You Thoughts: Carrying a 1911 Half-Cocked...

You Thoughts: Carrying a 1911 Half-Cocked...

This is a discussion on You Thoughts: Carrying a 1911 Half-Cocked... within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I read an editorial the other day from a guy who likes to shoot SA revolvers and he said he carries a 1911 with the ...

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Thread: You Thoughts: Carrying a 1911 Half-Cocked...

  1. #1
    Senior Member Array cmb's Avatar
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    You Thoughts: Carrying a 1911 Half-Cocked...

    I read an editorial the other day from a guy who likes to shoot SA revolvers and he said he carries a 1911 with the hammer in the half cock position and the safety off... because he says sweeping the safety is not natural but drawing and cocking the hammer is for him...

    Seems dangerous to me... pulling the hammer back half way on a live round, or lowering it half way on a live round, or not getting it cocked completely on the draw and it going bang. I guess it could wear on the sear too?.?.

    I guess in all the 1911 debates I have never heard of this before...

    BTW I do not do this... I repeat, I do not do this, I repeat, I do not do this!
    Last edited by cmb; September 8th, 2010 at 04:30 PM. Reason: addition


  2. #2
    VIP Member Array zacii's Avatar
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    I do not, and would absolutely not, do that. Pressing the safety off is very intuitive, to me. I can get the safety with a proper grip, but one would have to contort their grip, somewhat, to thumb the hammer back.

    Presentation with SA revolvers, a la cowboy action, is a whole different animal than with conventional self-defense pistols. OMO
    Trust in God and keep your powder dry

    "A heavily armed citizenry is not about overthrowing the government; it is about preventing the government from overthrowing liberty. A people stripped of their right of self defense is defenseless against their own government." -source

  3. #3
    Member Array Back 40's Avatar
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    I agree with you, It sounds like a bad idea all the way around. I really believe that it takes more fine motor skills to pull the hammer back than it does to sweep down the safety. Its just one small step better than carrying with an empty chamber.

  4. #4
    VIP Member Array oakchas's Avatar
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    I wouldn't...

    The 1911 is designed to be carried condition 1.

    "Don't go off half-cocked"

    If he's absolutely conditioned to single action revolvers... why half cocked...

    Nope, not me.
    CharlieFoxtrot likes this.
    Rats!
    It could be worse!
    I suppose

  5. #5
    Senior Member Array JohnLeVick's Avatar
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    This came up on the Detonics Collectors Forum a few months ago, and one member there got all bent out of shape when I told him I did not allow Condition 2 carry on my range, and that for those with proper training on a 1911, there was never a reason to lower the hammer on a loaded chamber. Got downright huffy, he did.

    Those of you familiar with Detonics pistols would know that they were made with the rear sight set pretty far forward, and a flat cut on the rear of the slide to facilitate thumb-cocking. The history has become a little muddled, but purportedly, according to some, the design was dictated by some agency that wanted 1911-type pistols, but would not permit Condition 1 carry. Here's one of my Combat Masters, this one a .38 Super: It's unloaded, by the way, not in Condition 2.

    More than a few 1911-types get carried in Condition 2, whether we like it or not. With the arthritis I have in my thumbs, it would not be an option, even if I wanted to do it. I am envious of those who can speedily get a C-2 1911 into action quickly, but that doesn't make it a good idea. The hammer is just too small, with too short an arc, for reliable manipulation during massive adrenalin dump. Dropping the safety is a natural motion while gripping the gun in a firing position; cocking is not. On Series 80 Colts, the half cock "notch" is a step, not a notch, and pulling the trigger drops it off half cock. Sure, it has a firing pin safety, but it is deactivated when the trigger is pulled, too. I'll stick with Condition 1.

  6. #6
    VIP Member Array Janq's Avatar
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    cmb,

    Who ever that dude was is just a guy that cannot or will not cross train his brain away from that of the revolver.
    An operator software issue as attempted to be resolved by manner of improper hardware manipulation.
    Dude is overdue for a software patch if not full update.

    He assumes that he will have the _ability_ and option to use his second hand to stroke the hammer.
    That assumption is quite safe toward a SA revolver use at a range or even in a SASS event. Good luck with same on the streets in the real world where modern BGs prefer to pounce at nose to nose distances and even go hands on directly as they attempt to take you down hyena style.
    Ho ware you supposed to stroke a hammer when your off hand is being tugged at or is in the process of protecting your face from blows or is being used to shove back an attacker(s)?

    Thinking as he does makes no sense. It just doesn't, as in the year 2010.
    If this were 1810 or even 1910 he'd have an position. But it is 2010, so...

