Texas Issue, changing CHL to OC only; Yike????? Are they kidding?

This is a discussion on Texas Issue, changing CHL to OC only; Yike????? Are they kidding? within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; If you want to look at the text of the bill. Follow the link posted above, and then simply click on the text tab, (second ...

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Thread: Texas Issue, changing CHL to OC only; Yike????? Are they kidding?

  1. #16
    VIP Member Array farronwolf's Avatar
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    If you want to look at the text of the bill. Follow the link posted above, and then simply click on the text tab, (second from the left) then open the file in your choice of document.

    Lavender is our Rep.he is newly elected to office. The bill will essentially make Texas a handgun carry state like Tennessee. You will have your option of carrying concealed or openly.

    The requirements will be exactly the same. Same background check, same 10 - 15 hour class, same proficiency, etc. It simply removes the requirement that the gun be concealed.

    Will it pass, I don't know.

    Will it mean I will open carry, nope.

    Will it mean that more 30.06 signs will be posted on businesses that wouldn't have given it a second thought when everyone concealed and they knew nothing about guns in their stores. Absolutely.

    As I have stated before, this expansion of rights, might in fact end up limiting your rights in the short and even long run.

    For those who say they won't do business with someplace where they post a 30.06 sign, fine, but if you think the business owner is going to jeapordize 97+% of their customer base to accomodate the less than 3% of CHL holders, I think you might be mistaken.

    Anyone read through the Cracker Barrel thread. The only reason that person was asked to leave is because they were open carrying.

    Do I support the legislation, yes, I will simply remain carrying concealed.
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  3. #17
    Distinguished Member Array INccwchris's Avatar
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    thats the same as Indiana, we just have a handgun license and no mention of concealed anywhere in state law, means open or concealed carry, sorry Hopyard but in this instance you are incorrect in your assumption
    "The value you put on the lost will be determined by the sacrifice you are willing to make to seek them until they are found."

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    Quote Originally Posted by INccwchris View Post
    thats the same as Indiana, we just have a handgun license and no mention of concealed anywhere in state law, means open or concealed carry, sorry Hopyard but in this instance you are incorrect in your assumption
    I truly hope I am incorrect. I'd be more comfortable if they just said it was OK to OC, and specifically allowed concealed carry.

    I apologize for sounding like a broken record (older folks know the allusion) but I saw enough of how big city DAs ignored the car carry law till it was made plain as day that I worry about similar misapplication of authority against concealed carry.

    Anyhow, I hope it works out well for all of us.

  5. #19
    Member Array TarletonRanger's Avatar
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    I think the plus for HB 2756 is that if while carrying concealed, your weapon becomes exposed for some unforseable reason, you will not be in violation of the law.

    Jake
    "They kept tryin' to put me in the ground, but I wasn't ready"

  6. #20
    Distinguished Member Array INccwchris's Avatar
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    I agree, it should be written specifically to allow both. Such as, Holders of a valid Texas CHL shall be permitted to carry a loaded weapon either in a concealed or openly visible fashion as pursuant to texas code. Unfortunatey law makers like to be as vague as possible so at a later date someone can be convicted based on an interpretation of the law made by the judge and jury in a courtroom
    "The value you put on the lost will be determined by the sacrifice you are willing to make to seek them until they are found."

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    Quote Originally Posted by INccwchris View Post
    I agree, it should be written specifically to allow both. Such as, Holders of a valid Texas CHL shall be permitted to carry a loaded weapon either in a concealed or openly visible fashion as pursuant to texas code. Unfortunatey law makers like to be as vague as possible so at a later date someone can be convicted based on an interpretation of the law made by the judge and jury in a courtroom
    Laws are written to prohibit, not to allow something. So, what is not specifically prohibited is allowed.

  8. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by solarwarp View Post
    Laws are written to prohibit, not to allow something. So, what is not specifically prohibited is allowed.
    Not really. I once lost a civil case that turned exactly on that issue. My legal fees ran 25 K and the judge simply ruled that even though a certain document did not prohibit what I did (and I was advised to do it by a lawyer, btw), the judge said it was "against public policy." Out you go Mr. Hopyard.

    And besides, whether or not you get arrested, held, bonded, for concealed illegal concealed carry will depend on the initial interpretation of the LEOS and DAs; not the final determination made by the courts. We are not safe without concealed carry being specifically authorized with the law.

  9. #23
    Member Array gunshrink's Avatar
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    My Minnesota permit simply says "Permit to carry a pistol" with either option available and no penalty for flashing (your gun that is).
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  10. #24
    VIP Member Array Eagleks's Avatar
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    This almost seems like an "anti" gun person.... to eliminate CC and make everyone open carry, and bringing the fact they are carrying into the light and visible.... thinking that might prevent people from carrying.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eagleks View Post
    This almost seems like an "anti" gun person.... to eliminate CC and make everyone open carry, and bringing the fact they are carrying into the light and visible.... thinking that might prevent people from carrying.
    Since someone in this or a related thread said they spoke with the bill's sponsor, it doesn't seem like it is intended to be anti. If it ends up having an unfortunate unexpected effect, it will be because of a failure to pay attention in 7th grade. Words have meaning. When you cut the word "concealed" from the entire statute, the meaning changes.

    I've no intention of doing any OC, but if the new law both allows concealed carry and OC, I certainly will change the way I carry to concealed with an OWB.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TarletonRanger View Post
    I think the plus for HB 2756 is that if while carrying concealed, your weapon becomes exposed for some unforseable reason, you will not be in violation of the law.

    Jake
    Thats the part I like, if the cover garment blows up in the wind no crime is being committed. I dont really think open carry is for me though.
    My other Kahr is a Kimber.

  13. #27
    VIP Member Array farronwolf's Avatar
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    The law doesn't make it illegal for accidental "wind" exposure. It reads intentionally.

    PC 46.035. UNLAWFUL CARRYING OF HANDGUN BY LICENSE HOLDER. (a) A license holder commits an offense if the license holder carries a handgun on or about the license holder's person under the authority of Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code, and intentionally fails to conceal the handgun.
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  14. #28
    TVJ
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    Well, that doesn't give the text, which was posted here a few weeks back. It does say it has not been amended.

    Watch out folks. This one is a trojan horse or the work of ineptitude.
    Hopyard,

    You have strong feelings on this.

    I suggest and support you to go further on this, call Lavenders office and hold their feet to the fire regarding your issues with interpretation of this new bill.

    Please report back, it helps us Texans.
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  15. #29
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    Texas is the most pro-gun state in the Union. They are not doing anything other than making OC the same as CC. I wouldn't worry. But again, you can always call your state legislators.

  16. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by smolck View Post
    Texas is the most pro-gun state in the Union. They are not doing anything other than making OC the same as CC. I wouldn't worry. But again, you can always call your state legislators.
    I have lived in Texas most of my life. I think the statement that it is the most pro gun state is myth. Mostly due to Hollywood - IMHO.

    I can think of at least 3 other states that would top the list of pro gun rather than Texas in my opinion.

    Arizona
    Alaska
    Vermont

    Add all the others that don't require a license to open carry and we are very much nearer to the bottom of any listing of "pro gun states" than the top.

    Even Kalifornia is more permissive than Texas and still will be even if HB 2756 passes.

    IMO - The licensing of open carry here falls way short, again. But I will take the baby steps as they come. Didn't seem that long ago that we couldn't carry concealed and it was only recently that we were allowed to have our handguns in the car without it being a problem. Even though I am not impressed much by this bill I think it brings us one baby step closer to the way it should be.

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