"Don't be a victim of your own mistakes, Shoot or Don't Shoot"

This is a discussion on "Don't be a victim of your own mistakes, Shoot or Don't Shoot" within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by Fitch That would have been a mistake. You have a right to use deadly force when being attacked, when the threat of ...

Page 3 of 7 FirstFirst 1234567 LastLast
Results 31 to 45 of 93
Like Tree28Likes

Thread: "Don't be a victim of your own mistakes, Shoot or Don't Shoot"

  1. #31
    VIP Member
    Array Hopyard's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Disappeared
    Posts
    11,546
    Quote Originally Posted by Fitch View Post
    That would have been a mistake. You have a right to use deadly force when being attacked, when the threat of death or grave bodliy injury is imminant. When they are running away, the threat is over. Period. What happened before is over. You may be wounded, but they are done attacking, and your justification to use deadly force left with them.

    Fitch
    That is a surmise and speculation. I agree it wouldn't be wise to shoot, but the idea that their having backed away a mere 20 ft indicates the attack is over seems speculative and potentially deadly. How long does it take to cover 20 feet? We all know the answer, and that pack (if the story is true) knew they hurt the OP; maybe they would have come back once he was down to finish the job?

    Sometimes there are no good answers to things. If he had not been wounded at all, then absolutely there was no need to shoot. Having been badly hurt, there remained substantial risk, to say nothing of a necessity to stop very dangerous people.

    I know the law doesn't always play fair; and I too doubt this would have played out well for the OP had he fired, but still.... maybe the law needs a little tweaking.
    BkCo1 likes this.
    If the Union is once severed, the line of separation will grow wider and wider, and the controversies which are now debated and settled in the halls of legislation will then be tried in fields of battle and determined by the sword.
    Andrew Jackson

  2. Remove Ads

  3. #32
    Senior Member Array bbqgrill's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    In Delaware, East of the Mason Dixon Line.
    Posts
    797
    Does anyone believe in reincarnation of internet legends?
    "To believe that social reforms can eradicate evil altogether is to forget that evil is a protean creature, forever assuming a new shape when deprived of an old one." - SAT

    Never argue with an idiot - they'll bring you down to their level then beat you with experience.

  4. #33
    VIP Member
    Array Mike1956's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Marion County, Ohio
    Posts
    10,057
    Quote Originally Posted by Fitch View Post
    That would have been a mistake. You have a right to use deadly force when being attacked, when the threat of death or grave bodliy injury is imminant. When they are running away, the threat is over. Period. What happened before is over. You may be wounded, but they are done attacking, and your justification to use deadly force left with them.

    Stop the bleeding, call 911, give a good report to the responders, and testify at their trial.

    Shoot while they are running away and most likely go to jail in every state I know of. Timing is everything.

    Fitch
    There is no way of knowing whether these felonious assaulters were running away, or simply doing a momentary tactical retreat. If one has just been knifed, and the cutter hasn't dropped his weapon, raised his hands and screamed "I surrender", it is both prudent and reasonable to assume that the attack has been only momentarily broken off, and will be resumed. They attacked once without provocation. Why would anyone assume they will not do so again?

  5. #34
    Distinguished Member Array 21bubba's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    ky.
    Posts
    1,890
    Quote Originally Posted by bbqgrill View Post
    Does anyone believe in reincarnation of internet legends?
    You don't think... could it be??
    Majorlk likes this.

  6. #35
    Distinguished Member Array jumpwing's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Washington
    Posts
    1,271
    The details of the story must be in here somewhere...

    "The flock sleep peaceably in their pasture at night because Sheepdogs stand ready to do violence on their behalf."
    cafepress.com/bgstudios

  7. #36
    Distinguished Member Array Knightrider's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    MI
    Posts
    1,323
    I just don't know why one would take the time to sign up on a forum and write a story that is 100% grade a bullplop.
    Glock: G22 .40 S&W and G23 .40 S&W Sig Sauer: P938 9mm Smith and Wesson: Model 437 .38 Spl, Model 65 357 Mag, and Sigma SW9VE 9mm

  8. #37
    Senior Member Array bbqgrill's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    In Delaware, East of the Mason Dixon Line.
    Posts
    797
    Quote Originally Posted by Knightrider View Post
    I just don't know why one would take the time to sign up on a forum and write a story that is 100% grade a bullplop.
    Well there is this: http://www.defensivecarry.com/forum/concealed-carry-issues-discussions/130857-code-names-nicknames-your-edc-3.html#post2068326

    and this: http://www.americanrifleman.org/BlogEntry.aspx?id=1786&cid=25 , review the comment section, you decide.

