Today at McDonalds, Firearm drawn (by me)
This is a discussion on Today at McDonalds, Firearm drawn (by me) within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by Florida
This may sound immature but he was asking for a fight and I was going to give it to him, I ...
June 25th, 2011 04:38 AM
You said it, not me... That's exactly what it was. And why I'm not upset that minimum age for ccw in my state is 23.
Originally Posted by Florida
Yes, you had every right to pull your weapon, but... It wasn't the right thing to do. JMHO.
Also, we've all done stunts in our past where years later we all look back and say, I'm surprised I lived this long. The same will happen to you. You'll be amazed how differently you view things in 20 - 25 years.
But dude, you had your g/f with you... not cool to put her safety in jeopardy to have some parking lot fisticuffs.
As it turned out, things weren't what you thought they were going to be. It came damn close to being a killing situation.
And what if he had pulled out a Glock-30 and start busting caps before you even got out of your car instead of pulling a knife? You were pretty startled and surprised he pulled out a knife when you didn't expect it. How would you have responded if bullets started flying before you even had drawn your gun. Tell me that doesn't happen in Florida. How skilled of a gunfighter are you really?
"The gun is the great equalizer... For it is the gun, that allows the meek to repel the monsters; Whom are bigger, stronger and without conscience, prey on those who without one, would surely perish."
June 25th, 2011 06:58 AM
Yep, definitely a major no no. Do you realize the minute you pulled your weapon on your assailant that you had comitted assault with a deadly weapon. You need to really think about carrying that little boom stick if that is as cool as you can keep your head. I know its a heated moment but you could actaully be the one in jail if the other clown new his crap. When ever you pull your gun always call LEO. If they aren't worth calling then the gun wasn't worth pulling.
It appears you are extremely lucky.
June 25th, 2011 07:44 AM
Right there either you or your girlfriend should have been dialing 911.
Originally Posted by Florida
Not the best move, but understandable - not wanting to be trapped in my vehicle, still have an opportunity to diffuse the situation.
So i get out of the car...
Good choice of words, might have added that it was the McD's that was making a career of taking my order.
...and we're standing about 10 yards from each other and I say "look man I don't know what your problem is but I think you need to get in your car and leave".
Waaaayyyyy too late. Tuller drill, look it up. The average person can close a 21' (7 yards) distance in 1.5 seconds. The average CC person that gets regular practice can get drawn and on target in 2.0. Your GF really should have been on the phone with 911 by now.
...Which apparently only further irritated him. He them pulled about an eight inch blade from his pocket and started speed walking torwards me. (p.s. i'm only 21 and just got my CWP about 4 months ago) As he gets about 5 yards from my I draw my weapon...
This is your first massive irresponsible and stupid move. Sorry, I call it as I see (read) it.
... and tell him if he takes one more step I will fire. He immediately folded his knife up, put it in his pocket and walked back to his car. I didn't call the cops,
Second epic fail, leaving the scene of a crime...
I just got in my car and left.
NOT a laughing matter...period.
It was a scary thought and never really hit me, even though I know I will defend myself with lethal force if need be, that for the couple of seconds where my weapon was drawn that I might actually have to shoot someone. That's it lol,
Reality check. You are 21. Time to man up and seriously take a long hard look at your attitude towards people, life, and conflict. You chose to take responsibility for the safety of you and yours by obtaining your CC and carrying a gun. Good for you.
Originally Posted by Florida
This is not a testosterone booster shot. This is a slow down, think, pride snuffing inoculation.
Absolutely, and as noted previously and repeatedly, drive away. If you seriously think that conflict avoidance is "un-manly" then you need to STOP carrying your gun, and lock your permit away until you can grasp the gravity of the responsibilities involved in carrying and potentially using your weapon.
but come on when you were 21 and someone challanged you a fight did you just roll up your windows and call the police?
Your CC is the last tool you ever deploy in the most dire of circumstances. NOT an ace in the hole during a challenge. You may have the legal right to stand your ground, but I guarantee you, in a situation like this, as you described it, you and your lawyer will have a very hard time justifying that in court.
I do hope you stick around here and do some reading on other threads and topics. There is much to learn here.
Grasseater // Grass~eat~er noun, often attributive \ˈgras-ē-tər\
A person who is incapable of independent thought; a person who is herd animal-like in behavior; one who cannot distinguish between right and wrong; a foolish person.
See also Sheep
June 25th, 2011 07:45 AM
I realize that I am arm chair quarter backing this like everyone else.......
And that all of this is strictly just my opionion.....
A) On the subject of getting out of the car... Shouldn't have happened.... *UNLESS* I know in my area... Alot of the McD drive thru's are built so the parking spot they send you to when your order is going to take too long is really just a cut out... If a person had pulled past you here and stopped your vehicle exit would've been blocked. IMHO sitting in your vehicle, even with the window rolled up, is not a defensible position.
