This is a discussion on Armed citizen intervention within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by HotGuns We do not know the background of the citizen involved. Critizing him for carry cuffs, rather than applauding the success of ...
When I was finished reading this story, the first thing that came to mind was someone undercover or a person who didn't want to be identified.
Don't believe what you hear and only half of what you see!
He may not have been at that time. He might have been once.The article I read said specifically that he was not law enforcemnet nor a security officer.
The further a society drifts from the truth, the more it will hate those that speak it...- George Orwell
AR. CHL Instr. 07/02 FFL
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First..I'm happy that things worked out in a postive manner for the Armed Citizen that intervened.
Now, to give feedback as the OP requested...If I am within distance to observe a gunfight going down, in a questionable area of town, then I have probably violated the rule of "not going stupid places"...IF, I happened to be in that part of town due to a job requirement, or a personal necessity, and observed the gunfight going down, then my first inclination is self preservation. I will seek COVER first, access my weapon, be a good observer, and call 911. I have no idea as to whether there is a "good guy" vs "bad guy" scenario going down, or a "bad guy" vs "bad guy" scenario going down. IF I were to intervene, ANOTHER REMOTE POSSIBLITY WOULD BE, an "undercover" vs a "bad guy" and unknown to me is which one is which. As for the Armed Citizen having cuffs and restraining one of the shooters, there obviously are questions which arise and no clear answers to those questions at this time. I have assumed and trained for the responsibility to defend myself and my loved ones and "perhaps" those known good folks that have been drawn into a situation through no fault of their own, at which point I would intervene on their behalf. Given the information in the article, there are toooooo many unknowns for me to make an intervention...TAKE COVER, OBSERVE, PREPARE TO DEFEND MYSELF, CALL 911...jmo
Sometimes in life you have to stand your ground. It's a hard lesson to learn and even most adults don't get it, but in the end only I can be responsible for my life. If faced with any type of adversity, only I can overcome it. Waiting for someone else to take responsibility is a long fruitless wait.
Yep, we don't have enough info to know or even guess whether or not the concealed carrier was justified. We can't tell from the story if their are any innocents involved here. Our concealed carrier however may have seen something that clarified that for him. If this were the case I can only assume the police are aware of it & withholding that information from the press so as not to taint a jury pool. Personally, unless I knew for sure that there was an innocent involved, I wouldn't get involved if I could help it.
As far as the cuffs go, if he had to draw his weapon i can see where he might want to restrain also. It does, however require some training & even with it we would be better off holding the perp at gunpoint until LEOs arrive. I can just see the perp suing me later for hurting him unnecessarily. That however has its own risks for which we all need to be prepared. Risks either way. I think I would prefer to take my risks with the trained LEOs.
Glad everything turned out like it did and 2 badguys off the street.
"We are Texas Rangers sent by the Governor Himself and our jurisdiction is anywhere we happen to be." Agustus McCrae
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NRA Member S&W M&P .40, Glock 17, Glock 19, Glock 22
Thanks everybody for responding. I'll update soon as I get new information.
Skyway shooting update: Victim has record, citizen fired once, suspect used .22
The 53-year-old victim in Saturday night’s high-profile Skyway shooting incident in which an armed citizen intervened and took down the suspect has a criminal record that includes residential burglary and malicious mischief, but the suspected gunman had no booking record at the King County Jail, until now.
Skyway shooting update: Victim has record, citizen fired once, suspect used .22 - Seattle gun rights | Examiner.com
Still sounds like a mess.
"I do what I do." Cpl 'coach' Bowden, "Southern Comfort".
"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life."
I find it very telling regarding today's society that more people posting here are concerned about the citizen carrying handcuffs than a firearm. Really? You'd be worried about the perp claiming you hurt him with cuffs, but it's okay to sit there with a gun pointed at him? Never mind the fact that it's much safer and a MUCH better idea to have the perp sitting there in cuffs and your gun put away when the cops arrive than to be the one pointing a weapon at someone when they get there. Does anyone here REALLY believe that cuffs have the potential to cause more damage than a gun? Forgive me for saying so, but that seems like an incredibly ignorant opinion.
Of course, at the same time, I DO agree with the idea that you should be trained to use any defensive tool you carry. Someone carrying and using a tool (gun, cuffs, collapsible baton, etc) they aren't trained to use is a recipe for disaster. I also think that anyone carrying a firearm needs to not only be trained in how to use it, but in the ramifications (local legality, constitutional law regarding firearm use, etc) of using it. How many people are carrying right now that actually fully understand that THEY ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR EVERY ROUND THAT LEAVES THEIR FIREARM? If this guy had hit an innocent bystander with that shot he fired, even though the use of deadly force was authorized, he would have found himself in VERY big trouble, indeed.
I don't know about yall but, I do not carry cuffs with me. I'm not a cop. No need to carry cuffs.
"The value you put on the lost will be determined by the sacrifice you are willing to make to seek them until they are found."