What is it with all the LEO threads?

This is a discussion on What is it with all the LEO threads? within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by farronwolf You assume I won't notice you are following me and pull into a parking lot or something for an unscheduled shopping ...

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Thread: What is it with all the LEO threads?

  1. #31
    Ex Member Array azchevy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by farronwolf View Post
    You assume I won't notice you are following me and pull into a parking lot or something for an unscheduled shopping trip. If it is common for you to do this, I would suggest there are too many officers in your department and they could save money by reducing the force.

    Or, am I to take it that you enjoy reading all the LEO threads?
    I am just making a point that I am sure you are not perfect and break the law while driving in some form or another. Even 1mph over the posted limit is breaking the law. I am pretty sure you have broken the speed limit while driving at some points in your travels. So your assertion that we should be held to a higher standard is hypocritical and ridiculous. But go you. perfect citizen you.

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  3. #32
    Member Array brobar's Avatar
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    Hopefully threads about LEO encounters continue to come because for every 1 bad encounter I usually read about there are 10 good encounters that have also been shared. Should people stop sharing the good encounters also? I think you need those for balance.

    Anyways... if threads like that bother a person it would seem to make more sense to me to just ignore the thread (hit the back button like others have suggested) and move on to a more enjoyable topic instead of creating a new thread to talk about those threads you don't enjoy reading (but for some reason still read... otherwise how do you explain knowing what is going on in those threads?) It sounds to me like you don't dislike those threads as much as you say you do since you continue to frequent them.

    As far as holding ourselves to a higher standard... well all I can say is *I* am no better than anyone else just because I carry a firearm. Just like my mother is no better than anyone else just because she is a christian. You think Christians don't sin? I try to uphold the law the best I can... however I will undoubtedly screw that up at some point and have a LEO encounter of my own. Hopefully through the experiences I have read here and the advice given in those threads my encounter will go as smoothly as most that I have read here.

  4. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by mcp1810 View Post
    When I was a union rep in my old department I spent a fair bit of time at internal affairs. I was not always there as a rep. In fifteen years the only complaint sustained against me was for insubordination. The only reason that was sustained was there were twenty witnesses and when I was questioned about it I stated I did it and in similar circumstances I would do it again.
    Not a single citizen complaint against me ever sustained.

    What most people don't realize is how hard it is to get an officer fired.
    First, you have to show why they should believe you, a total stranger, over someone that the department has selected through an extensive and expensive and validated selection process. Why is it that this person that got through this selection process just wants to make your life miserable? What would be their motive for lying about you? How does that compare with your possible motives to lie about them?

    Second, you have to prove that the officer actually violated your rights, or broke some other law, or at least some department regulation.

    Third, you have to convince them that this person they know so well and have tested so thoroughly is going to be such an ongoing liability to the them that they are better off throwing away the hundred thousand dollars they have invested in them than to risk continuing their employment.

    "Courtesy violations" if they resulted in anything it was never more than a counseling statement. And sometimes those counseling statements were that the officer was not assertive/aggressive enough. Either way those sat in the officers supervisor's file until one year from the incident and then hit the shredder.

    So most of these things, I just smile and nod.....
    Believe me - many of us know just how difficult it is to get an officer fired. That's why many of us don't trust the system.
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  5. #34
    Member Array mcgyver210's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by farronwolf View Post

    First of all, if everyone did what they were supposed to and didn't speed, or run stop signs, or had the proper registration, or you name it, you wouldn't find yourself in contact with the LEO.
    This statement doesn't hold water since I know for a fact I was once pulled over because the officer said he thought I was going to do something illegal since I was out late which long story short turned into a formal reprimand being added to his folder.

    Quote Originally Posted by farronwolf View Post
    Second, the statements have been made that LEO's should act more professionally since they are law enforcement and they should be held to a higher standard of behavior. HELLO FOLKS, AREN'T WE CHL HOLDERS SUPPOSED TO HOLD OURSELVES TO HIGHER STANDARDS THAN THE AVERAGE JOE. If you want to hold their feet to the fire, then everyone go in the bathroom, look in the mirror and tell yourself to act more responsibly because you have taken on the responsibilty of carrying a weapon every day. Stop doing stupid, dangerous or other things that are against the law that make you come into contact with the LEO's.
    There are so many differences that can be listed, the average Joe has no authority given to them that could let them get away with abuse under the color of authority. Also if you carry & shoot someone you most likely will be arrested & a LEO will most likely get paid leave. Also in some cases other LEOs will not do anything to another LEO for speeding or law breaking etc.

    I remember the wife of a LEO that lived on our street years ago used to speed everyday & was never once stopped even by a speed trap down the street.

    As for holding our selves to a high standard I definitely hold my self to a higher standard because I know I will have NO protection if I am forced to shoot someone. I have been carrying since TN made HCPs available. I rarely carry Open just because I prefer Concealed for many reasons. I also have been in some close altercations & didn't shoot anyone because there was no need to. This was my biggest fear when I first started carrying, That I might over react in a tense situation but in the real life scenario I didn't. Also I know I'm not a LEO & will not try to act like I am one.

    I am also one of those that truly believes all Government Law enforcement should be held to a higher standard when they cross the thin blue line. I have my reasons for this belief.

    As for RESPECT & Professionalism anyone dealing with the general public should at least attempt this.


    Quote Originally Posted by farronwolf View Post
    Thirdly, this is Defensive Carry. There is nothing that coming into contact with a LEO has anything to do with defensive carry. Coming into contact with a LEO is a carry issue, but only to the extent that we all act with caution and follow our state laws in regards to notifying the LEO about our carry, or that we keep our hands in view etc.
    I disagree it is a defensive carry issue when a LEO tries to use his or her perceived authority to scare or bully you out of carrying which is a right given by our fore fathers.

