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Carrying Unchambered - Practices, techniques, tips and tricks.

14K views 104 replies 32 participants last post by  JD 
#1 · (Edited by Moderator)
OK, lets give this one a fair shake, while I personally do not endorse condition 3 carry, there are those that do. The topic of Condition 1 vs. Condition 3 has been beaten to death time and time again. For those that choose to carry condition 3, they should be able to discuss methods that will enable them to accomplish their desired tasks without the thread turned into a debate on C1 vs. C3, that's called Thread Hi-jacking and we do actually have an infraction for it. If you do not have anything to add related to the topic of this thread: "...your gun is now unchambered, what methods has your training brought you that seem to work the best for chambering a round quickly and successfully?" don't post as it will be removed.

Regards,
JD


Going to go about this a different way in hopes that some useful information can be generated without the chambered vs unchambered argument and antics.

Whether you carry chambered or unchambered doesn't matter - the question is your gun is now unchambered, what methods has your training brought you that seem to work the best for chambering a round quickly and successfully?

I personally practice carrying unchambered so this topic is important to me (and others who choose this method), so instead of bickering about this being a non-preferred method by most, lets discuss the techniques used to chamber a round.

Those who carry with one in the hole will benefit from this discussion in case their loaded round goes 'click' and not 'boom', those who carry without one in the hole will benefit from learning new techniques.

So far I've practiced the following:
Drawing and chambering a round in one fluent motion using my clear hand to grab the slide once 'clearing' my clothes.

Video here for a better representation, it's not me - but closely resembles what I do:
YouTube - ‪Condition 3 Quick-Draw Practice: Glock 26‬‏

I also practice one handed racking using the sole and belt methods, will be adding the 'behind the knee' method soon to see if it works for me.
 
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#2 ·
I have practiced using the rear sights on belt, shoes, holsters, holding the slide with my knees and racking it that way.. weak hand, strong hand.. if it is a full-length gun with an applicable recoil spring I have used tables, chairs and desks.

Though I've tried using the ejection port with some success it doesn't seem to be as consistent as using the rear sights (provided you have the right kind of notch sights that will really catch on what you are trying to use to rack your gun with).
 
#6 ·
I have not found it to be very consistent. It depends a lot on the clothes you are wearing and the time/ability to get in just the right position so your gun won't slip (while making sure you aren't pointing at your own body). It also makes for awkward position holding the firearm.
 
#4 ·
I actually tried some of this today, and I was only able to successfully chamber a round once, and it took WAY too long. I tried both against my leg, and using my belt. I was using my belt when I actually got a round chambered. When jamming the sight into my leg, I kept getting a chunk of my jeans caught in the slide. Doesn't seem too feasible for me, but if you can do it, more power to you.
 
#8 ·
I had no intention of making it a practical skill, I was just trying to figure out how the heck people manage to do it. lol. I spent a couple hours trying different methods and it just seemed to be horribly unreliable. Maybe it works better with different gear, but I don't see it being anything I'll practice regularly.
 
#9 ·
It is a good skill to have in your bag of tricks. What happens if you need to rack the slide and, for whatever reason, have only 1 hand available?
 
#10 ·
Going to go about this a different way in hopes that some useful information can be generated without the chambered vs unchambered argument and antics.

Whether you carry chambered or unchambered doesn't matter - the question is your gun is now unchambered, what methods has your training brought you that seem to work the best for chambering a round quickly and successfully?

I personally practice carrying unchambered so this topic is important to me (and others who choose this method), so instead of bickering about this being a non-preferred method by most, lets discuss the techniques used to chamber a round.

Those who carry with one in the hole will benefit from this discussion in case their loaded round goes 'click' and not 'boom', those who carry without one in the hole will benefit from learning new techniques.

So far I've practiced the following:
Drawing and chambering a round in one fluent motion using my clear hand to grab the slide once 'clearing' my clothes.

Video here for a better representation, it's not me - but closely resembles what I do:
YouTube - ‪Condition 3 Quick-Draw Practice: Glock 26‬‏

I also practice one handed racking using the sole and belt methods, will be adding the 'behind the knee' method soon to see if it works for me.
These one handed racking methods - particularly being practiced by someone with very little experience - sound like a great way to shoot yourself.

