Should NOT have sold my LC9 to buy a .380

Should NOT have sold my LC9 to buy a .380

This is a discussion on Should NOT have sold my LC9 to buy a .380 within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Hey all, Will be selling my Bodyguard 380 to go back to 9mm; the bodyguard is excellent, small, accurate gun and I really like it. ...

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Thread: Should NOT have sold my LC9 to buy a .380

  1. #1
    Ex Member Array MP9NewMexico's Avatar
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    Should NOT have sold my LC9 to buy a .380

    Hey all,

    Will be selling my Bodyguard 380 to go back to 9mm; the bodyguard is excellent, small, accurate gun and I really like it. But I have been doing some research, and have decided that the .380 would likely not protect me against a violent aggressor. Here are my reasons:

    1. http://www.brassfetcher.com/380ACP%2...t%20Report.pdf --- All the tested 380 loads plugged and did not penetrate bone. Considering that the brain, spinal cord, heart, and lungs are protected by bone, that leads me to think that scoring a 'manstopper' hit with a 380 just would not happen. Maybe a chance to nick the aorta, but that's about it.
    2. Average pentration on the loads I research (DPX 80gr, Gold Dot 90gr, Ranger-T 90gr, Critical Defense 90gr, Golden Saber 102gr) was between 7 1/2" to 10". I just don't think that's good enough for self defense. I am 6' , 170 lbs. My torso, front to back, measures 8.5". The heart is at about 4" deep. If a 380 first had to go through an arm (attacker with outstretched arms) I honestly doubt it could pass the arm and have enough energy left to then penetrate my chest, bust through the ribs and tag the heart. And I'm a pretty average sized guy. What if I'm attacked by a bodybuilder, with a thick chest (like my Dad, who's 5'8", 180 lbs of pure muscle with a 10.5" deep chest), or a fatso with manboobs and a potbelly? I don't think 380 would go deep enough.


    So, looks like I'll be going back to an LC9, and am just going to have to try harder to find ways to conceal it.
    Anyway, best to all, stay safe over the holidays!


  2. #2
    Member Array Biggie313's Avatar
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    Simple solution. Dont carry JHP in a .380, used FMJ.
    10thmtn and JerryMac like this.

  3. #3
    Distinguished Member Array DontTreadOnI's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Biggie313 View Post
    Simple solution. Dont carry JHP in a .380, used FMJ.
    +1

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  4. #4
    New Member Array Mcameron's Avatar
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    All the tested 380 loads plugged and did not penetrate bone. Considering that the brain, spinal cord, heart, and lungs are protected by bone, that leads me to think that scoring a 'manstopper' hit with a 380 just would not happen. Maybe a chance to nick the aorta, but that's about it.
    no no no no......

    the article said the rounds failed to EXPAND.....not penetrate......so in essence, the rounds all acted like a FMJ after going through bone.....but they still went through the target.

    hell, the lowly .22lr has enough energy to penetrate bone.....im sure the .380 will have no problem.


    as for your concerns about stopping power.......damn near EVERY hand gun caliber is inadequate to reliably take down a man sized target......
    pfries likes this.

  5. #5
    Ex Member Array Yankeejib's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mcameron View Post
    no no no no......

    damn near EVERY hand gun caliber is inadequate to reliably take down a man sized target......
    All the more reason to go big and go heavy. Mouse guns provide peace of mind, not much else. On the other hand, if you can take out a softball sized piece of flesh from anywhere on the body, you will certainly reduce or eliminate someone's will to continue an attack.
    357and40, BigBaddaBoom and suntzu like this.

  6. #6
    Member Array hoghunter84's Avatar
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    When I first got my Walther PK380 I used it for finishing off a pig. I stepped back to where I would probably shoot an attacker if I had to and placed the shot behind the left ear. The bullet entered and exited thru the right cheek. The bullet went thru a lot of flesh and bone and made a 3 inch wound channel. I would say it penetrated very well and also expanded. You can't beat a test like that using man made materials. Real life tests beat personal assumptions all day.