    I believe we are witnesses to reincarnation.
    "To believe that social reforms can eradicate evil altogether is to forget that evil is a protean creature, forever assuming a new shape when deprived of an old one." - SAT

    Never argue with an idiot - they'll bring you down to their level then beat you with experience.

  9. #38
    Member Array paullie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    kansas
    Posts
    348
    I'm callin BS

  10. #39
    VIP Member
    Array Hopyard's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Disappeared
    Posts
    11,546
    BS or not, this is an interesting scenario that is far from out of the ordinary. People get jumped and stabbed at 2 AM with disgusting regularity. So what is allowed in this situation is a valid and important topic.
    If the Union is once severed, the line of separation will grow wider and wider, and the controversies which are now debated and settled in the halls of legislation will then be tried in fields of battle and determined by the sword.
    Andrew Jackson

  11. #40
    Distinguished Member Array Knightrider's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    MI
    Posts
    1,323
    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    BS or not, this is an interesting scenario that is far from out of the ordinary. People get jumped and stabbed at 2 AM with disgusting regularity. So what is allowed in this situation is a valid and important topic.
    Popping rounds into someones backside is one thing that isn't allowed in this situation.
    Glock: G22 .40 S&W and G23 .40 S&W Sig Sauer: P938 9mm Smith and Wesson: Model 437 .38 Spl, Model 65 357 Mag, and Sigma SW9VE 9mm

  12. #41
    VIP Member Array MitchellCT's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    I don't post here anymore...Sorry
    Posts
    2,333
    Walked in on a drug deal, eh?

    I see.

    Having represented dealers, their are effectively 2 kinds of drug deals:

    1) A retail street transaction. These are fast, and the people do not hang around. It is a small denomination transaction for a small amount of drugs. I want 3 rocks of crack, I give you 3 $20's and we depart, because the more we hang around the more likely it is that a cop will see us, know you are a scumbag dealer and I am a junkie, and come by, break both our stones, take my fix and your money, and if we are lucky, beat the stuffing out of us and if we aren't, send us to jail where I will have to detox in a pool of sweat and vomit.

    2) Significant weight transaction. These are bags & briefcases of drugs in exchange for "Motivation for killing" amounts of money. You don't walk into this kind of thing, and if you do, you end up being an unidentified corpse in the woods till someone ID's your prints.

    Put simply, I do not believe this story.

    I want to see proof in the form of a police report or a medical report before I accept this account. Redacting names & personal info is fine...but I need independent verification.
    bbqgrill and tacman605 like this.

  13. #42
    Senior Member Array bbqgrill's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    In Delaware, East of the Mason Dixon Line.
    Posts
    797
    Quote Originally Posted by MitchellCT View Post
    Walked in on a drug deal, eh?

    I see.

    Having represented dealers, their are effectively 2 kinds of drug deals:

    1) A retail street transaction. These are fast, and the people do not hang around. It is a small denomination transaction for a small amount of drugs. I want 3 rocks of crack, I give you 3 $20's and we depart, because the more we hang around the more likely it is that a cop will see us, know you are a scumbag dealer and I am a junkie, and come by, break both our stones, take my fix and your money, and if we are lucky, beat the stuffing out of us and if we aren't, send us to jail where I will have to detox in a pool of sweat and vomit.

    2) Significant weight transaction. These are bags & briefcases of drugs in exchange for "Motivation for killing" amounts of money. You don't walk into this kind of thing, and if you do, you end up being an unidentified corpse in the woods till someone ID's your prints.

    Put simply, I do not believe this story.

    I want to see proof in the form of a police report or a medical report before I accept this account. Redacting names & personal info is fine...but I need independent verification.
    Mitchell, I like your input so please, do not hold your breath while you wait for the details.
    "To believe that social reforms can eradicate evil altogether is to forget that evil is a protean creature, forever assuming a new shape when deprived of an old one." - SAT

    Never argue with an idiot - they'll bring you down to their level then beat you with experience.

