This is a discussion on How do you find an attorney for retainer? within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by livewire9880 I don't know about "intent on", I've been talking about it for two years :) But I see the validity of ...
But then, $85 a year won't buy much training so if it gives you peace of mind, go ahead and "pull the trigger." But you might just be as well off to talk to a lawyer you trust and ask for a referral to someone who could handle such a case, and talk to them... see what a lawyer you might choose anyway in the event of need has to say about it... After all, ACLDN would be paying him the up front amount...
It could be worse!
You want a "piece" of me, John?!?
I fixed it... thanks...
It could be worse!
The difference is that if I had not put him on retainer there would not have been a formal arrangement put into place. The way it is now, all of the paperwork has been signed and taken care of already. That would not have been done otherwise. I don't see any reason for you to see red flags, I have no worries about this.
If the way you do things in some cases is to do this without a retainer, that's great. But in my case, if I had left it informal I would have run the risk of them not taking my case if and when I ever needed them. This way, they have agreed to represent me and there are no more questions that need to be addressed in that regard.
74, I'm glad that you "have no worries." Me, neither. Your lawyer probably did nothing wrong, as long as your retainer fee remains in his trust account and he doesn't monkey with it. However, I've seen enough attorneys get in trouble with trust account issues, sometimes resulting in disbarment, that anytime I see "creative" retainer or trust account arrangements, my antennae go up.
I don't know what paperwork you may have signed, but the only thing that you've at least theoretically guaranteed is that the law firm you've paid the retainer to won't represent the other side if you get sued. If you are prosecuted or sued, and the attorney doesn't want to represent you, all he's got to do is pay back your money, unless he's signed some kind of guarantee that he'll represent you. I guess it's not impossible, but I've yet to see a lawyer sign off on such an irrevocable promise.
Your best insurance is still to know the law, train, and not shoot someone who doesn't need to be shot.
"You can purchase insurance if you wish. But you are more likely to need a defibrillator, a fire extinguisher, a seatbelt, an oncologist, or a neurologist, than you are to need a lawyer to defend you in a self defense case.
Your premium would be better spent (as MitchellCT has pointed out many times) in training, force on force, legal ramifications of self defense, etc. Or, you can go back and read In the Gravest Extreme" again, and LEARN everything it says."
Let me see, I have needed a defibrillator, I had my fire extinguisher many years before I needed it, I should have had the seat belt on that time I needed it, my wife and other family members have needed an oncologist. I have insurance on my home, my health, my car and yes I am a member of ACLDN. I feel confident that should I ever be involved in a situation where I need to draw my weapon that ACLDN will be there with $5K to start my defense of a misdemeanor or $10K to start the defense of a felony. They will also look at my case and determine whether a grant of additional funds meets their criteria (i.e. a clean shoot). But, even without this the training I receive from them is worth the membership dues. The three training DVD's I received when I joined will help keep me out of trouble.
Another reason I belong to ACLDN is that part of my dues are set aside to defend members involved in self defense shootings. Each time a self defense shooting is successfully defended my rights are more secure. Attorneys hate to lose. When the DA's figure out that they are going up against an organization and not some poor schmuck with few resources they may think twice. A win on a homicide helps a career but a loss does not. Now, many of them will not prosecute very many homicides in a career. It is natural that they may get a little excited at the prospect of a rare opportunity to advance their standing.
Chipping in a few bucks to help people like Marty Hayes and Mas Ayoob fight for my rights seems like a good deal to me.
You make a good point... Not only do these organizations have the potential to help you in the rare event of a defensive shoot... if you never use it, your $85 just may have contributed to the defense of someone else who also may not have the resources to defend themselves in a clean defensive shoot.
You cannot fathom the resources poured into a homicide case. It is a tier one incident, and they do not spare expenses.
What the ACN or other groups may do is:
1 Educate you so your shooting isn't a homicide.
2 Provide you a better footing in terms of affording counsel earlier, and having reduced/no cost advice & help for your counsel from people who litterally wrote the book on self defense, so that your attorney can hopefully get the case on the right track (to dismisal...because, after all, it's not a criminal matter...self defense isn't a criminal act, Mr. Prosecutor...) early.
3 In the event it goes all the way, you have more resources available to fight, and thus your attorney can do things he ordinarily wouldn't be able to do, like conduct a mock trial before your case goes to trial so he can work out everything, get experts he wants instead of those you can afford, and maybe hire a forensic expert to dispute the state's findings if needed.
Remember, if you aren't indigent, you don't get a public defender...
And if you are paying for your defense, it's on your dime.
Your lawyer doesn't bankroll your case, and the fee agreement you signed (you did sign it...because if you didn't, GOOD BYE...) says the cost of experts if YOUR expense, seperate from the attorney's fees.
You don't pay for it as a client, I don't have it available as counsel for your case.
Don't like it? Think "I'd paid you $50K for lawyer fees, and you wouldn't spot me a few grand for an expert!"
Yes. That is how it works in a homicide case. It's a high level case demanding time and effort, and payment will be commensurate with the work done.
If you are looking for a Captain America "save" because you are hanging with Marty-H and Massad-A...you have unrealistic expectations.
Do not make the mistake of assuming anything will act as an "easy button".
Not insurance, not one of the armed citizen/CCW membership groups...
The aftermath of a shooting will suck.
If you aren't prepared to make sure your actions are 100% compliant with the applicable law, maybe you shouldn't be wasting your time & money with insurance over education.
If you are a person of limited resources, then you had better make priorities, and if those priorities have gear (beyond a basic, if nice setup) or "shooting insurance" over training & education, then you need an attitude adjustment more than gear, insurance or education.
You are responsible for you.
If you screw it up, all the insurance and experts will not be able to help you.
And if you do it right, you will not need the insurance or the experts.
It could be worse!
I checked with my state CCW organization for their recommendation. They generally have close relationships with good firearm attorneys and can recommend one to you. I then called the recommended attorney, had a chat and got his card which I have in my wallet. I plan to revisit this every 3 years or so to ensure that he is still the right guy, but right now, he is considered the best in OH for CCW-related issues.
"I've noticed that everyone that is pro-abortion has already been born." - Ronald Reagan
"When governments fear the people there is liberty. When the people fear the government there is tyranny." Thomas Jefferson
You are only paranoid until you are right - then you are a visionary.