June 8th, 2011 05:40 AM
Seems kind of scammish to me.
June 8th, 2011 08:56 AM
hyped marketing I find distasteful.
waste of money for the service they provide......"comfort"
Do your own research, find your own local Quality attorney in self defense law.
In fact, find another for backup.
Put one on retainer or just keep the numbers
"When plunder becomes a way of life for a group of men in a society, over the course of time they create for themselves a legal system that authorizes it and a moral code that glorifies it."
- Frederic Bastiat
June 8th, 2011 09:26 AM
This organization is always sending me some kind of marketing material and I now stay clear from their website. If I want an attorney on retainer, then I’ll find someone local to my area that is well respected by the courts.
“Monsters are real and so are ghosts. They live inside of us, and sometimes they win.”
~ Stephen King
June 8th, 2011 10:24 AM
You make a great point. In a self-defense shooting case, I want a LOCAL guy who is known and respected around the jurisdiction where the event took place. I'd rather have a lawyer who knows the judge and understands local jurors, than some hired gun (no pun intended) from The Big City to fly in trying to minimize his/her out-of-pocket expenses.
Originally Posted by Saber
June 8th, 2011 11:38 AM
In all fairness to USCCA/Defense Shield:
- For those of you who are members of a group health insurance policy through your employer... You are a beneficiary, not the policy holder, so that works the same way as Defense Shield.
- Yes, Tim the creator of USCCA does go over the top when promoting his "stuff." And, as a result it can seem a bit like a scam.
- Prices are not listed to the general public, as membership in USCCA is required... Just as special deals on insurance for guns, etc. are offered through the NRA.
- Also, The Armed Citizens' Legal Defense Network (ACLDN) Fee is used to make you a member and only 25% of the fee is used towards the "insurance."
While I have not researched it COMPLETELY, I can tell you this:
ACLDN ($85 yearly, you become a member automatically)coverage appears to be limited to:
- $5,000 for a misdemeanor criminal charge reslting from self defense discharge of a firearm.
- $10,000 for a felony criminal charge reslting from self defense discharge of a firearm.
- You get your own lawyer, but they have a list of local attorneys in your area
USCCA Defense Shield is an additional charge above membership and offers 3 levels of protection at three price points:
- $50,000 civil/$25,000 criminal defense (paid once you are acquitted), availability of $25,000 grant to pay costs up front (that will be repaid by the insurance, if acquitted). Cost $127 annually (in addition to membership in USCCA).
- $100K civil/$50K criminal defense (paid once you are acquitted), availability of $50,000 grant to pay costs up front (that will be repaid by the insurance, if acquitted). Cost $197 annually (in addition to membership in USCCA).
- $300K civil/$75K criminal defense (paid once you are acquitted), availability of $75,000 grant to pay costs up front (that will be repaid by the insurance, if acquitted). Cost $297 annually (in addition to membership in USCCA).
- As with ACLDN, You get your own lawyer, but they have a list of local attorneys in your area.
USCCA also offers 100% full refund if not satisfied for any reason on all its products, including Defense Shield IINM.
DISCLAIMER!: Now, what I've said here may be inaccurate, but it is my understanding of the benefits available from both ACLDN and DefenseShield. I am a member of USCCA but otherwise am not affiliated with them, and am not paid to defend them... But rather than just spread rumor and innuendo, I thought it might be best to actually compare the products and report what I think is the truth, not what it seems to be.
It could be worse!
June 8th, 2011 03:52 PM
If you want something like this, look at the Armed Citizens Legal Defense Network. $85 a year, and they've proven themselves to be reliable.
This is WAY off base. ACLDN deposits $10,000 into your lawyers bank account immediately. They will then pay the rest of the fees, as incurred, up to $100,000 I believe. The $10,000 is just the initial payment.
Originally Posted by oakchas
June 8th, 2011 05:38 PM
I am a member of USCCA. However, after seeing my "prorated price", I'll stick with The Armed Citizens' Legal Defense Network. The ACLDN is a known product. I like USCCA but I am getting very tired of their marketing campaigns.