  14. #43
    Distinguished Member Array AKsrule's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Pennsylvania
    Posts
    1,387
    Quote Originally Posted by Chris356TSW View Post
    Second time I had to use my firearm to prevent a fatal outcome or visit the local Authorities. I was taking my K9 out about 2:00AM because she became ill, I did remember to grab my Model 36 and through it in my pocket I rushed her out and was massaging her tummy when I heard a noise from behind us (not aware of my surroundings, Big Mistake!, I had walked into a drug deal taking place but was paying more attention to the one that cares for me, One of the outstanding druggies reached down attempting to stab my dog cutting me in my left peck with a scaple, the second swipe cut my abdomen just missing my liver by 1/16 of an inch, whhile still doing my best to protect my extremely sick pup from attacking and most iikley killed I was able to grasp my revolver, they saw the flash of the laser and I heard 1 yell get out of here, by the time my firearm was in a position to safely fire they were 20 + feet away running with their backs toward me, SHOOT OR DON'T SHOOT, though I was cut severely the situation had de-esculated and though I most likely would of been cleared by a jury the only choice by Law was don't Shoot, and you have less than a few seconds to choose, do I fire possibly injuring or killing one or both or do I save $100,000.00 in leagle fees or time in jail because I new the immeadiate danger had passed and called mobil 911 who responded within 3 minutes. You must remember to carry is a privledge and shooting a person in the back as they are running away does not put you in eminent danger or life or lim. I am fine my pup is fine and the responding authorities simply stated that very few would have had the thought process down to know that they would have had to take me in for possible homicide or 2nd degree for using my firearm not for self defense but to get even. I am a Certified NRA Instructor and I cannot preach enough to practice, and know the Law, You must know when to shoot and when not to. Remember you have a second if luckey to make all the decissions I made to prevent myself from becoming a criminal. Welcome to California. Shooting at a piece of paper once enough is not practice, Join the IDPA or USPSA or NRA and know your rights. In 40 plus years carrying this was the first time I set myself up to be a victim either by the criminal or the Authorities. Spend a day in your local court housse and see what really happens when you are in front of the attorney, the judge and the bleeding hearts that don't feel we have the right to protect our family or maybe YOU.
    -------------------------
    Glad you're Ok.

    My personal rules....

    1. WHERE you ARE is critical. If you KNOW an area is likely to harbor multiple bad guys DON'T go there unecessarily or LIVE there.

    2. DON'T carry your weapon in public unless you are fully awake AND are prepared to be alert for Human threats.

    3. If you are confronted but can avoid grievous injury or death to yourself or other innocents by retreating DO SO.

    -------
    -SIG , it's What's for Dinner-

    know your rights!
    http://www.handgunlaw.us

    "If I walk in the woods, I feel much more comfortable carrying a gun. What if you meet a bear in the woods that's going to attack you? You shoot it."
    {Bernhard Goetz}

  15. #44
    VIP Member
    Array tacman605's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Arkansas/On the X in Afghanistan
    Posts
    3,031
    What, you mean, OMG he might be lying?

    NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO say it isn't so.
    "A first rate man with a third rate gun is far better than the other way around". The gun is a tool, you are the craftsman that makes it work. There are those who say "if I had to do it, I could" yet they never go out and train to do it. Don't let stupid be your mindset. Harryball 2013

  16. #45
    VIP Member Array MitchellCT's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    I don't post here anymore...Sorry
    Posts
    2,333
    Shades of "The Tactical One" from bladeforums.com circa 1998-2000 (Yes, I'm old...)

Page 3 of 7 FirstFirst 1234567 LastLast

Links

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Search tags for this page

concealed carry mistakes

,
dont carry around your mistakes
,
fines for mistake shooting a doe
,
homicide guatemala
,
if u shoot someone below the waist is it a felony?
,
justifiable homicide aoj
,
masondixon sw9ve
,
mistakes of conceal carry
,
nra don't be a victim
,
s%26w+sd9+9mm reviews
,
shoot or be a victim
,
smith wesson sd9 uspsa
,
to the one that cares for me dog
,
victim of your own mistakes
,
what are charges if you shoot some one in ca and that person is alive and doing very well
Click on a term to search for related topics.