NY CCW - One bad apple...

NY CCW - One bad apple...

This is a discussion on NY CCW - One bad apple... within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; No pun intended...not referring to NYC...but here is an article I came across earlier today: Violent Fights In Armory Square Leave Two Men Hospitalized Last ...

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Thread: NY CCW - One bad apple...

  1. #1
    VIP Member Array SIGguy229's Avatar
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    NY CCW - One bad apple...

    No pun intended...not referring to NYC...but here is an article I came across earlier today:

    Violent Fights In Armory Square Leave Two Men HospitalizedLast Update: 8/25/2006 10:45:57 PM

    Syracuse (WSYR-TV) - Syracuse Police are investigating two violent fights that happened early Friday morning in Armory Square. The fights, which were not related, left two men badly injured.

    The first fight happened at around 1:00AM outside PJ Dorsey's on Walton Street. Syracuse Police say 37-year-old Tim Massett of Bear Road, pictured here, was arguing with 22-year-old Vincent Desiderio of Hoeffler Street. The argument started inside Nick's Tomato Pie pizza shop and then moved outside in front of PJ Dorsey's bar/restaurant. The fight escalated and police say Massett shot Desiderio in the stomach.

    Massett was a victim of crime downtown about a year and a half ago. He was stabbed after a Party in the Plaza event, and Syracuse Police say that is likely why Massett got a pistol permit and was carrying the weapon. Massett's license has been revoked.

    Here's the link to the story: http://www.9wsyr.com/news/local/stor...8-589714026523


  2. #2
    Member Array Spectre's Avatar
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    If you're downtown at 1 in the morning, you are exposing your self to the risk of running into violent drunks looking for a fight. He should never have been there with his carry weapon. Sounds like he was looking for revenge, and found someone to take the brunt.

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    VIP Member Array Old Chief's Avatar
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    It appears that one should be home in bed at one am in the morning. This just might be the solution to the problem.
    One should never confuse good fortune with good training.
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    In God we trust.

  4. #4
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    So much better to avoid trouble - and that time of day, and the place I assume it is - bad juju.
    Chris - P95
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    DUMB...

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  6. #6
    Member Array jamz's Avatar
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    You can never tell where life will bring you. Sure, 99 out of 100 nights I am asleep, but you can find yourself helping out a friend in a city, late at night... and I would not be one to leave my weapon home in that situation.

  7. #7
    Member Array PolarBear's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jamz View Post
    You can never tell where life will bring you. Sure, 99 out of 100 nights I am asleep, but you can find yourself helping out a friend in a city, late at night... and I would not be one to leave my weapon home in that situation.
    2nd

    You could get into a situation like this at 2pm on Sunday outside your church. I do agree that avoidance is the best policy, but sometimes it is not that simple.

    The Brady Bunch will twist every encounter and make the gun owner look bad. We should try not to do the same unless we know all the facts. In this situation, he could be completely at fault, but we can hope he was not. The fight started inside the pizza shop then the shooting happened outside. The article said the two people did not know each other.
    Before we start assuming the shooter was wrong, look at it like this: It could have been the shooter went out to pick up a late night pizza and got into an altercation. He then tried to leave and was cornered and attacked outside at his car as he was trying to leave.
    It happened in NY and we all know how the gun laws are in NY state, so just because his permit was revoked does not make him wrong in this situation.
    Last edited by PolarBear; August 28th, 2006 at 06:08 PM.
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    Senior Member Array BlueLion's Avatar
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    Now days if you are out past 11:00 PM and you are not with your family or working, its a good chance you are in the wrong place.
    Listen, Think and React.....Nuff Said.....

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    Distinguished Member Array AKsrule's Avatar
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    Yep , there's always more than one side to the Story ....

    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14520600/
    ==========================
    WTVH-TV
    August 25, 2006
    Syracuse, NY - Police arrest and charge one suspect with shooting a man outside a bar in Syracuse's Armory Square.

