Write up on Carson City IHOP

Write up on Carson City IHOP

This is a discussion on Write up on Carson City IHOP within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Here is a link to Gabe's article on the Carson City IHOP shooting. So this was the latest event - Seven people were shot inside ...

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Thread: Write up on Carson City IHOP

  1. #1
    Distinguished Member Array Bill MO's Avatar
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    Write up on Carson City IHOP

    Here is a link to Gabe's article on the Carson City IHOP shooting.

    So this was the latest event -

    Seven people were shot inside of a Carson City, Nevada, IHOP. Four died on scene. The gunman, Eduardo Sencion, as often happens, died of the self-inflicted wound to the head. Same story, different characters and location. What was telling about this one is a statement made by a witness to the event.

    "The owner of the BBQ across the street had a clear shot of him walking into the IHOP after he killed the lady motorcycle rider but didn’t take it, citing "it was a pistol against an AK, what was I going to do?""

    Now, I will bet this article is going to be super controversial. But in the vast majority of these events, the bad guy will either kill himself when he is done, or is eventually captured by the victims who could not take it anymore and charge the gunman while he is distracted in some manner. But until either one of those things happen, the killing continues.

    There are arguments about inaction due to uncertainty, and fear of getting into aftermath trouble with the authorities. I would submit that the image of a man shooting people with a rifle is fairly conclusive and informative about what is going on. There are also arguments about getting involved. The usual story goes something like “I carry my CCW to defend me only”.

    WARRIOR TALK NEWS - Active Shooter - Carson City IHOP
    It's gotta be who you are, not a hobby. reinman45

    "Is this persons bad behavior worth me having to kill them over?" Guantes


  2. #2
    Member Array Timezoneguy's Avatar
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    Sad but true. A shot from across the street with a handgun?? Well I doubt I would attempt that shot. The best scenario is someone very close to the shooter making a shot that stops the attack. Hopefully as these sensless attacks continue somegood guy with a legal gun will reduce the killing. Media will not give proper credit but bad guys will notice. We all need to carry everywhere!
    In a gun fight, you can not miss fast enough, to catch up.

  3. #3
    VIP Member Array Majorlk's Avatar
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    Interesting article. It does provoke some thought.

    It is true that for the average shooter a 100 yard shot is rather iffy, but it might be enough to distract the shooter and give time for others to take cover, especially if it hits the shooter.
    An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life. - Robert A. Heinlein

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    Member Array cptsdr's Avatar
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    So, what I'm getting here is: If you don't involve yourself in an active shooter situation 100 yards away, you are less of a man.
    Is that the point of the article?
    FW21

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    I'm still a "Witness – Non Combatant" in that situation. 100 yrds - BG armed with a AK-47. I'm not taking those odds and I'm not ashamed to admit it.
    I'd respect any "Combatant" in that situation, but its not for me.
    jem102 and 9MMare like this.

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    VIP Member Array oakchas's Avatar
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    Indeed an interesting, thought provoking article.

    I have a higher calling than the approval of lesser men,. . .
    Hmmm... Sorry, I don't have the shot. Now, would I run towards the action? Hmmm... I can sorta run. Maybe if I just call him out like Matt Dillon? My 14 round 9x18 against his AK... die a hero, and everybody who's gonna die that day is gonna die, too.

    Yeah, there are smart, combative ways to take this guy out... and I might try some of them... but I'm outta range to start with, so I might not get there in time. But I might try. I don't know until I see it happen.
    baren likes this.
    Rats!
    It could be worse!
    I suppose

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    Good article and it certainly brings light to some recent incidents. The Tucson shooting involved a conceal carry guy that couldn't take the shot. Not sure of the details but this is happening as more people carry. The sad truth is that liability does influence the decision based on circumstances.
    jem102 likes this.
    “Monsters are real and so are ghosts. They live inside of us, and sometimes they win.”
    ~ Stephen King

  8. #8
    VIP Member Array Guantes's Avatar
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    I would attempt to intervene. The method of that intervention would be dictated by specific circumstances at the time.

    I perceive a number of points in the article. Some obvious, others more subtle.
    "I do what I do." Cpl 'coach' Bowden, "Southern Comfort".

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    Member Array tmarks11's Avatar
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    Lots of people over at that other site volunteering that they would take the shot at 100 yards... But when you miss, where is your bullet going? The scenario needs more information. It isn't as black and white as it sounds on face value.

