Applebees in Ohio posting no guns! Need your activism ASAP - Page 3

Applebees in Ohio posting no guns! Need your activism ASAP

This is a discussion on Applebees in Ohio posting no guns! Need your activism ASAP within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by pleasantguywhopacks Add places that serve..if you ignore the signage ie: "concealed means concealed" and get caught you're done owning a gun. I ...

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Thread: Applebees in Ohio posting no guns! Need your activism ASAP

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by pleasantguywhopacks View Post
    Add places that serve..if you ignore the signage ie: "concealed means concealed" and get caught you're done owning a gun.
    I haven't been able to find that. Do you know the particular section of the Ohio Revised Code which governs that now?


  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike1956 View Post
    I haven't been able to find that. Do you know the particular section of the Ohio Revised Code which governs that now?
    ORC 2923.121

    (E) Whoever violates this section is guilty of illegal possession of a firearm in a liquor permit premises. Except as otherwise provided in this division, illegal possession of a firearm in a liquor permit premises is a felony of the fifth degree. If the offender commits the violation of this section by knowingly carrying or having the firearm concealed on the offender’s person or concealed ready at hand, illegal possession of a firearm in a liquor permit premises is a felony of the third degree.
    It is illegal because they post.
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  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by pleasantguywhopacks View Post
    Ahh but there is the rub. Their house "Apple American" is saying they post all their franchises. They don't. They can't. Some states don't have force of law that allows it. They are just picking ones in Ohio and saying no. The franchisee is being disingenous in their statement of why. Saying uniformity of policy.

    If your OK with that then fine.
    Anti gun and liars, seems to go hand in hand. And yes Im fine with it.
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  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by bbqgrill View Post
    Regardless, eat elsewhere, Applebee's is a poor excuse for a dining establishment.
    It tickles me that when any restaurant is involved with a firearms dispute, the first posting people start making on the subject is the establishment's food is lousy. I'd love for just once to see someone say, it doesn't matter if I can carry there or not, I love their food.

    I know this statement is heresy on this forum, but whether or not I can carry in a particular restaurant is NOT the determining factor on my decision to eat there.

    FWIW, I have not seen any posted Applebee's in Connecticut - or any other chain restaurants, for that matter.
    Last edited by Majorlk; October 17th, 2011 at 04:06 PM.
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  5. #35
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    If no voice is expressed nothing will change in any thing. We should voice ourselves to buisnesses that discriminate.

    Boy that worked well in California for the OC movement. I do wish you the best in your mission but I have to agree their house, their rules whether it is one store or 300 and they are right across the street from each other, they have the right to say no weapons allowed.

    Toorop be me to the punch. Personally I think you would have a tough time winning that battle in court. You chose to enter an establishment knowing you could not carry a firearm. You are injured in the commision of a crime and now you want to sue the restaurant that YOU CHOSE to enter. Good luck with that.
    "A first rate man with a third rate gun is far better than the other way around". The gun is a tool, you are the craftsman that makes it work. There are those who say "if I had to do it, I could" yet they never go out and train to do it. Don't let stupid be your mindset. Harryball 2013

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by tacman605 View Post
    If no voice is expressed nothing will change in any thing. We should voice ourselves to buisnesses that discriminate.

    Boy that worked well in California for the OC movement. I do wish you the best in your mission but I have to agree their house, their rules whether it is one store or 300 and they are right across the street from each other, they have the right to say no weapons allowed.

    Toorop be me to the punch. Personally I think you would have a tough time winning that battle in court. You chose to enter an establishment knowing you could not carry a firearm. You are injured in the commision of a crime and now you want to sue the restaurant that YOU CHOSE to enter. Good luck with that.
    Yeah but apathy in the general gunrights camp I blame that one on. Darn shame.

    I'll add that I wrote the tourism dept and the Govenor saying ban OC and I will never spend a dollar there. I will not either. I did make it a point to contact them with my displeasure.
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  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by pleasantguywhopacks View Post
    ORC 2923.121



    It is illegal because they post.
    That looks to me like the old law, before the recent changes.

    Here is the law dealing with posted premises:

    (3) (a) Except as provided in division (C)(3)(b) of this section, the owner or person in control of private land or premises, and a private person or entity leasing land or premises owned by the state, the United States, or a political subdivision of the state or the United States, may post a sign in a conspicuous location on that land or on those premises prohibiting persons from carrying firearms or concealed firearms on or onto that land or those premises. Except as otherwise provided in this division, a person who knowingly violates a posted prohibition of that nature is guilty of criminal trespass in violation of division (A)(4) of section 2911.21 of the Revised Code and is guilty of a misdemeanor of the fourth degree. If a person knowingly violates a posted prohibition of that nature and the posted land or premises primarily was a parking lot or other parking facility, the person is not guilty of criminal trespass in violation of division (A)(4) of section 2911.21 of the Revised Code and instead is subject only to a civil cause of action for trespass based on the violation.
    ORC 2923.126

    Did you notice that at the top of 2923.121 it says

    (A) No person shall possess a firearm in any room in which any person is consuming beer or intoxicating liquor in a premises for which a D permit has been issued under Chapter 4303. of the Revised Code or in an open air arena for which a permit of that nature has been issued.

    (B)(1) This section does not apply to any of the following:...

