Concealed Carry and Employment Dilemma

This is a discussion on Concealed Carry and Employment Dilemma within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by G19inLV They can't search your car because some jackass said you have a gun in there. Even if you signed a consent ...

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Thread: Concealed Carry and Employment Dilemma

  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by G19inLV View Post
    They can't search your car because some jackass said you have a gun in there. Even if you signed a consent prior to employment that somehow gives them permission, wipe your butt with it than take them to court if they try anything. Despite what they guy above me says, they have no right to search your private property. You think because it's a company policy or something, they have the right? Nope.
    While you are correct, they cannot force you to allow them to search your car. You might as well be emptying your locker as you refuse. You have just assured your termination, and there is nothing you can do about it.
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  3. #17
    VIP Member Array BugDude's Avatar
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    Unfortunately, many of our rights are only guaranteed from government...not your employer. You can refuse the search, but they can also terminate you with no recourse. The 1st amendment guarantees us speech which is free from control by the government. Most large employers are now employing Social Media policies in which you can be fired for what you put on facebook, forums, websites, etc. on your own time with nothing to do with work. So much for free speech. They also have people who monitor the internet for such stuff. Big brother is watching.
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  4. #18
    Senior Member Array Dennis1209's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BugDude View Post
    Unfortunately, many of our rights are only guaranteed from government...not your employer. You can refuse the search, but they can also terminate you with no recourse. The 1st amendment guarantees us speech which is free from control by the government. Most large employers are now employing Social Media policies in which you can be fired for what you put on facebook, forums, websites, etc. on your own time with nothing to do with work. So much for free speech. They also have people who monitor the internet for such stuff. Big brother is watching.
    You are absolutely correct. Jobs are currently hard to get, good jobs are very hard to aquire. It all boils down to risk vs. reward. I retired from the Federal Government and the penalty for having a firearm in your vehicle was automatic termination. Park off the property and sooner or later your vehicle would be stolen and/or broken into. It was the worst part of mid-town St. Louis, and driving the "hood" at night was a high risk.

  5. #19
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    "Big brother is watching" is right. Because this forum is public, I make sure not to post anything that could be remotely construed in the wrong way.

    I encourage you NOT to go against company policy. I'm going to kind of call you out on this one, but another reason you shouldn't conceal at work because is you've posted this thread on a public forum and you list your City and State in your "location", which makes you less anonymous. Now I might get called out for being "paranoid," but I always choose to be on the safe side.
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  6. #20
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    I had a similar problem one time. I spent a weekend creating a hidden compartment in my vehicle that no HR dweeb would have found in the course of a cursory search. I suggest you do that. A compartment small enough to hide a snub .38 would not be hard to create.
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  7. #21
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    Tread lightly before you get too invested in a secret compartment, I've seen motor vehicle codes with anti secret compartment laws, more to compound the charges against drug runners but if it's worded right and an LEO finds it on your commute you may have some explaining to do.

    I'd be writing your political representatives and state carry advocates and maybe even the NRA to lobby for the parking lot protection (assuming PA doesn't have it, I'm surprised nobody has chimed in yet), then you've got some legal protection if it's stored in the car. Also may want to see if "corporate" is in a state that has parking lot protection, and would consider changing their policies to meet that (no need to mention carry, the hunting cause is a good one, or even if competitive shooting is a hobby and it would make your fridays easier and put them in better standing) Also take a look at how many of the states the company does business in have such parking lot carry laws. Kind of like when states update a law and it takes cities time to comply, it might be worth getting the ball rolling if you can establish a precedent and provide a non-threatening cause; it's not that you want to carry at work where the anti's jump to shooting up the place, but you want to look out for the companies interests and update the policy to make your weekends more relaxing, afterall you'll show up on Monday more refreshed. It takes some serious diplomacy to do without sticking your neck on the chopping block, but in your position, I'd assume you have it.