  7. #7
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    Last guy I saw shot in the head with a .380 was deader than a doornail. He did not get up and complain about the .380 being a pud load, either. He actually stayed dead... Imagine that?

    You can read all about tests and studies in simulated media like water jugs, gelatin, dry wall, whatever until the cows come home. There's no comparison to real life results.

    That said, the .380 isn't my favorite load for defensive use. But I do carry a .380 as a back-up gun almost 100% of the time because of the size of the pistol. I do not carry a .380 as my primary weapon, and likely never will. But I am confident in a pinch, it will get the job done.
    9MMare likes this.
    -Bark'n
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  8. #8
    Member Array BritishAgent's Avatar
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    I like the open mindedness here. I know a certain Concealed Carry Forum that's pretty militant about their anti-mouse gun policy.

    (you can't even talk about them.)

    That said, I still prefer good old 9x19mm. I'd love a Walther PPS, or maybe a Nano after its proving ground stage of life has passed.
    LongGoneDays and steelhawk like this.
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  9. #9
    Distinguished Member Array AZJD1968's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MP9NewMexico View Post
    Hey all,

    Will be selling my Bodyguard 380 to go back to 9mm; the bodyguard is excellent, small, accurate gun and I really like it. But I have been doing some research, and have decided that the .380 would likely not protect me against a violent aggressor. Here are my reasons:

    1. http://www.brassfetcher.com/380ACP%2...t%20Report.pdf --- All the tested 380 loads plugged and did not penetrate bone. Considering that the brain, spinal cord, heart, and lungs are protected by bone, that leads me to think that scoring a 'manstopper' hit with a 380 just would not happen. Maybe a chance to nick the aorta, but that's about it.
    2. Average pentration on the loads I research (DPX 80gr, Gold Dot 90gr, Ranger-T 90gr, Critical Defense 90gr, Golden Saber 102gr) was between 7 1/2" to 10". I just don't think that's good enough for self defense. I am 6' , 170 lbs. My torso, front to back, measures 8.5". The heart is at about 4" deep. If a 380 first had to go through an arm (attacker with outstretched arms) I honestly doubt it could pass the arm and have enough energy left to then penetrate my chest, bust through the ribs and tag the heart. And I'm a pretty average sized guy. What if I'm attacked by a bodybuilder, with a thick chest (like my Dad, who's 5'8", 180 lbs of pure muscle with a 10.5" deep chest), or a fatso with manboobs and a potbelly? I don't think 380 would go deep enough.


    So, looks like I'll be going back to an LC9, and am just going to have to try harder to find ways to conceal it.
    Anyway, best to all, stay safe over the holidays!
    I agree with your decision to go with 9mm for defense. If you choose JHP in .380 you give up penetration, and if you choose FMJ you give up expansion. Why give up any of this then you can choose 9mm. Good Job!
    Stop whining and go do something that makes a difference!
    If you think that I may be talking to you, then I am.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by AZJD1968 View Post
    I agree with your decision to go with 9mm for defense. If you choose JHP in .380 you give up penetration, and if you choose FMJ you give up expansion. Why give up any of this then you can choose 9mm. Good Job!
    And yet there are plenty of cases where people soak up 9mm rounds and only get angry enough to go ahead and kill you. Cases abound where people have been shot 6, 7, 8, 10 times with 9mm and still killed their opponent.

    Likewise can be said with just about any other handgun caliber, although the accounts seem to drop considerably when the caliber goes up into .44 or .45 range.

    Regardless of caliber, the best determining factor seems to be having good shot placement in vital areas. And when your life is on the line, and you are about 2 seconds away from death... I don't care who you are, good shot placement is easier said then actually done.
    rstanek and Quiz like this.
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    "The gun is the great equalizer... For it is the gun, that allows the meek to repel the monsters; Whom are bigger, stronger and without conscience, prey on those who without one, would surely perish."

