Carry near school zones

Carry near school zones

This is a discussion on Carry near school zones within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Hello all! Im glad to be a part of this forum and this is my first post. I need some help here. I am purchasing ...

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Thread: Carry near school zones

  1. #1
    New Member Array willmkent's Avatar
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    Carry near school zones

    Hello all!

    Im glad to be a part of this forum and this is my first post. I need some help here. I am purchasing a condominium that backs right up to a schools football field. This worries me because a few friends of mine mentioned that I need to be aware of School Zone firearm laws. Im not really sure what they are and I have done some searching on the web and came up with nothing really. I was hoping someone could help me figure out what is and what is not allowed when your subdivision backs right up to a school.

    FYI I live in Michigan

    Thanks in advance

    -Will


  2. #2
    Member Array Ianator's Avatar
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    Welcome!

    http://www.handgunlaw.us/states/michigan.pdf

    "Schools or school property but may carry in the while in a vehicle on school property while dropping off
    or picking up if a parent or legal guardian. (Act 719 allows carry in parking lots. See below)"

    Thats all I see it says about Schools or School zones. I would recommend reading the whole page.

  3. #3
    New Member Array willmkent's Avatar
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    Ok, so the law cannot stop me from owning a handgun in my home and being able to leave the premises while carrying my firearm right? My friends mentioned that a firearm cannot be present within 1000 feet of a school zone, which my condo is completely within that range

  4. #4
    Senior Member Array rljohns's Avatar
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    That's a Federal Law and it has a clause for CCW and state law exemptions. Some schools even have shooting programs and of course ROTC. However, states vary. I would suggest being very covert and not becoming the test case in MI. I don't carry my firearms visibly and keep a low profile.

  5. #5
    Senior Member Array deafdave3's Avatar
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    In your home, it falls under the Second Amendment; even if you live within 1,000 feet of a school, you have the right to have a gun in your home. However, you may encounter legal issues once you take the firearm OUTSIDE of your house or bring it in. I'm not a lawyer. I would strongly encourage you to do more research, possibly even get the advice of a lawyer.

    In the State of Louisiana, the 1,000 feet zone is null and void as of August 15, 2010. However, obviously, guns still cannot be brought into schools.
    A CCW is like a parachute; if you need one, and don't have one, you'll probably never need one again.

  6. #6
    Senior Member Array Tala's Avatar
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    I'm pretty sure something like that would be a dealbreaker for me. Why buy the place? If you do end up in a home invasion shooting, what is the media gonna do with that "school zone" stuff????? The antis already have enough bad things to say about us.
    Not something I would want to be a part of.
    I have enough worries just living a few blocks from a school and city park since the sidewalks I should use to walk my dogs are right next to "gun free zone" signs.....wouldn't want to LIVE with that sign on my front lawn, ya know? Seems like a headache.
    I won't be wronged, I won't be insulted, I won't be laid a hand on. I don't do these things to other people and I expect the same from them. -- John Wayne as John B. Books in "The Shootist"

  7. #7
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    I had the same problem when I lived in CT; my property abutted a school campus. I found the applicable CT law but it seemed ambiguous, which prompted a phone call to the county State's Attorney for an interpretation. With a CT pistol permit I was covered, even to the extent of carrying on school grounds while walking my dog.

    Clearly, though, the laws vary from state to state.
    Smitty
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  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by deafdave3 View Post
    In your home, it falls under the Second Amendment; even if you live within 1,000 feet of a school, you have the right to have a gun in your home. However, you may encounter legal issues once you take the firearm OUTSIDE of your house or bring it in. I'm not a lawyer. I would strongly encourage you to do more research, possibly even get the advice of a lawyer.

    In the State of Louisiana, the 1,000 feet zone is null and void as of August 15, 2010. However, obviously, guns still cannot be brought into schools.
    I'm not a lawyer either, and I don't know anything about Michigan law. As mentioned, we can have a gun in our home or car within the 1,000 foot school zone. I believe I'm correct to say that it's okay to conceal carry outside my house on my own property within that zone.........going to a public area within the zone brings about the problems

    The August 15, 2010 Louisiana law that went into affect exempts permit holders from the 1000 foot school zone. No concealed carry on school campus, but okay from the edge of the campus outward.
    Turn the election's in 2014 to a "2A Revolution". It will serve as a 1994 refresher not to "infringe" on our Second Amendment. We know who they are now.........SEND 'EM HOME. Our success in this will be proportional to how hard we work to make it happen.

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    VIP Member Array tkruf's Avatar
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    shew... just imagine all the football games you're going to have to listen to the band and loud speaker, etc. Unless you really like high school football. Friday nights for you are going to be "not very peaceful"
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  10. #10
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    As I understand it and I'm sure I really don't, a license holder doesn't need to concern himself with the 1000 foot mark when carrying under authority of the license.

