Mall Parking Lot posting (WI)

Mall Parking Lot posting (WI)

This is a discussion on Mall Parking Lot posting (WI) within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; The Bay Park Square Mall in the Green Bay area has recently put up 12" X 18" signs at all of the parking lot entrances ...

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Thread: Mall Parking Lot posting (WI)

  1. #1
    Member Array bassethound's Avatar
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    Mall Parking Lot posting (WI)

    The Bay Park Square Mall in the Green Bay area has recently put up 12" X 18" signs at all of the parking lot entrances stating that weapons are not allowed on the property. As of today, there are no signs posted on the store entrances themselves.

    I am curious as to how the WI law pertains to this, it seems to be a legal posting but I'm looking for opinions by others that might be a little more knowledgeable on the law.

    Here is a snippet from Section 82 of the WI law:
    "b. For the purposes of sub. (1m) (c) 2., an owner or
    occupant of the grounds of a nonresidential building or of
    land has notified an individual not to enter or remain on
    the grounds or land while carrying a firearm or with a particular type of firearm if the owner or occupant has posted
    a sign that is located in a prominent place near all probable access points to the grounds or land to which the
    restriction applies and any individual entering the
    grounds or land can be reasonably expected to see the
    sign"
    "This year will go down in history. For the first time, a civilized nation has full gun registration. Our streets will be safer, our police more efficient, and the world will follow our lead into the future!" - Adolph Hitler, German Chancellor 1933


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    I would not want to be the test case for this. Looks like a legal posting and I would simply take my $$$ elsewhere.
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    VIP Member Array Smitty901's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bassethound View Post
    The Bay Park Square Mall in the Green Bay area has recently put up 12" X 18" signs at all of the parking lot entrances stating that weapons are not allowed on the property. As of today, there are no signs posted on the store entrances themselves.

    I am curious as to how the WI law pertains to this, it seems to be a legal posting but I'm looking for opinions by others that might be a little more knowledgeable on the law.

    Here is a snippet from Section 82 of the WI law:
    "b. For the purposes of sub. (1m) (c) 2., an owner or
    occupant of the grounds of a nonresidential building or of
    land has notified an individual not to enter or remain on
    the grounds or land while carrying a firearm or with a particular type of firearm if the owner or occupant has posted
    a sign that is located in a prominent place near all probable access points to the grounds or land to which the
    restriction applies and any individual entering the
    grounds or land can be reasonably expected to see the
    sign"
    Keep reading you going to find it does not apply to the parking lots. The Mall is a business. This applies to Wisconsin were the OP was from ONLY

  4. #4
    Member Array bassethound's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Smitty901 View Post
    Keep reading you going to find it does not apply to the parking lots. The Mall is a business. This applies to Wisconsin were the OP was from ONLY
    I realize by law that I can have my weapon in my car in their parking lot but I would NOT be able to walk in the parking lot and go into the mall carrying. (how I see it right now but not sure)
    "This year will go down in history. For the first time, a civilized nation has full gun registration. Our streets will be safer, our police more efficient, and the world will follow our lead into the future!" - Adolph Hitler, German Chancellor 1933

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    VIP Member Array Eagleks's Avatar
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    that sucks...... that's a terrible law. Here, no one can post grounds, parks, etc. ... only buildings. Even car garages cannot be posted because they are not considered a building.

    So, can a city just post the sidewalk ? By the way that reads, it appears they could.
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    Member Array bassethound's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eagleks View Post
    that sucks...... that's a terrible law. Here, no one can post grounds, parks, etc. ... only buildings. Even car garages cannot be posted because they are not considered a building.

    So, can a city just post the sidewalk ? By the way that reads, it appears they could.

    Wisconsin state law preempts local ordinances.

    66.0409 Local Regulation of Firearms.
    "(2) Except as provided in subs. (3) and (4), no political subdivision may enact an ordinance or adopt a
    resolution that regulates the sale, purchase, purchase delay, transfer, ownership, use, keeping, possession,
    bearing, transportation, licensing, permitting, registration or taxation of any firearm or part of a firearm,
    including ammunition and reloader components, unless the ordinance or resolution is the same as or similar
    to, and no more stringent than, a state statute"
    "This year will go down in history. For the first time, a civilized nation has full gun registration. Our streets will be safer, our police more efficient, and the world will follow our lead into the future!" - Adolph Hitler, German Chancellor 1933

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    Senior Member Array RightyLefty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bassethound View Post
    I realize by law that I can have my weapon in my car in their parking lot but I would NOT be able to walk in the parking lot and go into the mall carrying. (how I see it right now but not sure)
    From what I understand from the law, the way the mall has there signage posted as you indicated, it only applies to the land and not the building. So yes they could get you for trespassing for carrying outside of your vehicle in the parking lot but if there are no signs near the entrances to the building itself, they are not following the law if they want to keep you from carrying in the building.

