Is a holster considered "concealed?" - Page 3

Is a holster considered "concealed?"

This is a discussion on Is a holster considered "concealed?" within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I have wondered this very thing for years now, I've got a Makarov that came with a flap holster that completely covers the gun. It ...

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Thread: Is a holster considered "concealed?"

  1. #31
    Senior Member Array Dadsnugun's Avatar
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    I have wondered this very thing for years now, I've got a Makarov that came with a flap holster that completely covers the gun. It is obviously a pistol holster, and is my belief that no reasonable person would assume it's anything other...but it would irk the heck out of me to wear it into a 7-11 or someplace to pick up a soda on my way out to the desert for some benign plinking, and get popped for CCW with the holster in broad view, in an open carry state. It's not really helpful that Colorado doesn't seem to have a real definition of what open carry actually consists of, so it's most likely left to the discretion of the cops. Not a bad thing, in and of itself...the average cop is more than capable of recognizing a gun holster...but everyone has their bad days or conflicts of personality. I guess, like many on this board, I'd rather leave that particular option at home and use a rig that makes it obvious what's in that odd leather thingy on my belt (or completely concealed, if your a CCW'er), than taking a chance on coming out on the wrong end of a possibly grey area. It's a bit of a shame, as I actually believe the flap holster mentioned is less conspicuous, and would tend to pacify the anti's palpitating hearts much better than my cocked and locked 1911 worn it's stead. Oh well...better safe than sorry.
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  2. #32
    Distinguished Member Array kelcarry's Avatar
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    C'mon now. The word "reasonable" is usually used in code terminologies and anyone with 2 eyes and any brains will assume that such a holster contains a firearm. If it does not then no harm, no foul---LEOs stop you and see no firearm and only a sub sandwich they may laugh or may get mad but they will not arrest you--a holster is not a firearm--thus no CC or OC or anything except a sub sandwich. If there is a firearm, it was the preeminent "reasonable" assumption that has now been shown to be true and it is as OC as can be.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by gasmitty View Post
    In AZ, open carry was (and remains) permissible. Until the new Vermont-style laws was passed last year, the law stated that something like three inches of the holster had to remain visible in order for the gun to be considered not concealed. Just offering this as an example and not a definition.

    Taking a moment to comment on a broader topic: In some threads running over the past few days, a number of posts have highlighted actions which, though strictly legal, might draw unwelcome attention from law enforcement. What needs to be pointed out is that often law enforcement officers act to uphold the intent yet not necessarily the letter of the law, and in so doing cause a lot of "inconvenience" on the part of lawful gun-toters. Connecticut is a prime example; permits are issued to carry pistols and revolvers; "concealed" is not in the language of the law or the permit application. Yet walk around in public with an unconcealed handgun and you will likely get noticed by the gendarmes and lose your permit as a result... even though "concealed" is not a specific stipulation. Cops will make arrests based on their trained interpretation of laws, and it's up to the state/county/etc's lawyers (DA, prosecutor) to make the charges stick or not. My point is simply that the legitimately-armed community needs to consciously err on the conservative side with regard to interpreting what meets the intent of the laws about concealed carry. (stepping down from the soap box now.)
    Very well stated as there seems to be a growing interest by some, to push the envelope.
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  4. #34
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    I'm guessing if some part of the weapon is visible, like the grips say from behind, even with the holster flap being over them, then the weapon would technically not be concealed. Pics might help, so we can see what you mean better...
    "Be justified. Blood may be easily wiped from the sword.
    It cannot, however, be put back from where it came." --Quicksabre

  5. #35
    Senior Member Array Dadsnugun's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kelcarry View Post
    C'mon now. The word "reasonable" is usually used in code terminologies and anyone with 2 eyes and any brains will assume that such a holster contains a firearm. If it does not then no harm, no foul---LEOs stop you and see no firearm and only a sub sandwich they may laugh or may get mad but they will not arrest you--a holster is not a firearm--thus no CC or OC or anything except a sub sandwich. If there is a firearm, it was the preeminent "reasonable" assumption that has now been shown to be true and it is as OC as can be.
    My thoughts exactly, but you know what happens when there is more than 1 person and an idea that is "open to interpretation".
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  6. #36
    VIP Member Array jonconsiglio's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saber View Post
    Very well stated as there seems to be a growing interest by some, to push the envelope.
    Exactly. There seems to be a lot of posts about wanting to push the limits of the law, seemingly for no other reason than to see what one can get away with. This thread is obviously about that which is obvious to me for two reasons. No one truly concerned with preserving their life would carry a WWII handgun when they normally carry a modern handgun nor would they carry in a WWII flap holster when they carry in a modern holster.

    These threads are silly. I can understand the question, but why even ask it unless your just curious how far you can push it? Carry a modern firearm with modern bullet technology in a modern holster while receiving modern training from a respectable and modern trianer……well, unless you like just being at a disadvantage for the sake of discussion on a forum.
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  7. #37
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    Michigan and Holsters (CC or OC)

    You may consider this question not legitimate in modern times but only to make trouble.

    A legitimate reason for this question may be because one must carry openly but wants to cause as little offense as possible in areas such as OC on private property or at a church/school PFZ where a CPL holder MUST carry openly with the intent of not being asked to leave because someone got "scared"..

    So rather than this question being asked to "make trouble" it can also be casked in order to lessen possible negative encounters until people get more comfortable and stop basing fear on hollywood.

  8. #38
    Member Array rtroha's Avatar
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    A few years ago, a guy in Cleveland thought he was open carrying at a coffee shop. He had his gun in a military-style flap holster. The Cleveland cops arrested him for unlicensed CCW.

    Details here:

    Open Carry A Hot Topic As Cleveland Charges Fought

  9. #39
    Member Array 2wheelGnnr's Avatar
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    Its my understandings its the same in NY. Discernable is the key. In something that LOOKS like a holster not concealed..in a basic shaped fanny pack...concealed. Now I must say for me personally. Unitl I got interested in pistol firearms I woulda never thought twice about a fanny pack style carry but now that I am......I see it and say.. Hmmm..wonder if thats a firearm in there??!! especially that one company that makes them specifically for CC.....you can see that a mile away..IF your experience.

    but I know..there's some gray and I think the avg person does not think FIREARM HIDING PLACE like "WE" CCW holders do.

    Just my take.
    Please...work HARDER as MILLIONS on welfare depending on YOU !!

  10. #40
    VIP Member Array Eagleks's Avatar
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    I know one place I "had" to go in to that is posted, so I locked the gun in the glove box and went in. HOWEVER, I made NO attempt to conceal the holster that was still on me. Since mostly the bottom part showed so no one really knew if a gun was in the holster or not, but there is no law against wearing an empty holster.

    A couple of people looked at me in disbelief, but generally speaking.... the others never even noticed.
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  11. #41
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    You have to do some digging to find out the laws in YOUR state regarding this issue.

    Here is Michigans law below, verbatim, pertaining to this very subject:


    MCL 750.227 allows you to carry a concealed pistol if you are in your home, place of business, or on other land possessed by you. If you do not possess the land, you may lawfully carry the pistol as long as you carry it non-concealed. Michigan appellate courts have held complete invisibility is not required for the weapon to be considered concealed. The weapon is concealed if it is not observed by those casually observing the person as people do in the ordinary and usual associations of life. Attorney General's opinion #3158 dated February 14, 1945, states a pistol carried in a holster or belt outside of the clothing in plain view is not considered concealed, but carrying under a coat would constitute concealed.














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