    The guy has an AK47? Does he also have body armor? Can you tell from 100 yards away? Center of mass might not be the answer, and that might be all you have with a handgun from 100 yards... If you are lucky or good or both.
    9MMare and Tzadik like this.

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    VIP Member Array zacii's Avatar
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    Let's not forget that it's a moving target, also.

    A very difficult shot to make, at that moment.

    If I were inclined to act, which I don't think I would due to the over-abundance of crap in my pants, some covert move to get closer would be in order.

    This is becoming a regular occurrence, so perhaps some specialized training for active shooter scenes ought to be in our repertoire.
    Trust in God and keep your powder dry

    "A heavily armed citizenry is not about overthrowing the government; it is about preventing the government from overthrowing liberty. A people stripped of their right of self defense is defenseless against their own government." -source

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    VIP Member Array oakchas's Avatar
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    Active shooter, 100 yards away... Man, hard to get there in time, if he's goin' in. Don't know what I'd do... but I already said that.
    Rats!
    It could be worse!
    I suppose

  12. #12
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    Head shot at 100 yards with a handgun. I'm afraid for most of us it is only going to focus his attention on us. Body shot is quite doable, but if he's wearing any type of body armor your wasting rounds. If I have the opportunity for a viable shot I'll take it, but I am not going to throw my life away.
    Holdcard likes this.
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    VIP Member Array zacii's Avatar
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    More discussion here


    I am reminded of a thread where there was a hypothetical scenario of a hostage shot at 15 yards.

    Some people are capable of this shot, but there is more that one way to skin a cat. True, he may be wearing body armor, but some sufficient CoM hits may well create a diversion. Think tactics and results, not necessarily gear and tools.

    The shooter went on this rampage because he wanted to die. Give him what he wants, but don't let him take the innocents with him.
    Trust in God and keep your powder dry

    "A heavily armed citizenry is not about overthrowing the government; it is about preventing the government from overthrowing liberty. A people stripped of their right of self defense is defenseless against their own government." -source

  14. #14
    Distinguished Member Array Bill MO's Avatar
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    I see this as I don't have to kill him to win, only hold him in the parking lot until the GGs show. I would like to be closer than 100 yds but if that did not work even if I could not hit him maybe I can keep him behind cover. Yes every round I fire has my name on it but I don't see having a war here only keeping him away from the masses. I would need cover from an AK to do this, his accuracy would be better with the rifle than mine with a pistol.

    Being there this all would most likely change, but since this shooting has happened I have thought on it a lot. I am glad I have because now I know I will have to do something if I ever find myself in this situation. I don't think I could live with myself knowing I just walked away and did nothing.

    Yes you may have a lot to live for, wife, kids and all but what would life be like if you lost your will to live after you walked away and let others be slaughtered. (there are worse things than death) You can say it would not bother me, don't be so sure. You have not gone through it.

    You say I'm not trained and don't know what or how to do it. Maybe we all need to train and get better prepard, these type of things seem to be happening more everyday.

    Just like what gun we carry along with what ammo, what caliber, how much we practice or train and just how we do it is something we all need to choose. Getting involved or not in a fight is personal too.
    It's gotta be who you are, not a hobby. reinman45

    "Is this persons bad behavior worth me having to kill them over?" Guantes

  15. #15
    VIP Member Array oakchas's Avatar
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    Bill, I agree... to a point. I train for the immediate close encounter of the dangerous kind. That is the most likely occurence in which I am likely to have to use my weapon. That situation, I NEED to ace.

    We've done some scenarios on here of active shooters and I've learned a lot from them.... But have I trained for them? Nope, except for the mental filing of the great responses.

    That is not to say I wouldn't DO anything. and it would maybe (yes maybe) be more than call 911 and be a good witness... And, I agree that the emotional aftermath of not doing anything might be worse than dying. But, as they say, "A man's got to know his limitations." I don't know what mine are in a scenario like this.

    I am intelligent, I am not a coward, I have some common sense... all of these, I suppose, will get one through a situation like this. But the ability to do much depends entirely upon the scene as it plays out. I'm the type of fool that runs toward the fire to try to help... I just hope those tendencies listed above keep me alive and able to stop (or as you mention, slow down) the threat.

    We cannot train for every scenario... but we can train ourselves to adapt what we do know... and hope that it is enough.
    Hoganbeg, limatunes and baren like this.
    Rats!
    It could be worse!
    I suppose

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