This is a discussion on Security searches within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by gunsnroses
You have been to a Oakland Raider game I assume? lol
Hey! Raiders fan here!!!
Anyhow, the "security" stuff at these ...
October 7th, 2011 09:26 AM
Hey! Raiders fan here!!!
Originally Posted by gunsnroses
Anyhow, the "security" stuff at these venues are basically what folks have said, it's just a show to make the patrons feel good. If someone wants a weapon in there bad enough, they will find a way to bring one in.
"A Smith & Wesson always beats 4 aces!"
The Man Prayer. "Im a man, I can change, if I have to.....I guess!" ~ Red Green
October 7th, 2011 10:35 AM
I agree that most security check points are to "look" good. I went to a BSU game the other day. I did not carry. Some 18 year old girl checked me through. Used the back of her hand and touched both of my front pockets. That's it. Oh they did want to see under my hat. My point is and remains "if you will not allow me to protect myself who will?" No one seems to have an answer for me.
In a gun fight, you can not miss fast enough, to catch up.
October 7th, 2011 11:36 AM
As others have said, the security "searches" are a joke, and are primarily "eye candy" to make the unaware "feel good that something is being done to keep them safe"!!!
What really irks me is that the people in power are so uptight about being "politically correct" about not offending anyone by "profiling", that they will insist on patting down a 6 year old kid just because they are the "x th" person through the line, but will let a late 20ish-early 30ish young male of obvious middle eastern origin pass thru because they are the "n th" person in line and it isn't their number to be patted down, and we might offend them if we pulled them out of line because that would be racial profiling!!!!
My wife, who is a 61 year old grandmother, has been searched (I guess she must look like an Irish terrorist because she has red hair) while much more likely looking suspects have been passed through security at the airport without being searched! I guess it is OK to offend a caucasian grandmother, but we musn't offend anyone who has a darker complexion! That would be profiling! But last I heard, it wasn't any little old grandma who hijacked any planes or had bombs in their underwear! Done with rant.
Live to ride, ride to live. Harley Road King
And keep a .45 handy
Kimber Custom TLE II
October 7th, 2011 07:15 PM
Yes, security disarms bad-guys and you're not a bad guy but how would you expect anyone else would know that. Hence security searches. Liberty is for everyone - and a country paralyzed by terrorist attacks is not free, nor is freedom for you from all screening or other regulations to do with public safety freedom for everyone else. You don't get the exemption. Everyone does. Including bad guys. This is nation of relative freedom for the individual that does not include doing whatever is desired no matter what - the result being that everyone can enjoy basic freedom. If you want absolute freedom, have a nation of one.
Originally Posted by SIGguy229
October 8th, 2011 01:45 AM
How are you defining "liberty"? Seriously. Why do you believe these searches will keep you safe? "This is a nation of relative freedom"??? Where did you get that from? It appears there is no logic to your illogical reasoning. We have no common ground to continue this debate. It appears you want to abdicate all responsibility for the safety and security of you and your family to some person with a tin badge with a veneer of authority, versus doing it yourself. Then why carry a gun (if you really do)? Because if you truly believe what you say, then there should be security posted everywhere you go? Right? Is that how you define liberty?
Originally Posted by walleye
- know the differencemartyr
is a fancy name for crappy fighterYou have never lived until you have almost died. For those that have fought for it, life has a special flavor the protected will never know
October 8th, 2011 03:18 AM
Relative individual freedom means there are laws, procedures, rules, voted on and established by many other individuals so everyone has rights. That includes the Amendments which establish basic rights, but not the right to to violate others rights, so "Crying Fire in a crowded room is not acceptable" etc., nor is there absolute freedom from search of one's property if police hear gunshots inside - and so on. This is the system. Checks, balances, no entity: Congress, nor the Supreme Court, nor the Executive, nor the People's momentary will - none have total and absolute right over the others. And no person has absolute rights to do whatever they want once that endangers others' rights, - So, whatever you think of security screenings at huge public gatherings or access points to transportation - imagining this violates your rights is not true - because there is much evidence that grave danger to the many has resulted and may continue to do so from ignoring security in such places.