Might I suggest you seek out some training from a qualified professional instructor?

Matt
 
#11 ·
nearby furniture, belt, sole. i'd be glad to see a racking holster, which someone mentioned elsewhere. my rear sights are sloped, and for this maneuver i wish they were less so. anyone have sight recommendations? good point about safety. i don't practice with live ammo.
 
#15 ·
...my rear sights are sloped, and for this maneuver i wish they were less so. anyone have sight recommendations?
You can also try the corner of the ejection port, as well as adding some "skater" or traction-tape on the top of the slide.

I find that with the type of shoes I like to wear, the "heel to the sights" method is not always a sure-bet, that if it's wet/muddy, my sights can slip off all too easily: I do much better off (the right) clothing (i.e. I'm not going to use my rain slicker/wind-breaker :embarassed:).

good point about safety. i don't practice with live ammo.
At some point, you should practice with live ammo. You don't want to have brain-lock in a SHTF situation because, all of a sudden, your brain yells "hey, you're doing this for the first time with live ammo!!!" :smile:
 
#13 ·
Thread opened, keep it on topic. In terms of chambering a round, I'd probably opt for good old Tap, Rack, Bang. It will be imperative that the mag is fully seated in order for the gun to feed that first round.

As far as sights that have a ledge for slide manipulation, check out Heinie Ledge Sights, Trijicon HD sights, and select sights from Wilson and Novak.
 
#14 ·
Well, remember that in an actual deadly threat scenario you will one hand rack your slide using the rear sight on the concrete curb or a brick wall if need be. A very positive & sure slide rack. :yup:

Not something that you'll ever practice much though.
Buying lots of replacement rear sights can get awfully expensive.
 
#16 ·
This will probably be pulled as off topic, but I just rack the slide. Whatever the scenario. I'm in a grocery store and I hear shooting five aisles down. I draw the weapon and rack the slide. I'm at my desk and I hear yelling from another office and gunfire. I draw the weapon and rack the slide. I approach an ATM late at night and see that someone is in the shadows off to the side. I drive away and find another ATM inside a store that's open 24 hrs. I'm sitting at the computer talking to you guys. The gun is in front of me, but there isn't a round in the chamber. I can probably chamber a round by grabbing the top of the slide and slamming the butt against my knee if absolutely necessary, but I'm not going to practice it.
 
#21 · (Edited)
We're back at square one. The general consensus is that you might be taken by complete surprise and not be able to rack the slide in time to save your life. While trying to fight off your attacker, you are frantically trying to draw a weapon that has no round in the chamber. I suppose at that point, you yell "I have a gun!!" and club the obnoxious evildoer to death with it. Statistically it doesn't happen very often, but it can and does happen. Most of the time when there is trouble brewing, you are aware of it and have time to chamber a round. That's been my contention all along. Still, as long as you carry safely, your choice is yours.
 
#27 ·
You can put the front sight and front slide edge against upturned heel and push. You have to guard against the short stroke, or the slide won't pick up the round from the mag. I have seen a video of a holdup where the victim's frenzied two hand short stroke cost him his life. In the panic, he forgot his chamber was empty. Loading and unloading under ideal conditions have caused many a police locker room mishap. Be very careful when handling dynamite and spring tension.
 
#30 ·
I've never trained to draw and load my weapon because I carry loaded. We do, however, train regularly on manipulating our side arms with one hand - primarily reloads, but also clearing jams - in case we are limited to one hand due to injury. We use all of the methods of racking the slide that have already been discussed (behind the knee, off the boot heel, off the holster or belt, a table edge, etc) but they are all excrutiatingly slow and awkward, even when the slide is locked back. Heck, manipulating the mag release and getting a fresh mag off your belt and loaded can be very hard to do one handed (especially your weak hand). We work these drills on the range with live ammo and as difficult as they are to accomplish under controlled conditions I honestly cannot imagine trying to get my unloaded gun drawn and charged while fighting or under the pressure of an imminent attack. Add an inury that takes one hand out of the game and it would be nearly impossible. My training experience making empty guns work under pressure solidifies my position on carrying loaded guns vs unloaded.
 