    (e) Any person who is carrying a valid license or temporary emergency license to carry a concealed handgun issued to the person under section 2923.125 or 2923.1213 of the Revised Code or a license to carry a concealed handgun that was issued to the person by another state with which the attorney general has entered into a reciprocity agreement under section 109.69 of the Revised Code , as long as the person is not consuming beer or intoxicating liquor or under the influence of alcohol or a drug of abuse.
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  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by DepOne View Post
    One consideration you may not have thought of; if I were injured in one of your restaurants and had been prohibited from eating there unless I left my gun in my car, I would probably own that building and real estate in a short period of time, and I would advise other customers present that they could probably join me in the suit.
    You are living in a dream world. There is no case law, that I have seen, that requires a restaurant to provide protection to its patrons. Such "threats" generally result in the letter/email being thrown in the trash with no further consideration. I know that's what I would do if I received such an email.
    An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life. - Robert A. Heinlein

  9. #39
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    My bad.

    You still loose your CHL for knowing violating the sign. It's a M1 that gets your CHL pulled. You are correct on the disabilty.
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  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Majorlk View Post
    You are living in a dream world. There is no case law, that I have seen, that requires a restaurant to provide protection to its patrons.
    Correct, Ohio specifically says either way you can't sue. So if they say its our insurance saying it then that is a bunch of crap.

    Now the insurance agency can say no employees can carry and us issue a policy.
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  11. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by pleasantguywhopacks View Post
    My bad.

    You still loose your CHL for knowing violating the sign. It's a M1 that gets your CHL pulled. You are correct on the disabilty.
    I just found this. Here is what OFCC said about it here:Ohio Restaurant Carry law effective as of midnight 9/30/2011

    " Restaurant carry is now lawful for concealed carry licensees and reciprocal permits/licenses.
    - Substantial relaxed changes to the transport of a firearm in a vehicle are now effective law in Ohio.

    Remember, and further teach these points to anyone you discuss this issue with:

    You may not consume alcohol while carrying a firearm in a Class D facility. Its a FELONY.
    Private property signs prevail as they would anywhere else.
    However, when it comes to a private property business that is not a government entity, day care, school, or church - remember that you must knowingly violate a "No Guns" sign to be breaking any laws when it comes to private property.

    If you discover you've unwittingly entered a "posted" facility simply leave, or leave and come back unarmed. Do not feel obligated to hunt down or find signs in private property businesses - they must be posted conspicously and you must KNOW that the sign is there or a policy exists.

    (The belief that you must ask or hunt down a lack of a sign's existance is a recently frequent misunderstanding of the law)

    If you entered such a posted business unwittingly, you did not "knowingly" violate a law. However, once you become aware or if you are verbally advised, you must rectify the situation immediately."

    This makes it seem as though the same governance which applies to all posted private property now applies in taverns.

  12. #42
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    Try unwittingly entering these Applebees. The sign is eye level right by the door on a 8"x12" Ghost buster type quoting the ORC section on posting sign. Your gonna loose that argument if you try it in court.

    It is true if they (owner/manager/employee) ask you to leave you must, however, if LEO just happened to be there and finds you carrying with out the resturant knowing you're there he doesn't need them to charge you with the M1. The criminal charge can be made with out their consent.

    It is better to use pressure to get them to pull the sign IMO.
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  13. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harryball View Post
    When your in someone elses home you should follow there rules. Its been the law of the land and will continue to be. You should find another establishment to eat in...
    In Ohio, we have had some success in getting posted businesses to remove their gunbuster signs. But, it took letters, phone calls, e-mails, and FTF talks with owners/managers as to why we were "voting with our feet". If I decide to not patronize a store because of their anti-gun stance, IMHO, I'm wasting a big opportunity if I don't TELL THEM WHY THEY ARE LOSING MY BUSINESS.
    Chief1297 likes this.

  14. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gforty View Post
    In Ohio, we have had some success in getting posted businesses to remove their gunbuster signs. But, it took letters, phone calls, e-mails, and FTF talks with owners/managers as to why we were "voting with our feet". If I decide to not patronize a store because of their anti-gun stance, IMHO, I'm wasting a big opportunity if I don't TELL THEM WHY THEY ARE LOSING MY BUSINESS.
    I feel exactly the same way. If you are silent nothing will change a mind. What changes minds is thousands of phone calls and email servers jammed to capacity. It work for Kroger. They begged for the protest to stop.
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  15. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by pleasantguywhopacks View Post
    Try unwittingly entering these Applebees. The sign is eye level right by the door on a 8"x12" Ghost buster type quoting the ORC section on posting sign. Your gonna loose that argument if you try it in court.

    It is true if they (owner/manager/employee) ask you to leave you must, however, if LEO just happened to be there and finds you carrying with out the resturant knowing you're there he doesn't need them to charge you with the M1. The criminal charge can be made with out their consent.

    It is better to use pressure to get them to pull the sign IMO.
    Criminal trespassing is an M4, not an M1. Aggravated criminal trespassing is the M1, and is as follows:
    "2911.211 Aggravated trespass.
    (A) No person shall enter or remain on the land or premises of another with purpose to commit on that land or those premises a misdemeanor, the elements of which involve causing physical harm to another person or causing another person to believe that the offender will cause physical harm to him.

    (B) Whoever violates this section is guilty of aggravated trespass, a misdemeanor of the first degree.

    Effective Date: 11-05-1992"

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