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  8. #22
    VIP Member Array smolck's Avatar
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    As I have said before, no way I would sacrifice my own safety (and rights) based on some stupid company policy. I would carry anyways (likely in a kangaroo carry or something super deep cover) and if I ever had to use my gun and got fired, well, at least I'd live to find another job. Your other choice is to quit. Your commute seems excessive anyways, find something closer to home and the money you save on gas can buy more ammo and new guns!
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  9. #23
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    People think it's just that easy to "find another job". It's not. Don't risk it in the first place. If you need your job, don't do anything to jeopardize it. That would be stupid. Just about every company has a "no weapons" clause in their rules. If you agree to work for them, then you agree to the rules. My company has the same no weapons rule too, so I choose to leave my weapon at home. I don't have a choice. It's not worth losing my job over. I cannot afford to be unemployed again. It almost ruined me the last time. Besides, future employers will ask why you left your last position....ummmm....because they found a gun in my vehicle? There goes your chances for any future employment too.

  10. #24
    Senior Member Array canav844's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cuckoo429 View Post
    People think it's just that easy to "find another job". It's not. Don't risk it in the first place. If you need your job, don't do anything to jeopardize it. That would be stupid. Just about every company has a "no weapons" clause in their rules. If you agree to work for them, then you agree to the rules. My company has the same no weapons rule too, so I choose to leave my weapon at home. I don't have a choice. It's not worth losing my job over. I cannot afford to be unemployed again. It almost ruined me the last time. Besides, future employers will ask why you left your last position....ummmm....because they found a gun in my vehicle? There goes your chances for any future employment too.
    Nothing wrong with seeking new opportunities; and nothing wrong with job hunting while you're still employed, as long as they don't contact the current employer without a conditional offer ready. As the OP is a manager it's a safe assumption he need not be blunt about a final straw if he were to look somewhere else; and you can always say that you had concern for your personal safety; which if the OP didn't he wouldn't be posting here. Again, I'd bet the policy is outdated and was put in for liability, and adjusting it to meet state laws around the nation would serve an equal liability protection.

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  11. #25
    VIP Member Array BugDude's Avatar
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    You could simply requested an exception in writing and state your reasons. That way, it doesn't necessitate them having to revamp the entire policy for the entire company (which may be much more of an uphill battle that you are less likely to win). Find out who is responsible for the policy, explain you have an hour plus commute through bad areas, and that you go places between work and home, and you also have a concealed carry permit that you completed training and background checks to get. The risk is if you ask and they say no, then you're on the radar screen so to speak. I took that chance with my employer and was fortunate in that I was granted said written exception.
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  12. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by TN_Mike View Post
    I had a similar problem one time. I spent a weekend creating a hidden compartment in my vehicle that no HR dweeb would have found in the course of a cursory search. I suggest you do that. A compartment small enough to hide a snub .38 would not be hard to create.
    Bingo! We have a 'winner' here.
    It depends a bit on what kind of vehicle, but one can find or create an undetectable space large enough for a firearm...EASILY done.
    Last edited by RETSUPT99; August 20th, 2011 at 03:06 PM.
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  13. #27
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    I don't see anything referencing your rights in the parking lot. Thankfully the new Wisconsin CC law expressly denies any company the right to do anything to any employee with a CC permit who keeps their firearm in their vehicle.

    It sounds like an addendum needs to be added the Pennsylvania law.

  14. #28
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    Everyone seems to be talking about if HR has the right to search the car. I don't think that's really the point. I think the question that first has to be answered is if PA is a right to hire state. If it IS then what HR has the right to do is irrelevant. That can ask to search your car and if you don't let them they can fire you and there's not a thing your going to be able to do in court. If PA ISN'T a right to hire state then you have a lot more wiggle room. Answer that question first and then go from there.
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  15. #29
    VIP Member Array Rollo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by canav844 View Post
    and nothing wrong with job hunting while you're still employed, as long as they don't contact the current employer without a conditional offer ready. .
    My dad once told me "Son, the best time to look for a job is when you don't need one"
    -It is a seriously scary thought that there are subsets of American society that think being intellectual is a BAD thing...

  16. #30
    Senior Member Array jem102's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by archer51 View Post
    While you are correct, they cannot force you to allow them to search your car. You might as well be emptying your locker as you refuse. You have just assured your termination, and there is nothing you can do about it.
    Unfortunately this is correct. You will be terminated for your refusal to allow the search by the "policy" you agreed to and your state unemployment commission will stand with the company. This has been court tested many times across the nation.
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