June 8th, 2011 09:22 PM
I'm also a member of the ACLDN. In addition to the funding, you also get access to expert witnesses like Mas Ayoob. And they have a "boots on the ground" program, where they will fly to you to assist in setting up your legal defense. I've personally spoken to Marty Hayes and his wife Gila on the phone. They are the real deal.
As far as anything associated with the USCCA...I used to be a moderator on their forum. However, I could not stand giving tacit approval to some of the marketing schemes that Tim was unleashing on the members, so I quit. 'Nuff said about that...
The more good folks carry guns, the fewer shots the crazies can get off.
Glock 30, 19, 26; Ruger SP101, LCR, LCP (2), Mini 14; Marlin 336 .30-30; Mossberg 500
June 8th, 2011 11:39 PM
The cost is close to $300. per year. Thats for the premium coverage.
June 9th, 2011 09:17 AM
One can just imagine what the tiny print disclaimers are.
One more step and it's on!
June 9th, 2011 11:14 AM
I am not disparaging ACLDN... Their board of advisors IS a who's who of big names in the self defense community... But other than the $5K for misdemeanor charges or $10K paid to your attorney up front and a review of your case by one of the experts (not neccesarrily one of the Advisory board), NOTHING MORE IS GUARANTEED, Based on what I read on ACLDN's site (all underlining or bolding was added by me):
Originally Posted by Spidey2011
As to the "boots on the ground" program, the language they use is unclear:
If the incident results in felony charges the fee deposit is $10,000; if the member faces misdemeanor charges, a $5,000 fee deposit is sent to his or her attorney...
...Network members are also eligible
for additional grants
of financial assistance from the Network's legal defense fund if they face unmeritorious prosecution
or civil action after a self-defense incident occuring during their period of membership.
...A member who has been involved in a self-defense incident can request
assistance with legal fees...
If a member requests financial assistance, the board investigates the incident and decides how much financial assistance to grant
What constitutes response? it could just be a phone call. And, "Network official" does not mean "Advisory board" member.
If requested by the member or their representative, a Network official
to the location to assist the member in obtaining those services.
And, since ACLDN likes to throw names around, would it surprise you to learn that some of those SAME NAMES are on the "ADVISORY BOARD" of USCCA? John Farnam, and Mas Ayoob are on USCCA's "ADVISORY BOARD" As well.
Again, I'm not trying to disparage either product. I tried to accurately present the facts that I could determine from both entity's web sites regarding the product they sell. I used to be licensed in the insurance business... I've read a lot of fine print in my time. Both of these products take a different approach to insuring your potential loss. I pointed out those differences based on what each product advertised.
Now, all of that said, I like RugerMak AND MANY OTHERS, am getting VERY tired of USCCA's marketing campaigns.
It could be worse!
June 9th, 2011 12:20 PM
Originally Posted by dripster
Can't find any Posted limitations on ACLDN.
Originally Posted by Defense Shield PDF
Whoops, I did find this in the application for membership in ACLDN (bolding is mine):
Originally Posted by ACLDN Application PDF
It could be worse!
June 9th, 2011 06:22 PM
Originally Posted by 40strapped
I'll restrain myself and just call it HORSEPUCKEY!
No amount of money will guarantee you JUSTICE in either a criminal or civil procedure.
-SIG , it's What's for Dinner-
know your rights!
"If I walk in the woods, I feel much more comfortable carrying a gun. What if you meet a bear in the woods that's going to attack you? You shoot it."
June 9th, 2011 06:38 PM
TRUTH. But only dependent on which side you're on...
Originally Posted by AKsrule
It could be worse!
June 9th, 2011 06:45 PM
I checked on the price yesterday. They have 3 plans, #1 is about 65.00 per year, #2 is about 130.00 per year, and plan #3 is about 265.00 per year.
I don't like the way their selling this,NO THANKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
These prices reflect a discount they give you for the price of your membership.
Last edited by bcbsagent; June 9th, 2011 at 08:28 PM.
Reason: more info.
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