? for police on site and others

This is a discussion on ? for police on site and others within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by Mos42 If he was a server and had gone for his sidearm a tad more would I have been in the right ...

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Thread: ? for police on site and others

  1. #16
    Member Array Olivia Chillia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mos42
    If he was a server and had gone for his sidearm a tad more would I have been in the right drawing and possible haveing to shoot him ?
    Disclaimer: I'm not a LEO or lawyer. Take the following with a grain of salt.

    Who or what he was doesn't matter in this scenario, I think. You can't know based on the information you had at the time.

    I think you did great. If he'd moved for his firearm I can see drawing and aiming, then reassessing. It puts you in a position to defend if necessary, but allows you the option not to shoot if he responds in a way that does not endanger your safety.

    Thoughts on that strategy?

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  3. #17
    Member Array kenyanscorpion's Avatar
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    Hard Choice

    Again, Not an LEO.

    I donít think that drawing your weapon, if the individual moves for his weapon, is a bad idea. You have no idea what his intentions are. If he was a LEO, he would have said so in the beginning, if he was there to do nothing more then serve papers, he did not have any need to enter your property. You had already indicated that that person he was looking for was not there, so he had no reason to enter.

    I donít know what I jury would say, but I am taking classes in Forensic Physiology, and I know that from what I have studied and learned so far, it is a very luck person who fires on another person, even in self defense, and does not go to jail for doing so, unless the individual is already firing back. From what I have studied, and others may have more knowledge with this, a jury will convict and individual because you could not prove what the individuals motive and intent was. A guess, in the case of taking a persons life, is not enough, even a hunch or a feeling will not cut it. If you have any question as to their intent it is your responsibility to exhaust all options, even ones you did not think of at the time.

    I donít think this is far. Who is a jury to take weeks ripping apart a decision a person makes, to defend his/her self, and has to make in a split second. But that does not mean that the person who shoots the other will not get convicted.

    The real question to me is, which is better to be a victim die, or be a survivor and go to jail?

    Hard choice.

  4. #18
    Senior Member Array PapaScout's Avatar
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    Kenyanscorpian - Choose life.

    +1 Wayne. If someone shoots a dog that is guarding me, it's a safe bet that they are attempting to harm me by eliminating my defenses.
    "If you so much as bunny hop I'll cut your heart out!" Billy Bob Thornton in The Last Real Cowboys

    "I carry a gun for the same reason that I carry health insurance and a cell phone - be prepared."

  5. #19
    Member Array kenyanscorpion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PapaScout
    Kenyanscorpian - Choose life.

    +1 Wayne. If someone shoots a dog that is guarding me, it's a safe bet that they are attempting to harm me by eliminating my defenses.
    No Choice there. I know what I would do, but many would rather be dead then in jail.

  6. #20
    Member Array Olivia Chillia's Avatar
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    Kenyanscorpion is taking Forensic Psychology. (Darn spellchecker!)

    ks, your post wasn't nearly what you made it sound like. I was waiting for Doom and Gloom.
    Last edited by Olivia Chillia; July 12th, 2006 at 08:02 PM. Reason: "Needed" to play with similies a bit.

  7. #21
    Member Array Boomer45's Avatar
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    I did some process serving for the law office that my wife worked for. Most times it was no sweat. Always be professional, dress appropriate for the job you are doing, and most of all, be courteous. I ran into a situation while trying to serve papers on a gentleman who had a large pit bull (seemed about as big as a rhino but i'm sure it was really much smaller). Normally the dog was chained in the yard as he was on my first attempt at service but no one was home. On my second attempt, the dog was not chained. I did not notice this until I had pulled into the drive and this "rhino" with teeth attemtped to eat my car. Needless to say I did not exit the vehicle and backed out and drove away. I made one more attempt at service but the pit bull was again unchained so again, no service was made. I was licensed and carrying during that time but would not have made any attempt to shoot this mans animal unless my life was in real danger.
    USAF Retired

  8. #22
    Member Array Mos42's Avatar
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    Let me say THANKS for the responses and things to ponder that folks have brought up. Real nice to be on a board where the responses are thought out and all are well mannerd.

  9. #23
    Member Array dehalter's Avatar
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    You did exactly what I would have done. Nobody comes to my house and reaches for a firearm, and not get warned!!!!

  10. #24
    Senior Member Array hsuCowboy98's Avatar
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    Kind of an awkward situation, but you handled it well in my opinion.
    Fear No Evil.

  11. #25
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    I think you did right....
    it would all depend on state laws of course,
    but I know if that happened to me here in Texas, if he's not LEO he's up the creek, a LEO would have identified himself immediately
    if this guy would have opened my gate or reached for his weapon he would have been staring at my muzzle
    LEO/CHL
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    If loose gun laws are good for criminals why do criminals support gun control?

  12. #26
    Member Array soundwave's Avatar
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    An LEO would have identified himself either right from the beginning or after you said "no" to his question. This is usually done so that you cannot claim that you were "detained" by his questions or that you under the assumption that you were compelled to answer his questions by a "show of authority". I wouldn't put it past an LEO to prepare himself if he thought a dog might come after him, but putting your hand on your holster is a little bit hasty if he hasn't even seen the actual dog yet. If he was an LEO, he would've identified himself at that moment at the very least.

    Also, as far as I am aware, I have never heard of an LEO conducting an investigation or attempting to serve someone in anything but full uniform, partial uniform (e.g. department polo shirt and slacks) or strictly business-like clothes (e.g. dress/polo shirt and slacks). Regardless, I cannot see an LEO not wearing at least a flat badge on their belt near their gun like a member already mentioned and for the same reason(s).

    Cheers.

  13. #27
    Distinguished Member Array AutoFan's Avatar
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    20 feet is commonly cited as the distance you are in danger from a knife attack, and this guy was reaching for gun at that distance after being told not to enter your property when he knows there are dogs present.

    I'm sure not involved in the legal system, but unless you live in an anti-gun state, I think you'd be ok in drawing a gun. He would have been commiting B&E and trespassing while brandishing a deadly weapon.

  14. #28
    Member Array dogrunner's Avatar
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    In point of fact. armed trespass in Florida is a felony, even if only to hunt!..................If the guy was NOT a LEO here you would have surely had cause to demand a complaint affidavit.

  15. #29
    Member Array LibertyGal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PapaScout
    If someone shoots a dog that is guarding me, it's a safe bet that they are attempting to harm me by eliminating my defenses.
    My sentiments exactly.

    LibertyGal
    Requiring a license makes it illegal to do something that was lawful before the license was required.

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