    Then there are the folk who'll respond with yeah but my dad/granddad/great granddad did same.
    To that I say yeah; And back then they also fought off infection by dousing wounds with drinking alcohol/liquor and telling folk to bite on a stick as they amputated limbs. Wanna try that too? Didn't think so.

    Progress.

    Anybody can write an editorial and get it published, even fools and the foolhardy.

    - Janq

    P.S. - File this non-sense along with those people who think that carrying 'Israeli Style' (Condition 3) is the way to go and they they will _always_ be able to draw, charge and engage a threat in just the nick of time while having both hands functional and available. FUBAR.

    P.P.S. - Never mind that carry of a 1911 with the hammer back and the frame safety set to off/deactivated is completely safe, as with a gun that is otherwise properly functioning.
    The gun won't fire without the grip safety being depressed AND the trigger too being depressed.
    So if dude really doesn't like the frame safety...Okay carry it as with it off. Duh!
    Having an understanding of how the device actually works would make this obvious, and the half cock reasoning statement all the much less sensical.
    "Killers who are not deterred by laws against murder are not going to be deterred by laws against guns. " - Robert A. Levy

    "A license to carry a concealed weapon does not make you a free-lance policeman." - Florida Div. of Licensing

  7. #7
    GM
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    I carry mine cocked and locked.


    Quote Originally Posted by oakchas View Post
    I wouldn't...

    The 1911 is designed to be carried condition 1.

    "Don't go off half-cocked"

    If he's absolutely conditioned to single action revolvers... why half cocked...

    Nope, not me.
    I am sorry, but that is not correct; the 1911 was not designed to be carried "cocked and locked" (condition 1). It could not be carried "cocked and locked" because John Browning’s design did not have a thumb safety.
    "The Second Amendment: America's Original Homeland Security"

  8. #8
    Distinguished Member Array Der Alte's Avatar
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    If someone cannot or will not carry a 1911 cocked and locked then they should consider carrying a different gun - maybe a revolver:)
    Its a shame that youth is wasted on the young.

  9. #9
    Member Array Nubby's Avatar
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    I know a few who carry their 1911 in Condition 2 or half-cocked; not me. I feel perfectly safe with my 1911 cocked and locked. I'd have to say that my Glock is what allowed me to feel respectfully comfortable with a loaded weapon that is easily and quickly put to use. Some folks don't feel comfortable with their guns loaded with one in the pipe, and I respect that.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nubby View Post
    I know a few who carry their 1911 in Condition 2 or half-cocked; not me. I feel perfectly safe with my 1911 cocked and locked. I'd have to say that my Glock is what allowed me to feel respectfully comfortable with a loaded weapon that is easily and quickly put to use. Some folks don't feel comfortable with their guns loaded with one in the pipe, and I respect that.
    Condition 2 means a round in the chamber and the hammer uncocked.

    Check following link:
    http://www.defensivecarry.com/vbulle...des&highlight=
    "The Second Amendment: America's Original Homeland Security"

  11. #11
    Member Array MountainPacker's Avatar
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    Carrying on half cock is universally looked on as a bad idea. It's bad because getting the pistol in that condition is dangerous and it leaves the pistol in a condition where it can't be used.

  12. #12
    Member Array BentLink's Avatar
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    Half-cocked carry scares me silly. I can't think of a way to get there that doesn't risk a Negligent Discharge. I'm a condition 1 guy.
    Fitch likes this.
    Still Clingin'

  13. #13
    VIP Member Array dukalmighty's Avatar
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    The half cock on a 1911 is a safety that for if some reason the sear lets the hammer drop without pulling the trigger the sear will stop the hammer before it strikes the firing pin,I carry condition one and the only time I unload my 1911 is when I'm cleaning it
    "Outside of the killings, Washington has one of the lowest crime rates in the country,"
    --Mayor Marion Barry, Washington , DC .

  14. #14
    Member Array gruntingfrog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GM View Post
    Condition 2 means a round in the chamber and the hammer uncocked.

    Check following link:
    http://www.defensivecarry.com/vbulle...des&highlight=
    I think Nubby meant that he knows a few people that either carry in Condition 2, or they carry half-cocked. I don't think he meant to define Condition 2 as half-cocked.
    Everybody has a plan until they get punched in the face.
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  15. #15
    VIP Member Array xXxplosive's Avatar
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    Now, it's been said, back in the day, Charlie Miller carried his with a round in and a piece of rawhide tide around the grip safety to keep it deactivated.....I guess it's up to the operator but I'm sure being a cocky TR, he couldn't care less...............that doesn't go for everyone though.
    Cocked and Locked for me as well...............

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