP Member Array Guantes's Avatar
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    I try very hard to not post anything that I would not like brought up in court.
    In addition to specific statements, a general trend of reasonable statements could be used to offset one rash statement.

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    Ex Member Array Deanimator's Avatar
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    Given that I mostly admonish people to obey the law and to demand that others do so in their dealings with them, I'm not really worried about it.

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    Its ashame we even have to think about stuff like this, but in this day and age with morons, buffoons and IMBICILES who frequent juries and wear black robes, it should be a concern.

    I think its the equivilent to saying that a married woman has sex with her husband,,then was raped by a stranger, somehow enjoyed being raped, therefore the guy who raped her should be set free because,"she enticed him, and probably enjoyed it". This is what some attorneys have used for a defense for their rapist clients.
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    “What is a moderate interpretation of [the Constitution]? Halfway between what it says and [...] what you want it to say?” —Justice Antonin Scalia
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    Member Array BAGMAN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Guantes View Post
    I try very hard to not post anything that I would not like brought up in court.
    In addition to specific statements, a general trend of reasonable statements could be used to offset one rash statement.
    +1 to that.
    "Leave the gun. Take the cannoli" Clemenza

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    VIP Member Array dukalmighty's Avatar
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    I always quote Texas law,As far as if I catch some kid burglarising my Jeep at 1 am,Tx law says I can use deadly force to stop the theft,My consciense says,I will call 911 while I hold him at gun point.
    "Outside of the killings, Washington has one of the lowest crime rates in the country,"
    --Mayor Marion Barry, Washington , DC .

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    If you see any of those sorts of "illegal activity" posts here...simply report them. They will go away like magic.
    If members read and obey our forum rules and behave themselves then they will not get themselves into trouble by posting stupid Internet Bravado crappola.

    Members should always think before they type. If you are an upstanding, outstanding member here on DC then whatever you type will help rather than hurt you in the future.

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    Quote Originally Posted by gruntingfrog View Post
    I have seen many posts from individuals stating things along the lines of "I don't care what the law says, I'll kill the guy," or, "if somebody touches me on the arm, I'm drawing on him." These aren't direct quotes, but examples based on similar things I've read from some members.
    Welcome to the forum, but I don't see what you're talking about. Forum rules don't allow discussion of illegal activity and the mods are good enforcers. Correct me if I'm wrong with a quote of one or two here, will you?

    Quote Originally Posted by gruntingfrog View Post
    Imagine being on a jury and hearing the prosecution read a transcript of some of the things you've read -or even posted- here. They'll give it the most sinister reading they can.
    I realize that this is a public forum and try to express myself with respect to the law and social awareness, etc.
    Americans understood the right of self-preservation as permitting a citizen to repel force by force
    when the intervention of society... may be too late to prevent an injury.
    -Blackstone’s Commentaries 145–146, n. 42 (1803) in District of Columbia v. Heller, 554 U.S. 570 (2008)

  10. #9
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    QKShooter is true to his name.

    See the black triangle with the exclamation point at the bottom left of every post?
    Americans understood the right of self-preservation as permitting a citizen to repel force by force
    when the intervention of society... may be too late to prevent an injury.
    -Blackstone’s Commentaries 145–146, n. 42 (1803) in District of Columbia v. Heller, 554 U.S. 570 (2008)

  11. #10
    Senior Member Array Bubbiesdad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gruntingfrog View Post
    I've been wondering if any of you have reservations about what you post on this forum being used against you if you're ever involved in a self defense shooting.

    I have seen many posts from individuals stating things along the lines of "I don't care what the law says, I'll kill the guy," or, "if somebody touches me on the arm, I'm drawing on him." These aren't direct quotes, but examples based on similar things I've read from some members.

    If there's even a doubt as to whether the shooting was justified, these statements could be used by the DA to demonstrate a predetermined homicidal mindset, "Rambo complex," and a proclivity toward violence. I've read of people having something as simple as their bumper stickers used against them in this way, and those aren't even their own words.

    I know if I were on the jury and heard some of these statements coming from the defendant's own mouth (or keyboard, more accurately), it may sway my opinion against the shooter in a questionable shooting event. This is especially so, because it is difficult to determine intent from the written word because of a lack of the standard cues such as vocal inflection, facial expression, etc.

    Imagine being on a jury and hearing the prosecution read a transcript of some of the things you've read -or even posted- here. They'll give it the most sinister reading they can.

    It reminds me of the scene in My Cousin Vinny where the sheriff is reading the transcript of his interview with Ralph Macchio.

    He just kept saying, "I shot the clerk." "I shot the clerk."