    I have no idea how the law relates to moving rifles, shotguns, around in your car or how it relates to for example, car carry without the benefit of a CHL.

    From various comments made here in different threads, I think no one knows.

    The 1000 foot thingy is Federal law and the local police and local DA are generally not going to call the Feds and attempt to enforce it unless something unusual has been done by you. But, that is speculation on my part.

    We have had posts here that even caution that when you travel out of state to a place where your permit is accepted, you then can't be within 1000 feet of a school because of the way the exemption in the Federal law is written.

    I wish someone would post an authoritative answer, but there may not be one. The law doesn't apparently need to be clear and unambiguous. It can let us guess our way into trouble.

  11. #11
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    I am not a lawyer, nor is this legal advice.

    Jon Gutmacher addresses this issue in his book, Florida Firearms.

    The Federal school zone prohibition is part of 18 USC 922(q):

    (2)(A) It shall be unlawful for any individual knowingly to possess
    a firearm that has moved in or that otherwise affects interstate or
    foreign commerce at a place that the individual knows, or has reasonable
    cause to believe, is a school zone.
    (B) Subparagraph (A) does not apply to the possession of a firearm--
    (i) on private property not part of school grounds;
    (ii) if the individual possessing the firearm is licensed to do
    so by the State in which the school zone is located or a political
    subdivision of the State, and the law of the State or political
    subdivision requires that, before an individual obtains such a
    license, the law enforcement authorities of the State or political
    subdivision verify that the individual is qualified under law to
    receive the license;
    (iii) that is--
    (I) not loaded; and
    (II) in a locked container, or a locked firearms rack that
    is on a motor vehicle;

    (iv) by an individual for use in a program approved by a school
    in the school zone;
    (v) by an individual in accordance with a contract entered into
    between a school in the school zone and the individual or an
    employer of the individual;
    (vi) by a law enforcement officer acting in his or her official
    capacity; or
    (vii) that is unloaded and is possessed by an individual while
    traversing school premises for the purpose of gaining access to
    public or private lands open to hunting, if the entry on school
    premises is authorized by school authorities.
    Mr. Gutmacher states that you are fine carrying a concealed firearm within 1000 feet of a school provided you have a CWFL (in Florida).

    It seems from reading the above, that your home is fine:

    (i) on private property not part of school grounds;
    It also seems that if you are carrying under the license granted by a CCW, you're fine:

    (ii) if the individual possessing the firearm is licensed to do
    so by the State in which the school zone is located or a political
    subdivision of the State, and the law of the State or political
    subdivision requires that, before an individual obtains such a
    license, the law enforcement authorities of the State or political
    subdivision verify that the individual is qualified under law to
    receive the license;
    Matt
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  12. #12
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    I can't even begin to believe that you could/will have any problems carrying in your own home...who's going to know outside of the dirtbag trying to break in?
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    Member Array BurgDog's Avatar
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    I thought the court ruling about Arizona LEOs not being permitted to detect, enforce or refer violations of federal immigration laws to federal authorities implies that ALL federal laws are off limits to local LEOs and must be ignored as if they don't exist at all. I guess a private citizen is allowed to notify the feds of a federal law violation, but local LEOs can't.

  14. #14
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    Knowing your local laws is always important. Knowing how to interpret them is another thing sometimes. Here, it's 300yds. But carrying on school property is forbidden. To me that translates into setting foot on the grounds of school property. My vehicle is insulated from school property when I am passing by even if I'm within 100ft or in front of the school on a public roadway. It's ridiculous to think I could not leave home some 4 miles away from a public school, and not pass by while carrying on my way to another location and the only venue between me and the other location passes me by the public school. Also.......private property is not in the school zone even if it's across the street. One's home is one's domain no matter in what proximity to a no carry zone. I wouldn't exactly display the fact even though I can openly carry on my own property in my state and not be subject to scrutiny. Local laws and local law enforcement will dictate what you need to do to stay on the right side of the law. Maybe you should contact your local police department and run this by them (anonymously) to find out what they have to say. I wouldn't care to guess as to imminent domain and other frivolous laws as to right of ways and federal/state/local laws regarding such practices. But your constitutional rights can't be put at risk in most places. May be a fine line in some places, but figure it out through your local channels. I'm no attorney even though I wish I were bringing in the yearly salary.

  15. #15
    Senior Member Array swinokur's Avatar
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    Main problem is where your vehicle is. If on a public street within 1000 feet the weapon needs to be unloaded and in a locked case. This would include driving and walking back and forth to the vehicle If you can drive directly onto private property, then you are ok.

    The best solution is to get a concealed carry permit from the state where the school is. As mentioned reciprocal states permits are not legal for purposes of compliance.

    States cannot overturn Federal law as someone else posted. Even if the state law allows it, Federal law does not.

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