Originally Posted by SIGguy229
Read about the Constitution.
Last edited by walleye; October 8th, 2011 at 04:26 AM.
October 8th, 2011 05:09 AM
Originally Posted by gunsnroses
"The gun is the great equalizer... For it is the gun, that allows the meek to repel the monsters; Whom are bigger, stronger and without conscience, prey on those who without one, would surely perish."
October 8th, 2011 06:41 AM
Walleye said it well-it may be dumb at times but it is what we have to deal with possible violence. Bottom line as CDW said--You don't like it, don't go. If you decide that the search is ridiculous, which they usually are, and decide that you are special and know better--accept the consequences of violating the requirement. Can you change the mindset? Can any of us really change the mindset? Probably not, so grin and bear it---its the rules and its the law depending on the venue and the location.
October 8th, 2011 08:51 AM
I choose not to participate in this TSA style dog and pony.Hopefully there are enough like minded people that agree and don't attend thus hitting these airlines, football franchises and the like in their wallets to the point where they fail or wise up.The politically correct "grin and bear it "mentality is the precise reason why our rights have been eroded for the past 30 years or so.We either stand up now or become compliant socialists
October 8th, 2011 09:58 AM
I went through airport security the other day, after passing through the body scanner I was shaking my left wrist where my watch was cause the sticking of the watch due to sweat bothers me. Apparently this raises a suspicion because not long after I heard over the radio from the nearest TSA agent by me to check my lower arm. She asked to see my watch and that was that.
October 8th, 2011 10:08 AM
I'm with Tim. If I have to submit to a frisk in order to be there, I really don't need to be there.
October 8th, 2011 10:27 AM
What a pant load...compliant socialists ;<). This is the new American game; How many buzzwords can you fit into one paragraph?
Originally Posted by Tim L
As with most reactionaries, "you keep using that word, but I do not think it means what you think it means." Perhaps you meant fascism, which might come closer to describing the security theater since 9/11. What astounds me is that the people who are currently calling this security theater names (even when they misuse them) tend to be the same people who clamored for such searches, wiretaps and other instructions when they were in a panic after 9/11. Why didn't "we" stand up a decade ago? What has changed? Is it the passage of time and growing complacency? Are we back to our illusion of invulnerability? Is it the ubiquitous ADHD of the American populace? Is it a black democrat in office instead of a white New Englander playing Texas cowboy? Is it not the rules, but who is enforcing them?
Problem is that many in this country got "terrorized" just as the terrorists intended and were willing, from 9/12 on, to give over their freedom for a sense of security. That is the goal of terrorism, to cause a country to tear itself down our of fear. Governments of all stripes, consciously or not, use such disasters to increase their reach and, in this case, many Americans demanded it of their leaders. Anyone spoke against it in those early days (as long a Bush was president) was accused of naiveté and treasonous coddling of terrorism, of living in a pre-9/11 world. This has nothing to do with political correctness - in fact, this paranoia that engenders such drama has a decidedly ethnocentric bent to it.
But I do agree with you - refuse to fly, refuse to attend games, refuse to go anywhere that you feel is limiting your rights and intruding on your privacy. I just hope that those who make that choice, as I do, will also not be the first to cry out when the next attack happens.
Freedom is a risky business.
"To predict the behavior of ordinary people in advance, you only have to assume that they will always try to escape a disagreeable situation with the smallest possible expenditure of intelligence." Friedrich Nietzsche
October 8th, 2011 02:39 PM
I said socialism aand I meant Socialism. The current regime is making the hail Mary in the "game" and are hoping that enough people have been cowed or indoctrinated into their way of thinking.History repeats itself and if we don't break the cycle instead of
rolling over we will have given the progressive liberals the socialist utopia they have been building since the sixties.Freedom isn't near as risky as acceptance.
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