Mall Confusion

This is a discussion on Mall Confusion within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; New member here and first time poster. I'm wondering what I should do if anything. Went to the local mall this past weekend and noticed ...

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 42
Like Tree12Likes

Thread: Mall Confusion

  1. #1
    Member Array Cowbilly32's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    The Great Republic of Texas!
    Posts
    64

    Mall Confusion

    New member here and first time poster. I'm wondering what I should do if anything. Went to the local mall this past weekend and noticed something for the first time. One of the entrances to the mall had a sign posted with the correct verbiage (in Texas) to keep out concealed weapons, even if licensed to carry (Texas P.C. 30-06). I've not seen that before since I always entered the mall through one of the major department stores where no such sign exists. Being curious, I went to my usual entrance to see if a sign was posted thinking it could be new but no sign was there. I then went through the department store into the mall and still did not see a sign prohibiting the carrying of concealed handguns. I've carried in that mall many times without knowing it was prohibited because sign placement was not consistent.

    Wondering should I inform mall management so that some other unsuspecting brother doesn't get jacked up because he didn't know either, should I try to persuade them to change the rules to allow their patrons the ability to defend themselves if necessary or should I leave well enough alone and do nothing?

    I'm interested in what you all have to say. Thanks.

  2. Remove Ads

  3. #2
    VIP Member Array goldshellback's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    OKC; by way of St. Mayberry, GA
    Posts
    4,750
    The mall is essentially private property and 'they' can make the rules.
    I 'believe' (haven't looked it up yet) that the sign doesn't hold any weight unless your asked to leave the property because your concealed handgun was inadvertently 'discovered'.

    A letter/call/email 'might' be good, but ultimately I believe it'd fall 'on deaf ears'.
    If it makes them and others 'feel' safe, the sign'll stay. JMO.
    "Just getting a concealed carry permit means you haven't commited a crime yet. CCP holders commit crimes." Daniel Vice, senior attorney for the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence, quoted on Fox & Friends, 8 Jul, 2008

    (Sometimes) "a fight avioded is a fight won." ... claude clay

  4. #3
    Senior Member Array Inspector71's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Tennessee
    Posts
    982
    I don't know the laws about how the signs are supposed to be posted in Texas, but if the door I entered is not posted I'm going in! You say you have carried there numerous times without incident so I wouldn't say a word to management or you may be opening a HUGE can or worms. Don't rock the boat and carry on. Just my .02. Welcome from 10AC
    remington79, RETSUPT99 and JDE101 like this.
    If you can read this, thank a teacher. Because it's in English, thank a vet

  5. #4
    Senior Member Array adric22's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Fort Worth, TX
    Posts
    1,146
    Quote Originally Posted by Cowbilly32 View Post
    New member here and first time poster. I'm wondering what I should do if anything. Went to the local mall this past weekend and noticed something for the first time. One of the entrances to the mall had a sign posted with the correct verbiage (in Texas) to keep out concealed weapons, even if licensed to carry (Texas P.C. 30-06)
    Which mall is this?
    "Good people do not need laws to tell them to act responsibly, while bad people will find a way around the laws." -Plato

  6. #5
    VIP Member Array Paco's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    McKinney, TX
    Posts
    3,499
    In Texas the proper sign must be placed at all entrances. If there is a door that doesn't have one, use that door. If you are confronted adn it gets ugly simply indicate you didn't see any proper postings in the entrance you entered through.

    You'll have to then make the choice to leave and not risk any issue or disarm and enter. Which mall is this?
    Last edited by Paco; August 4th, 2011 at 12:22 PM. Reason: Clarification
    "Don't hit a man if you can possibly avoid it; but if you do hit him, put him to sleep." - Theodore Roosevelt

    -Paco
    http://www.shieldsd.net

  7. #6
    Ex Member Array Doodle's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Tomball TX
    Posts
    948
    In texas the correct 30.06 sign carries full weight with or without disclosure. If you carry past the sign you can be convicted of criminal trespass. I would ovoid the place personally but if you must give the mall your patronage I wouldn't carry. You know of the sign and it is now documented on the interweb.
    Tzadik likes this.

  8. #7
    Ex Member Array mhunter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    228
    Quote Originally Posted by goldshellback View Post
    The mall is escentally private property and 'they' can make the rules. I 'believe' (haven't looked it up yet) that the sign dosn't hold any weight unless your asked to leave the property because your concealed handgun was inadvertently 'discovered'.
    You are GRAVELY mistaken. In Texas, there most certainly is a LEGAL sign...the ubiquitous 30.06 sign... If it's properly posted, you can NOT legally carry there.

  9. #8
    Ex Member Array apvbguy's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    NE FL
    Posts
    1,076
    you could face arrest since some of the entrances are posted, however you would probably be able to beat the charges if it ever got that far. the question facing you is do you want to tempt fate and play around with the law and it's nuances? I wouldn't want to test some judges interpretation of the law.

    the bottom line is that if the mall doesn't want your gun there, that means they don't want your business, I would find other places to shop where your gun and money is welcome
    msgt/ret, 357and40 and carverelli like this.