    I doubt there would be many threads about LEOs crossing the lines if they didn't & no matter what a forum boards main subject is there will always be someone start off topic discussions.


    Quote Originally Posted by farronwolf View Post
    Fourth, these LEO encounter threads are becoming about as interesting as what do you do with your gun when you go to the crapper. It gets old after about 10 go arounds.

    Ok, off of the soap box. Let the flaming begin.
    I disagree because I use each LEO thread good or bad to know what I might expect from a stop with my HCP being involved. Mainly for my out of state carry situations since here in TN I have never had a bad encounter with a LEO over my HCP. As a matter of fact all encounter have been very Professional so far.

    I also know not all LEO threads are all true & base all my responses if it was true.

    One last thought I don't judge all LEOs based on board topics especially since I have a few for friends & clients.

  6. #35
    VIP Member Array BugDude's Avatar
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    I know there are a number of LEOs on this forum, but I never thought about what they think about the LEO encounter threads. Do either the good posts or negative posts give them any insight into dealing with people whether they are carrying or not? I'd actually be interested in their perspective. In one manner of speaking, if it helps them with the perspective of the other side (good or bad post) and it has a positive impact on how they approach things, then I'd say the LEO encounter threads may provide a very beneficial purpose. Just wondering, but I apologize if this is just another stupid LEO encounter post.
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  7. #36
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    Thumbs down

    As I have posted on this forum in the past my biggest problem with the LEO posts is it is only from the posters perspective that we get the story of the events as they unfolded. I understand that this is how it has to be in this format, I just cannot put a lot of stock in the events as they are supposed to have happened. In other threads there is a common theme that if it's not in the newspaper and link posted it didn't happen. I personally do not like one sided reports of events that cast doubt on someones character. Same goes for a one sided story of a positive interaction as to it's validity. This is the internet where the only person who knows who is on the other end of the screen name is the person on that keyboard. Just my $.02.
    Last edited by Old School; September 11th, 2010 at 05:29 PM.
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  8. #37
    Member Array babyhulk's Avatar
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    I think there are more LEO threads lately because everybody is burned out on reading zombie & mall ninja threads.
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  9. #38
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    Farronwolf, you seem to want to hear about good LEO interactions. I have had 2 LEO interactions in the last couple of months. One official and one more casual.

    The official encounter occurred when I witnessed an accident in the highway. A girl rearended a SUV and went into the median. There were injuries so I stopped to help. I also called in the wreck. When the cops showed up, I went over and did the required inform and then went into what happened with the wreck. We walked back over to the wreck and he just said thanks for the inform - that was it. It was a total non issue.

    The second encounter was at the range. Saturday afternoon and the line was long and slow. I struck up a conversation with the next guy and it became apparent that he was a LEO. We had a nice discussion and he mentioned how much he appreciates CCW citizens. He realizes we are on the same team.
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  10. #39
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    Is it possible to be a Mall ninja that is a zombie?

  11. #40
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    Hmmmmmm......
    You mean I don't Have to read every thread?????????
    Glad we cleared that up!
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  12. #41
    Senior Member Array jem102's Avatar
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    [QUOTE=gilraen;1757552]

    "You have a right to your opinion. But black and white thinking does no one any good. There is a lot of middle ground here."

    Yes, I can surely see where being awash in a sea of gray brings positive and steadfast resolution..."will someone please cut that anchor line so we get be set adrift?"

    "My doctor can't shove my nose into concrete and handcuff me. My boss can't put me in jail to be raped and beaten by inmates (or guards). A run-in with my dentist won't get me a $10k - $100k lawsuit."

    What??? OK, even if I am naive isn't this; lets say, just for the sake of argument, a touch over the top for the average LEO encounter that I think we are all speaking of here?!? I mean really.

    "There are reasons why many people have problems with authority figures. These threads help figure out the right path to walk. If you are already sure of that path, ignore the thread."


    WOW, apparently so...but I guess that's the catalyst that galvanized your response...

    With all due respect, am I less entitled to comment on this or any thread for some reason than you or others?
    Last edited by jem102; September 11th, 2010 at 05:56 AM.
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  13. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by farronwolf View Post

    Fourth, these LEO encounter threads are becoming about as interesting as what do you do with your gun when you go to the crapper. It gets old after about 10 go arounds.

    Ok, off of the soap box. Let the flaming begin.
    I like to hear what is on people's minds whatever it is. I did chuckle at your crapper comparison - I've done this once (post about it) and won't do it again. Or the old "one in the chamber?" dilemma, etc etc. BTW I think the old crapper thing is solved by a good holster. Not to hijack or anything.

    Hey at least I know what LEO means now and that there are no Glock revolvers. That's progress.

  14. #43
    VIP Member Array Eagleks's Avatar
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    My .02 cents... then just quit reading them and complaining about them. What makes this thread any better ?
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  15. #44
    Distinguished Member Array jumpwing's Avatar
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    ...what do you do with your gun when you go to the crapper.
    Wait, there's a procedure for this? Criminy, I miss ALL the good threads!
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  16. #45
    Senior Member Array jem102's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cammo girl View Post
    I like to hear what is on people's minds whatever it is. I did chuckle at your crapper comparison - I've done this once (post about it) and won't do it again. Or the old "one in the chamber?" dilemma, etc etc. BTW I think the old crapper thing is solved by a good holster. Not to hijack or anything.

    Hey at least I know what LEO means now and that there are no Glock revolvers. That's progress.
    Quote Originally Posted by jumpwing View Post
    Wait, there's a procedure for this? Criminy, I miss ALL the good threads!
    Well this puts it in perspective.
    Last edited by jem102; September 11th, 2010 at 01:04 PM.
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