B) As soon as he got out of the car... You or your g/f should've been on the phone to 911. End of story.. Nothing good was going to come of the situation.... And he very easily could've said some nut job pulled his gun on me in McD drive thru for no reason.... And it would've been your word against his... and depending on how hostile your local police force to citizedns who carry.... You would've been EFF'd
C) When you decide to carry a firearm, you give up certain things... Like getting into fights, and other **** like that... You get to let stuff go... You dont get out of your car and provoke situations... You dont get to be macho in front of your g/f... You turn the other cheek... You play by the rules... You act like a fine upstanding citizen... Because as soon as you dont keep your cool, as soon as a situation goes south on you... THere are 100 people who will come out of the wood work (Including D.A.'s and civil attorney's) who will be foaming at the mouth to crucify you and every other citizen who chooses to legally carry firearms... Your actions not only represent you but all of us as well...
Please, I beg of you, try to remember that next time.....
June 25th, 2011 07:48 AM
Damn you Sticks... You used almost every single one of my arguements... 1 minute before me... Plus yours is formatted much nicer.... I am shamed... :)
June 25th, 2011 07:51 AM
Don't beat yourself up too badly. You're alive, she's alive, he's alive.
As most posters are intimating, you made an error; live with it, learn from it.
I know you were looking for a pat on the back when you originally posted your report, and I also know everyone here is glad the situation didn't escalate beyond what it did. Congratulations for sticking around here, when everyone started pointing out your errors. We do that because we care.
Good luck, and may you never have to draw your weapon again.
"If you make something idiot proof, someone will make a better idiot."
June 25th, 2011 07:59 AM
Highly recommend you make a report this morning...before he does.
Now that you've had to draw it, now spend some money on training on employing your weapon...including when not to employ your weapon. As a previous poster stated--and if there is one thing you take away from this thread and this site is this:
When you decide to carry a firearm, you give up certain things... Like getting into fights, and other **** like that... You get to let stuff go... You dont get out of your car and provoke situations... You dont get to be macho in front of your g/f... You turn the other cheek... You play by the rules... You act like a fine upstanding citizen... Because as soon as you dont keep your cool, as soon as a situation goes south on you... THere are 100 people who will come out of the wood work (Including D.A.'s and civil attorney's) who will be foaming at the mouth to crucify you and every other citizen who chooses to legally carry firearms...
- know the difference
is a fancy name for crappy fighter
You have never lived until you have almost died. For those that have fought for it, life has a special flavor the protected will never know
June 25th, 2011 08:14 AM
Glad you're okay, most of what I'd say has been covered already. It's tough to do when you're young, but don't let your pride guide your judgment. DRIVE AWAY.
Losing your place in line for flapjacks doesn't nearly match the burden of hiring a lawyer for criminal and/or civil representation.
June 25th, 2011 08:26 AM
If you're still in a place where you are happy and comfortable rolling around on the ground, hitting and kicking and all that stuff, then it's probably better not to be carrying a firearm. From a defensive standpoint, if you're in your car and somebody is standing 30 feet away menacing you, well, you can just step on the gas and mow the guy down, or drive away, or stay in your car, roll up the windows, lock the doors, and get your firearm ready.
I've been in many fights and this was just going to be another...whatever.
Pro tip: Don't go to McDonald's. Ever.
"It may seem difficult at first, but everything is difficult at first."
June 25th, 2011 08:36 AM
I hate it when a good story goes south.
June 25th, 2011 08:42 AM
My two cents worth.
All around good job. In the future though...
1) Stay in your vehical
2) Dont allow anyone with a knife to get that close
3) Call the police. If not during the incident, very soon after. If it's over be sure to tell the police that it's over.
June 25th, 2011 08:46 AM
Originally Posted by Sticks
Ruger P345 Ruger LCP
"Show me a young Conservative and I'll show you someone with no heart. Show me an old Liberal and I'll show you someone with no brains." - Winston Churchill
June 25th, 2011 08:49 AM
You're right it does. I'm almost twice your age and I've never been in a fight in a parking lot. I've practiced conflict avoidance long before carrying. I'm not going to give these animals the satisfaction of a fight, that actually frustrates them even more. I also know, as you have just learned, that not every thing is as it seems. Check your ego at the door and don't give in to these challenges. Roll up the windows, call 911, put it in reverse and leave.
Originally Posted by Florida
"I got a lot of problems with you people!" - Frank Costanza
June 25th, 2011 09:26 AM
I would suggest that you could have had the GF call as you were stepping out of the vehicle, then she could give the 911 operator the play by play. Or don't even get out, without a gun it would difficult for him to get at you if you are in your car with the windows rolled up.
Originally Posted by Florida
You know what they say about hindsight. Be sure to learn from this experience and apply what you've learned "if" it happens again.
"Don't hit a man if you can possibly avoid it; but if you do hit him, put him to sleep." - Theodore Roosevelt
June 25th, 2011 09:27 AM
'''Where I'm from a little fight in the parking lot is just that, a fight. I've been in many fights and this was just going to be another...whatever.'''
Put your gun away until you've developed the ability to not feel the need to respond to a challenge from some idiot in a parking lot. I'm sure you're a tough guy and have won your share of fights but when you introduce a handgun you can't just shake the other guys hand afterwards and laugh it off......someone is going to the hospital/morgue and someone is going to jail. Don't be either one of those guys.........
To sit back hoping that someday, some way, someone will make things right is to go on feeding the crocodile, hoping he will eat you last - but eat you he will.
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