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#31 ·
OK. Let's assume all hell breaks loose for whatever reason. It's Virginia Tech, Columbine, and Ft Hood all rolled into one. You had no earthly idea it was coming. You've got a semi-automatic pistol with no round in the chamber. Hit the pavement!! That will probably be instinctive, but if you feel the need to practice, do so. Stay away from walls. Ricocheting bullets follow walls. Just trust me on that. While you are on the ground, assuming that you have been wounded in one arm, grab your pistol with your free hand, brace the butt against the ground and rack the slide back with all your strength. With God on your side, carry on.
 
#32 ·
I figure i will need 2 hands to rack most of my guns. Don't like that fact but it is what it is. I carry unchambered for one simple reason - children - most can't rack a slide and i have children around me and my house all the time. Not to worried about my kids - they have been trained on properly handling and most importantly not handling my guns but i worry like crazy that some kid over to play has not - and hey - i played with my dad's guns sometimes when i shouldn't have. This thread has got me thinking more about it though and as much as i enjoy shooting and practice fairly often - i don't practice drawing and racking much. - need to do that. The biggest problem i have had trying to rack with an alternative method is the gun not going into battery - seems like most of my smaller, carry guns need the slide pulled back and let go - any drag and they don't go into full battery - now my cz and 96 don't seem to much care - i think the smaller auto's have a whole set of issues that make racking under heat a challenge.
 
#38 ·
My PM9 has about 600 rounds through it now, not issues at all except the known 'feature' of having to rack the slide with the slide release. Not sure if Kahr put that in the manual to avoid it being a defect or what, but it sucks and it's not a very good design in my opinion.

Seems to chamber FMJ just fine, but hollow points is a whole other story... I have to tap the bottom of the magazine or nudge the slide to get it to chamber the round. Currently using Remington Ultimate Home Defense in it.
 
#39 ·
taking your chosen method of carry to one logical conclusion--

1st we need the proper tool such that the job has the best chance for success;
after all, one doe not take a Chevy Malibu to the Indy 500 and expect to win.

so--it needs to have a long slide so the spring will offer the least resistance and avoid stacking;
--we need a tall and squared off rear sight such that it has a large surface area to catch on whatever we use to rack it in a one-handed mode;
--the ejection port on the slide should have minimal openness on the top so as to minimize it catching on fabric when being one-handed;
--the grip should be large enough to allow for a strong and secure one-handed grip;

a 1911 ( perhaps even Officer's size) is a tool that has it all. (I'm sure there are others but a Kahr is not in this race)
flared and lowered ejection port; bomar or equivilant rear sght
locked BUT not loaded reduces the energy needed to rack the slide--a further plus.
a light weight alloy frame brings the weight down to 29 ounces.
perhaps not as small as everything else in the gun store, but it will run to win with the conditions you have required.
 
#41 ·
RockBottom, ua posted a pic of a beautiful handgun. my favorite carry after i changed out from a colt defender is my Sig p239/40, 1st gen
bet it is a joy to handle and shoot.

but for the -0-chamber carry, i did not include the decocker Sig's cause of the extra time to cock the hammer ( as a cocked hammer lets the slide move easier helping to ensure
that one does not short stroke the slide when one handing it). also the ejection port is square to the top of the slide allowing for the possibility of fabric to get tangled.
 
#45 ·
Thanks. I've put several hundred rounds through it with nary a hiccup. It handles Speer Gold Dots really well and shoots straight. Racking one handed is doable, but it's a chore. After what I've read here, if a bad guy ever sees it, he should assume that there's one in the chamber.
 
#42 ·
I typically carry unchambered. For practicing a one-handed rack, I grab the slide and then jam the grip against my leg and rack the slide. It works OK. But two-handed rack is definitely my preferred method of chambering a round. Additionally, I only use FMJ ammo (.45 acp), just to make sure the weapon will cycle without a jam. I find FMJ is much more forgiving for FTF and FTE's. And since I usually carry unchambered, I want to ensure that my pistol will not jam, so it's FMJ for me all the way.
 
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