    Thursday night was a busy one for Syracuse Police who responded to several cases of violence throughout the city. In Armory Square, a man was shot in front of a crowd on Walton Street.At approximately 1:15 am, an ongoing dispute between a few individuals outside P.J. Dorsey's Bar on Walton Street resulted in one person being shot. Witnesses say prior to the shooting, the suspect's sister used pepper spray on the victim. The suspect, 37 year-old Timothy Massett of North Syracuse, then pulled out a handgun and shot him...an off duty police officer responded.Massett is charged with first degree assault. The victim, 22 year-old Vincent Desiderio is in serious but stable condition at University Hospital. Police say they don't believe the two knew each other. Massett had a valid permit for the handgun.
    =====================

    Good Riddance.
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  10. #10
    Member Array PolarBear's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlueLion View Post
    Now days if you are out past 11:00 PM and you are not with your family or working, its a good chance you are in the wrong place.
    Yes MOST people out at that time that are " not with their family or working" are "up to no good", but NOT everyone. I work nights, so to me 1am is like 3pm. I frequent a lot of places that are open 24 hours. If there were a pizza shop open till 1am around here, I am sure I would be a frequent customer. So just because you are out late does not mean you are "up to no good".

    The way I look at it, being out late gives me the advantage and decreases my risk. I actually feel better prepared and can retain more control over my surroundings late at night. This has a lot to do situational awareness and also with what is "socially acceptable behavior".

    Consider this:
    If someone asked a passer-by during the day for directions or the time, and that passer-by became defensive and told them to "get back" it may seem strange, but if the same thing happened at night and it is perfectly acceptable.

    Also, avoiding the passer-by during at night is much easier to do than during the day, because at night there are a lot less people around. Also statistically the people that are out at night are more likely "up to no good". I feel that these two things give me a huge advantage verses being out during the day. As long as I keep these 2 things in mind, I am able to stay in a constant "condition orange" and treat everyone as hostile. If I tried to remain in a constant "condition orange" and treat everyone as hostile during the day, I would likely go insane and have to join the "tin foil hat" society.
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  11. #11
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    Without knowing all the facts, it would not be smart to pre judge someone. After all, how bad of citizen is he , if he bothered to get a CCW permit in the first place?
    While he may have used bad judgement being there, no need to crucify the guy. Thats what the news media is for.
    "In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." Thomas Jefferson


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    VIP Member Array paramedic70002's Avatar
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    Nice to know that if you actually make use of your permit, then it gets revoked. Maybe it should bear the disclaimer, "Good for one shot only."
    "Each worker carried his sword strapped to his side." Nehemiah 4:18

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  13. #13
    Member Array MarkM's Avatar
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    Like anything in the media I am sure we are not hearing the whole story (good or bad) and although the shooter seems to have been very stupid I will withhold judgement of him or his actions.
    First rule of a gunfight: Carry a gun

  14. #14
    New Member Array blackguns's Avatar
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    Well if his sister pepper sprayed the "victim" before he got shot I guess the guy kept coming huh?

    The NYS laws on self defense are a little scketchy. If you shoot in self defense but you started the fight it's not a good shoot.

    If you are engaged in a fight, and decide that it's not working out and try to walk away you are obligated to communicate your intentions to disengage. If and only if you communicate that you are disengaging and the attacker is using potentially deadly force can you use deadly force to stop an attacker.

    So if you stop and tell the guy you're stopping and he still tries to hit you with that tire iron, then you can use deadly force. You probably should attempt to put distance between you and the attacker as well.

    If you just get jumped out of nowhere and have a reasonable expectation that the attacker is about to use deadly force there are no obligations to warn or "communicate"

    Alot of other things could be going on. I mean if the shooter was drinking, didn't retreat, started the altercation....etc....

    Honestly, when I carry I am one of the more humble people around. I walk around with the power to easily take a human life, that means that no pride, male ego, testosterone or temper is going to push me into a confrontation. You can walk all over my pride or ego, it doesn't mean a thing compared to human life. I will walk/run away as long as I/we can physically do it.

    I PROTECT myself and my loved ones. That's it.

    Alcohol prevents you from thinking in this manner and tends to revert the male brain to "neanderthal" level. Therefore you never drink and carry.

  15. #15
    Member Array Discu Stu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spectre View Post
    If you're downtown at 1 in the morning, you are exposing your self to the risk of running into violent drunks looking for a fight. He should never have been there with his carry weapon.
    As long as he hasn't been drinking, he should be anywhere he wants with his carry weapon

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