    1. In this paragraph, "sign" means a sign that states a restriction imposed under subd. 2. that is at least 5 inches by 7 inches.
    2.
    a. For the purposes of sub. (1m) (c) 1m., an owner of a residence that is not a single-family residence has notified an individual not to enter or remain in a part of that building, or on the grounds of that building, while carrying a firearm or with a particular type of firearm if the owner has posted a sign that is located in a prominent place near all of the entrances to the part of the building to which the restriction applies or near all probable access points to the grounds to which the restriction applies and any individual entering the building or the grounds can be reasonably expected to see the sign.

    am. For the purposes of sub. (1m) (c) 2., 4., and 5., an owner or occupant of a part of a nonresidential building, the state or a local governmental unit, or a university or a college has notified an individual not to enter or remain in a part of the building while carrying a firearm or with a particular type of firearm if the owner, occupant, state, local governmental unit, university, or college has posted a sign that is located in a prominent place near all of the entrances to the part of the building to which the restriction applies and any individual entering the building can be reasonably expected to see the sign.

    b. For the purposes of sub. (1m) (c) 2., an owner or occupant of the grounds of a nonresidential building or of land has notified an individual not to enter or remain on the grounds or land while carrying a firearm or with a particular type of firearm if the owner or occupant has posted a sign that is located in a prominent place near all probable access points to the grounds or land to which the restriction applies and any individual entering the grounds or land can be reasonably expected to see the sign

    Their signs only apply to the land and not the building itself. Just saying. I am not a lawyer though.

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    Member Array bassethound's Avatar
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    Thanks SoleShtr, I think you can see where I'm coming from. I'm not sure the postings at all the parking lot entrances cover the building, therefore I can see that it could be legal to carry in the mall itself but not legal to carry from my vehicle to the building, in effect covering the mall itself.
    "This year will go down in history. For the first time, a civilized nation has full gun registration. Our streets will be safer, our police more efficient, and the world will follow our lead into the future!" - Adolph Hitler, German Chancellor 1933

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    Senior Member Array RightyLefty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bassethound View Post
    Thanks SoleShtr, I think you can see where I'm coming from. I'm not sure the postings at all the parking lot entrances cover the building, therefore I can see that it could be legal to carry in the mall itself but not legal to carry from my vehicle to the building, in effect covering the mall itself.
    Either mall management doesn't know what the law says, or they do know and their policy makes no sense. Because they have no signage at the building entrance, you could legally carry inside and they couldn't do anything about it. But they could wait until you left the building and then bust you. That makes a lot sense if you are trying to have a no weapons policy.

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    Distinguished Member Array Fitch's Avatar
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    I'd be willing to bet that Mall Management consulted an attorney before posting the signs. Not sure the attorney got it right, but I think they are sure they are posting the whole place from street to street including the building by doing what they have done. Are they right? The operative question is, how much do you want to risk and spend to find out? It will take a trial, and maybe appeals to be sure. One thing I'm pretty sure of, nobody here can give the right answer with 100% confidence.

    With that understanding, I'd either take my money someplace else (it can't be the only mall in town, or leave the gun home.

    Fitch
    “The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety), by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary.” by H. L. Mencken

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    Member Array bassethound's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fitch View Post
    I'd be willing to bet that Mall Management consulted an attorney before posting the signs. Not sure the attorney got it right, but I think they are sure they are posting the whole place from street to street including the building by doing what they have done. Are they right? The operative question is, how much do you want to risk and spend to find out? It will take a trial, and maybe appeals to be sure. One thing I'm pretty sure of, nobody here can give the right answer with 100% confidence.

    With that understanding, I'd either take my money someplace else (it can't be the only mall in town, or leave the gun home.

    Fitch
    Well the truth is....it is the only decent mall in Green Bay, WI LOL. I think I will avoid it as best I can and take my business elsewhere.
    "This year will go down in history. For the first time, a civilized nation has full gun registration. Our streets will be safer, our police more efficient, and the world will follow our lead into the future!" - Adolph Hitler, German Chancellor 1933

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    VIP Member Array Smitty901's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bassethound View Post
    I realize by law that I can have my weapon in my car in their parking lot but I would NOT be able to walk in the parking lot and go into the mall carrying. (how I see it right now but not sure)
    You are with in the law to secure it in your car they can not stop you .
    This is in reference to the Wisconsin law only. The OP was relating to Wisconsin
    I would how ever write a letter to each store in the mall and let them know why I would be shopping at other places such as Fleet Farm that welcomes your CC.
    Even has a sign that says so .
    bassethound likes this.

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    Member Array Yupp's Avatar
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    ImageUploadedByTapatalk1328922257.932774.jpg too bad all stores are not like fleet farm.
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    At Fox River Mall, in Appleton, WI, they made a half hearted attempt to post a no weapons sign, on the 2 outer most doors in a row of 6. Makes me wonder if I buy a gun at Scheels am I violating the law by walking out to my car?

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