Thoughts

Thoughts

This is a discussion on Thoughts within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Just a couple of thoughts. As a nurse a big part of my job is assisting my patients in understanding what is happening with them. ...

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Thread: Thoughts

  1. #1
    Member Array kikr's Avatar
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    Thoughts

    Just a couple of thoughts. As a nurse a big part of my job is assisting my patients in understanding what is happening with them. I've noticed that there are two basic issues that interfere with this process, the first is the patients denial/acceptance of whats wrong with them. They often get so wrapped up in whats supposed to happen, or should happen that they lose sight of what is happening. The second obstacle is a lack of understanding of the concept of real time. They get so caught up with wanting a discharge date that they don't understand that things have to happen first. "you can't be discharged untill we discontinue your catheter, we cant d/c the catheter untill your continent, you wont be continent untill you've healed from the surgery. It's not based on a count of minutes it's based on the occurance of events.

    The same thing occurs in defensive situations, people deny that they are actually being attacked. "this cant be happening to me", "why would this guy want to hurt me?" takes place of forward motion that may actually be productive towards their safety. Or they think, "I don't need a gun in my house the police say their response time is only two minutes". Intsead they need to think about what is going to be happening in the mean time.

    I know it's not very well articulated but just a couple of thoughts
    We sleep safe in our beds because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those who would do us harm.
    George Orwell


  2. #2
    VIP Member Array Redneck Repairs's Avatar
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    I understood your thoughts compleatly ( or so i belive ) and you are on the money . As an aside Too many expect that once the fecees meets the oscolating rotatory ventilation device , things will progress in a logical manner . They do not actualy observe what is going on arround them , rather they react as they have trained themselves to either by thier training program , or thier research as to how things " should work " .
    Make sure you get full value out of today , Do something worthwhile, because what you do today will cost you one day off the rest of your life .
    We only begin to understand folks after we stop and think .

    Criminals are looking for victims, not opponents.

  3. #3
    Senior Member Array madmike's Avatar
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    Actually, I thought it was rather well articulated!

    My own experience in the hospital setting, (X-Ray, mostly ER work,) in the military, and out in the "civilian world," has me in 100% agreement with your assessment.

    mm
    Political Correctness has now "evolved" into Political Cowardice.

  4. #4
    VIP Member Array pogo2's Avatar
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    Maturity and accepting reality

    Your thoughts are right on the mark. A good portion of the population lives in a fantasy world of their mind, hoping the real world will be nice to them. But with maturity comes a realization of how the world really is, and acceptance of that reality.

    When you accept reality you generally make preparations for unpleasant things that might happen, so you are ready. You might buckle your seat belt, make a will, practice with your gun, and start watching your surroundings more carefully. You try to avoid dangerous places, people and situations. And hopefully you can grow old.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by pogo2
    Your thoughts are right on the mark. A good portion of the population lives in a fantasy world of their mind, hoping the real world will be nice to them. But with maturity comes a realization of how the world really is, and acceptance of that reality.
    You are right about maturity bringing a realization. Unfortunately maturity is not a universal. Maturity comes to some of us very early and to some it comes never. We got to their funeral and look down at their face in a coffin and realize this person never grew up. They never matured to the point of taking responsibility for their own actions or life. In some societies, including the US up until the sixties, maturing was expected of an individual and survival or at least surviving in reasonable comfort required that you mature.

    In our society today maturing takes place in spite of the society not because of it. When the society fosters a victimization mentality and unrealistic expectations about life and the world it produces immature individuals who breed and produce more immature individuals. The US is moving toward the point, and may have already reach it, where immaturity is the norm. That is why it is up to us to train our children to responsible and mature individuals and to help those around us that will to become mature and responsible as well.
    George

    Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe. Albert Einstein

  6. #6
    Member Array Gary Crumrine's Avatar
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    Friends,

    Do you recall Elizabeth Kubler-Ross' stages of grief? They seem to mirror Kikr's excellent observations as well as (possibly) reflect the emotional states one races through when confronted by the threat of death.

    01: Denial and isolation ("This is not happening to me")
    02: Anger ("How dare you do this to me")
    03: Bargaining ("Just let me live")
    04: Depression ("I can't bare to put my family through this")
    05: Acceptance ("I'm ready to deal with this").