  10. #9
    Member Array Steve666's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Indianapolis
    Posts
    47
    Probably a Simon property, they've tried that "stuff" around here. However, in Indiana signs carry no weight you just have to leave if asked or then you will be guilty of trespass.
    Steve
    An armed society is a polite society

  11. #10
    Member Array Cowbilly32's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    The Great Republic of Texas!
    Posts
    64
    Quote Originally Posted by adric22 View Post
    Which mall is this?
    Longview, TX

  12. #11
    Member Array Ianator's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    304
    MHunter is correct. Here is the actual law:

    Sec. 30.06. TRESPASS BY HOLDER OF LICENSE TO CARRY CONCEALED HANDGUN. (a) A license holder commits an offense if the license holder:
    (1) carries a handgun under the authority of Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code, on property of another without effective consent; and
    (2) received notice that:
    (A) entry on the property by a license holder with a concealed handgun was forbidden; or
    (B) remaining on the property with a concealed handgun was forbidden and failed to depart.
    (b) For purposes of this section, a person receives notice if the owner of the property or someone with apparent authority to act for the owner provides notice to the person by oral or written communication.
    (c) In this section:
    (1) "Entry" has the meaning assigned by Section 30.05(b).
    (2) "License holder" has the meaning assigned by Section 46.035(f).
    (3) "Written communication" means:
    (A) a card or other document on which is written language identical to the following: "Pursuant to Section 30.06, Penal Code (trespass by holder of license to carry a concealed handgun), a person licensed under Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code (concealed handgun law), may not enter this property with a concealed handgun"; or
    (B) a sign posted on the property that:
    (i) includes the language described by Paragraph (A) in both English and Spanish;
    (ii) appears in contrasting colors with block letters at least one inch in height; and
    (iii) is displayed in a conspicuous manner clearly visible to the public.
    (d) An offense under this section is a Class A misdemeanor.
    (e) It is an exception to the application of this section that the property on which the license holder carries a handgun is owned or leased by a governmental entity and is not a premises or other place on which the license holder is prohibited from carrying the handgun under Section 46.03 or 46.035."



    Basically, you have now documented that you have seen the sign. So you can no longer go through the department store entrance and claim you didn't know. (Well, you could but the prosecution might dig up this post.)
    My experience is that companies that post, are generally instructed to do so by a parent company or corporate HQ and so you contacting them will most likely do very very little. I am currently in contact with a local Hotel that is posted and I am trying to get them to take the signs down....Not gonna happen from what I can tell.
    If possible, I would not use this mall anymore. If you must. I would disarm. It just depends on what you want to fight.

    On the other hand, Welcome to the forum! You will find lots of interesting thing on here. Good luck!
    Tzadik likes this.

  13. #12
    Member Array Cowbilly32's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    The Great Republic of Texas!
    Posts
    64
    For the record, I have no intention to enter while armed since I now know about the sign. In fact, I have gone there twice now and have left it behind each time. I don't want trouble and was just wanting to know if I should point out the discrepancy to the mall management to protect some other fellow ccw'er or persuade them to remove the sign which I agree would be a difficult task.

    Thanks for the welcome guys!

  14. #13
    VIP Member Array Paco's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    McKinney, TX
    Posts
    3,499
    Quote Originally Posted by Cowbilly32 View Post
    For the record, I have no intention to enter while armed since I now know about the sign. In fact, I have gone there twice now and have left it behind each time. I don't want trouble and was just wanting to know if I should point out the discrepancy to the mall management to protect some other fellow ccw'er or persuade them to remove the sign which I agree would be a difficult task.

    Thanks for the welcome guys!
    I say give it a shot. I see it going one of two ways. 1) You'll get them to post all entrances properly, therefore helping avoid confusion for others. 2) You'll let them know that the law abiding citizens who carry are 99% all good people and not to be feared.
    Tzadik likes this.
    "Don't hit a man if you can possibly avoid it; but if you do hit him, put him to sleep." - Theodore Roosevelt

    -Paco
    http://www.shieldsd.net

  15. #14
    VIP Member Array mcp1810's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    4,952
    I don't know if there is actual case law on the issue ( I would bet there is) but in my CHL class they stated for the 30.06 signs to be enforceable they must be at every entrance. The OP knows that at least at the time he saw the sign that was the policy of the mall. Policies change.
    Katy Mills Mall had signs up at one time. I rarely go there, and when I do it is usually limited to Bass Pro. Bass Pro is not posted. There is no sign at the entrance to the mall from Bass Pro. Do they still have those signs posted? I have no idea. Do I have any reason to go out of my way to look for a sign? No. Do I spend my money elsewhere as a result of seeing a sign years ago? Yes.
    Infowars- Proving David Hannum right on a daily basis

  16. #15
    VIP Member Array oakchas's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Iowa
    Posts
    7,287
    When you notify them of their faux pas (the missing signage), I would also inform them that you regret that as a result of the signs, you must take your business elsewhere...

    I do a lot more shopping on the interwebby thing, nowadays. Often there is no sales tax (that's changing), frequently no shipping charge, and more often than not, I can beat local pricing.

    Oh, and I don't have to worry about 30.06 signs in Texas or other states where signage is binding law, so I can sit here strapped if I wanna.
    Rats!
    It could be worse!
    I suppose

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast

Links

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Search tags for this page

can i carry a gun in the mall
,

can i conceal carry in a mall

,

can you carry a gun in a mall

,

can you carry a gun in a mall in texas

,

can you conceal carry in a mall

,

can you conceal carry in malls in texas

,
can you take your hand gun into a mall in texas
,
concealed carry in texas malls
,
concealed carry mall shooting in katy tx.
,
macy's policies on carry concealed handgun licenses
,

simon mall concealed carry

,
simon malls concealed carry
Click on a term to search for related topics.