  11. #11
    VIP Member Array gottabkiddin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MP9NewMexico View Post
    Hey all,

    Will be selling my Bodyguard 380 to go back to 9mm; the bodyguard is excellent, small, accurate gun and I really like it. But I have been doing some research, and have decided that the .380 would likely not protect me against a violent aggressor. Here are my reasons:
    1. .380ACP --- All the tested 380 loads plugged and did not penetrate bone. Considering that the brain, spinal cord, heart, and lungs are protected by bone, that leads me to think that scoring a 'manstopper' hit with a 380 just would not happen. Maybe a chance to nick the aorta, but that's about it.
    2. Average pentration on the loads I research (DPX 80gr, Gold Dot 90gr, Ranger-T 90gr, Critical Defense 90gr, Golden Saber 102gr) was between 7 1/2" to 10". I just don't think that's good enough for self defense. I am 6' , 170 lbs. My torso, front to back, measures 8.5". The heart is at about 4" deep. If a 380 first had to go through an arm (attacker with outstretched arms) I honestly doubt it could pass the arm and have enough energy left to then penetrate my chest, bust through the ribs and tag the heart. And I'm a pretty average sized guy. What if I'm attacked by a bodybuilder, with a thick chest (like my Dad, who's 5'8", 180 lbs of pure muscle with a 10.5" deep chest), or a fatso with manboobs and a potbelly? I don't think 380 would go deep enough.

    So, looks like I'll be going back to an LC9, and am just going to have to try harder to find ways to conceal it.
    Anyway, best to all, stay safe over the holidays!
    I snorted on that one...

    Good points for sure... Do whatcha gotta do until the confidence level is comfortable for ya. Although IMO, a well placed .380 will put ya down without a doubt. Just saying.
    "He that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one." – Luke 22:36

    "If a law is unjust, a man is not only right to disobey it, he is obligated to do so." – Thomas Jefferson

  12. #12
    VIP Member Array BigJon10125's Avatar
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    In regards to concealing your LC9. I use a Crossbreed supertuck @ 4:00. I even use the pinky extension and it conceals great. I usually wear jeans and a t shirt, but actually had a chance to wear it with slacks, a dress shirt and a tie. No one was the wiser. Dont even think my wife noticed, and I was speaking in front of a crowd of about 250.
    BigJon


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  13. #13
    Senior Member Array MotorCityGun's Avatar
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    I'm sittin' here wonderin' why the OP's navatar is MP9NewMexico and yet says s/he wants to go back to a LC9. What happened to his/her MP9?? And, I don't understand what's so difficult about "concealing" a LC9?
    “They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.” - Ben Franklin

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  14. #14
    Ex Member Array MP9NewMexico's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MotorCityGun View Post
    I'm sittin' here wonderin' why the OP's navatar is MP9NewMexico and yet says s/he wants to go back to a LC9. What happened to his/her MP9?? And, I don't understand what's so difficult about "concealing" a LC9?
    MP9 was sold, when I realized it was not a CCW

    As for the "fatso with manboobs" I mean, that's a real thing these days. With 28% of New Mexico's population being obese, and being close to a Native American reservation (where excess weight is a SERIOUS problem, and where crime rates are astronomically high), I feel like it's a serious concern. A good 9mm can get 13-14" while the best 380 struggles for 10". The extra 4" seems like it would be worth it.

    Also, appreciate the SuperTuck suggestion, will have to try that out!

  15. #15
    VIP Member Array gottabkiddin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MP9NewMexico View Post
    MP9 was sold, when I realized it was not a CCW

    As for the "fatso with manboobs" I mean, that's a real thing these days. With 28% of New Mexico's population being obese, and being close to a Native American reservation (where excess weight is a SERIOUS problem, and where crime rates are astronomically high), I feel like it's a serious concern. A good 9mm can get 13-14" while the best 380 struggles for 10". The extra 4" seems like it would be worth it.

    Also, appreciate the SuperTuck suggestion, will have to try that out!
    True, but that depends on the bullet type. FMJ, no problem. Easily 16" to 18" and beyond. Flat nose FMJ in .380, that's the way to go IMO. .. Or, the hot stuff from Buffalo Bore in .380. The 100gr hard cast stuff to be exact..
    QKShooter likes this.
    "He that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one." – Luke 22:36

    "If a law is unjust, a man is not only right to disobey it, he is obligated to do so." – Thomas Jefferson

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