    Thoughts?
    Where have you seen these posts you speak of? Links?
    Always remember that others may hate you but those who hate you don't win unless you hate them. And then you destroy yourself.
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    Owning a handgun doesn't make you armed any more than owning a guitar makes you a musician.”
    Jeff Cooper

  12. #11
    Distinguished Member Array Guardian's Avatar
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    I concur with everything said on here. As long as it's legal and within the realm of the the rules, let freedoms speech prevail. If you come on here just to show your other side because it's an internet site and say the law doesn't matter (when it does), you need to re-evaluate your gun ownership and why you carry.
    "I dislike death, however, there are some things I dislike more than death. Therefore, there are times when I will not avoid danger" Mencius"

  13. #12
    Senior Member Array DMan's Avatar
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    I will agree that one must be careful what they type ANYWHERE on the internet. Facebook, myspace, twitter, DC.com or any other way. I wouldn't even trust emails or private messages.

    Truth be told, anything can be taken out of context. A police officer on the stand will only be required to repeat WHAT you said, and seldom will they be asked to report HOW you said it. If you were involved in a self defense shooting and your saying in anguish, and despair asking "I killed the guy?" when being questioned the cop will write that down. However on the stand he will say word for word what you said. Please be aware that we don't speak punctuation marks, so he will read from his note book that you said "I killed the guy" without the intonation or manner that would indicate it was a question. This leaves open the possibility for the prosecutor to make it sound like you said "I killed the guy!!"

    I have read of several cases where comments on myspace, or some other social networking site was brought in as "evidence" (sorry - didn't hold my interest enough to remember the source, or subject of the case).

    Remember, no matter what stay within the law - but even then make sure what you type shows intent to fulfill YOUR safety, and the safety of everyone. It is not our goal to "kill the BG's" but to stay safe and defend ourselves. If we can defend ourselves by not using force, than that should be our first course (and 2nd, and 3rd) of action until we have no other options.

    That is just my opinion but IANAL
    "Gun Free Zones" is where only criminals carry guns.

  14. #13
    Member Array gruntingfrog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bubbiesdad
    Where have you seen these posts you speak of? Links?
    Quote Originally Posted by Pistology
    Forum rules don't allow discussion of illegal activity and the mods are good enforcers.
    Quote Originally Posted by QKShooter
    If you see any of those sorts of "illegal activity" posts here...simply report them. They will go away like magic.
    Of course, I've never seen anyone endorse breaking the law on here. To the contrary, I think most people on this forum are very careful about telling people to obey the law. What I meant was that certain things could be read out of context as you saying these things. I should have made that more clear in my original post. I intentionally exaggerated the examples in my original post to give an idea of how some of the things we say could be misconstrued.

    To many people that may be sitting on a jury saying things like "I'd rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6" is equivalent to saying, "I'll just kill somebody and worry about it later." We understand that it's shorthand for a much more complex thought process, but they'll possibly see it as a predetermined mindset; when in doubt shoot somebody.

    Likewise, we all understand the context when somebody says something like, "if the guy keeps approaching, I'll pull my gun," or "if somebody touches me, they're going down," but to some people -possibly jurors in YOUR trial- this could be read to mean that if anybody walks up to you or touches your arm to get your attention in a public place, you're going to shoot them without "real" provocation.

    Am I just over-thinking this?

  15. #14
    Senior Member Array DMan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gruntingfrog View Post
    ...To many people that may be sitting on a jury saying things like "I'd rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6" is equivalent to saying, "I'll just kill somebody and worry about it later." We understand that it's shorthand for a much more complex thought process, but they'll possibly see it as a predetermined mindset; when in doubt shoot somebody.
    I understand that concern - and I have wondered the same thing. Fortunately if a "signature line" or statement like that is raised, you/your defense team has the right/responsibility to respond. Most of the sayings I have seen on here can be easily explained in court - and when you GOOD lawyer starts connecting the evidence, they will see that you were just had the mindset of NOT being a victim - not a cold blooded killer. That is, IF all your other communications show that same philosophy. If other forums, or communications/actions show otherwise, you may be in trouble - but then again IANAL.
    Last edited by DMan; July 18th, 2010 at 09:23 PM.
    "Gun Free Zones" is where only criminals carry guns.

  16. #15
    VIP Member Array Guantes's Avatar
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    While I think it is a good idea to watch what you say or print, don't get too crazy about.

    Re the inflection and statements that can be taken multiple ways, that's what cross exam is for. If your atty is not doing it, you had better be taking notes and yelling in his ear about it or at least getting a reason why not.

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