    The last stage ("I'm ready ...) is where we want to be, but (and this is a question for those who have experience in these matters) does one have to first race through the previous stages to get there?

    Cordially,
    Gary Crumrine

  7. #7
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    Hi Gary - welcome to you as I am sure I have not said as much yet.
    does one have to first race through the previous stages to get there?
    Perhaps in a sense yes but in the most rapid of sequences - each of 1 thru 4 is ''pushed aside'' as irrelevant or unnecessary if we have the right approach. So fast in fact they might almost not exist.

    We perceive threat first and foremost and I would add that in fact #2 is IMO of some use - in as much as we thru that strengthen resolve to do something - the anger can be motivating. ''How dare someone threaten my life''.

    kikr - your message is clear and I think we will find we are all easily on that page with you.
    Chris - P95
    NRA Certified Instructor & NRA Life Member.

    "To own a gun and assume that you are armed
    is like owning a piano and assuming that you are a musician!."


    http://www.rkba-2a.com/ - a portal for 2A links, articles and some videos.

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    Distinguished Member Array AnimalKracker's Avatar
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    Very well done. It puts the whole process in a new and different light. Thanks, Philip

  9. #9
    VIP Member Array rodc13's Avatar
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    I think you make a very good observation, Chris. I think that if we're in a prepared state of mind, we've already dealt with issues 1-4, perhaps in this fashion:

    01: I'm aware that bad things can happen.
    02: I refuse to be a victim.
    03: If this set of circumstances occurs, a prescribed level of force is appropriate.
    04: I understand the consequences of my actions.
    05: I am ready to take action when the time comes.

    I think this occurs when we accept the reality of the world in which we live, and when we decide to take personal responsibility for our own well-being, rather than merely abrogating that role to "the powers that be".
    Cheers,
    Rod
    "We're paratroopers. We're supposed to be surrounded!" Dick Winters

  10. #10
    Senior Member Array BlueLion's Avatar
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    Interesting that your post speaks on the wise of "This can't be happending." because it is that split second thought that causes people to get hurt or die. Why? because your mindset changes and your reaction time slows. We begin to feel sorry for the person or what our potential to hurt them is. In the military I was trained to react and not worry about the action until it is over. This is an asservtive aggressive posture that we must all have regardless if we CCW or not. "Take the fight to them"
    Listen, Think and React.....Nuff Said.....

  11. #11
    Senior Member Array madmike's Avatar
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    Chris,

    I find I am in agreement with your "abbreviated" movement through those steps. They aren't actually by-passed, but some will flash though some steps, perhaps linger in others.

    Acceptance? Yes, in the end, I suppose we must. But still. . .

    Do not go gentle into that good night,
    Old age should burn and rave at close of day;
    Rage, rage against the dying of the light.

    Dylan Thomas (1914 - 1953)

    mm
    Political Correctness has now "evolved" into Political Cowardice.

  12. #12
    VIP Member Array Redneck Repairs's Avatar
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    "This can't be happending." because it is that split second thought that causes people to get hurt or die. Why? because your mindset changes and your reaction time slows.
    That sir is as good an understanding of the OODA loop as i have ever seen put into laymans terms Kudos on the consise summation of both the problem and the solution .
    Make sure you get full value out of today , Do something worthwhile, because what you do today will cost you one day off the rest of your life .
    We only begin to understand folks after we stop and think .

    Criminals are looking for victims, not opponents.

  13. #13
    VIP Member Array Old Chief's Avatar
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    Kikr, your thoughts are timely and good. Well written. I agree that we are lost in the time warp between Why me and I do not understand. As rational and accountable beings we must move on to situational awareness and take charge of the situation.

  14. #14
    Senior Member Array Timmy Jimmy's Avatar
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    OK now how do we get the sheeple to read it?
    Timmy Jimmy

    If it is not in the US Constitution then the Federal Government should not be doing it.

    "Carrying a gun is a social responsibility."

  15. #15
    Distinguished Member Array AnimalKracker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timmy Jimmy
    OK now how do we get the sheeple to read it?
    Well TJ. the people that this thread could help are already reading it and thinking about it. The "others" well you could tell them, show them,and they still would not get it, some will be waiting on someone to put the fire out as the building burns down around them.

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